NEWS FLASH! - MRC out with new Prodigy Express

[tstage]

Go, Dave! [:)]

Tom

[davekelly]

QUOTE: Originally posted by grande man

QUOTE: Originally posted by davekelly
Of course I do believe that no matter which one I do pick, it will be much more fun than DC cab control!

Dave, you will be a true believer shortly...[:)]

You got that right!! Gotta get a job first! But soon as I do . . . gonna reread all of Randy's posts and have a long phone conversation with Tonys!

[grandeman]

QUOTE: Originally posted by davekelly
Of course I do believe that no matter which one I do pick, it will be much more fun than DC cab control!

Dave, you will be a true believer shortly...[:)]

[Anonymous]

Randy-

I agree with your points completely. It comes to the point where one can totally over-engineer everything to the point that you just wasted a whole bunch of money :).

I was talking to my dad today about this whole thing, as we have been talking about selling the zephyr and getting the Super Chief, "upgrading" the power and getting a DT-400 at the same time, or just getting a DT-400. We both got a good chuckle out of the idea of either one of us trying to run more than one loco at a time. We figured that with a loco on a continuous loop and each of us running another loco, we'd be at 3 locos, and even if they were all consists of 2 locos, that'd be 6, so lets just get a DT-400...and save the money for gas, for trips to the LHS :)

[Anonymous]

I have the original Prodigy and regularly run 3 (N Scale)trains at the same time. One on the outer loop, one on the inner loop and one switching the yard. I forget off hand what the power rating of the original is, but I have no trouble running three trains (locomotives).

[davekelly]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rrinker

It's kinda like how peopel are getting the idea that they NEED 500hp in their pickup truck even though the heaviest thing they ever haul around is a couple of sheets of plywood.

Tim Taylor (Home Improvement) would disagree with that. Perhaps 1000 hp would be good. [:D][:D][:D]

Seriously. You raise a very good point Randy. In many ways we seem to think we need much more than is necessary. Or perhaps we are confusing "want" and "need." This, of course, is not limited to our hobby. PC's, cell phones, satellite/cable TV, mp3 players etc all work on this part of human nature. I have a pretty base line cell phone - it has an address book that can hold 500 contacts. Some pricier models have a 2500 entry address book. I would love to know who has even half of this occupied. If 12 movie channels are good, 50 must be better. MP3 players that can hold 1200 songs. Are there even 1200 songs that I like?

Dave

[rrinker]

That is correct, it would be different power districts. But just how much power do you need in one section of the layout? It's kinda like how peopel are getting the idea that they NEED 500hp in their pickup truck even though the heaviest thing they ever haul around is a couple of sheets of plywood. I've had 8 locos running at once with my Zephyr - today's better wuality HO locos from Stewart, Atlas, Kato, P2K, etc only draw about .5 amp tops, my one Stewart when running freely draws only .1 amp! Obviously a large layout with a dozen operators is going to need a lot of capacity, but then a 'starter' set isn't really intended for such users anyway.
If you know up front you will need lots of power and more than a 12 loco capacity, by all means get the Super Chief - I would not recommend ANYONE buy a Super Empire Builder, I've said a dozen times at least Digitrax needs to stop selling that. The lack of a dedicated programming track and no CV readback is a HUGE liability, especially when it comes to making things easy.
And my other pet "not enough power" peeve: "OMG, my booster is 5 amps, and the Tortoise contacts can only handle 1 amp, I need relays to power my frogs" So, just how many locomotives can fit on your switch frogs anyway?

--Randy

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rrinker

Exactly - if you never need to run more than 10 or 12 locos at the same time, it would be better to just buy a Super Empire Buiulder and add it tot eh Zephyr, keeping the Zephyr as the command station. Then you'd have 7.5 total amps of power, and a second throttle. If you already have the extra throttles, just as a DB150 booster, much cheaper than buying a Super Chief set. This is the beauty of Digitrax's system, you don;t need to throw out or sell off old equipment as you expand, it's all useable.

--Randy

My understanding of adding onto the Zephyr is as follows:

1) If you add a booster/power supply, it will actually be in it's own power district, i.e. you need to gap the rails. The loco's function without any hiccups between the two power disctricts b/c the booster and the zephyr are connected via loconet, even though the power districts are separate. Also, you would have 7.5 amps of power (if you added Empire Builder), but never 7.5 amps on a single section of track - one district would have 2.5 and the other 5...

2) If adding just a 5 amp booster, I suppose the Empire Builder would be the way to go. But, if buying a new 5 amp starter system, the Super Chief would be the way to go, as the Super Chief's booster has all of the funcitonality of the Zephyrs, including the separate programming track funcitonality.

3) I think it ends up being about $50 cheaper or so to buy the Empire Builder set if you wanted to "upgrade" your power plus get another throttle (DT-400 , which is a real nice throttle).

Believe me, I've been tossing around what to do for quite some time... And at this point, I'm just going to get a DT-400 throttle and not upgrade my power until/unless the new layout addition requires me to do so.

[knewsom]

I have the MRC 8 amp booster, and it is compatible with the Prodigy Advance. It also claims to be compatible with all other systems as well. I got mine for $96 from Micro-Mark and have been using if for 6 months or so with no problems.

[rrinker]

Exactly - if you never need to run more than 10 or 12 locos at the same time, it would be better to just buy a Super Empire Buiulder and add it tot eh Zephyr, keeping the Zephyr as the command station. Then you'd have 7.5 total amps of power, and a second throttle. If you already have the extra throttles, just as a DB150 booster, much cheaper than buying a Super Chief set. This is the beauty of Digitrax's system, you don;t need to throw out or sell off old equipment as you expand, it's all useable.

--Randy

[tstage]

Pete,

Can't you just add a booster to your Zephyr for 1/2 the cost of new Super Chief?

Tom

[Anonymous]

I saw some posts with guys saying they wanted to run at least 3 trains at a time. Not sure whether or not the MRC unit will do this, if one considers the following:

Are you going to run any locos in consists? That is still technically one train, but will, in reality, take the power of how ever many loco's are in the consist that have engines in them.

Are any of the loco's going to have sound decoders installed? I don't know how much, but I am sure that sound equipped locos use more power.

I'm not bashing MRC here, just trying to help people make the best decision possible for their own needs, but properly take power consumption into account. I made the mistake myself - We're equipping all of our loco's with sound, and we have a Zephyr system. I think I'll only be able to run 3, maybe 4 locos at a time if they all have sound. Fortunately, 3 or 4 is all we'll be able to physically handle, anyway, so the Zephyr shouldn't be a problem, but it still concerns me. If I want to upgrade, it'll cost me $300 to get the Super Chief components to boost up the power. Which then means I should sell the Zephyr, as I really don't need it anymore... But the kids like the old-style throttle it has... It gets confusing :)

Anyway, if I had to do it over again, I would probably have started with the Super Chief. That's getting off topic a bit, sorry.

I see advertisements that MRC has the 8 AMP booster. How much does that cost, and is it compat with their new Express system? If so, and the 8 amp booster is relatively inexpensive, the MRC Express may be a good starter set for someone.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by peterjenkinson1956
<snip> i want a system that i can use easily and be able to get parts in 10 years time will mrc do this for me... peter

Peter,
I see that you are in Australia. I think the main consideration for you is what is currently available to you at this time. If MRC products are more easily obtained in your area than the products of their competitors, then I would suggest going with MRC. If Digitrax is easily obtained, then look there. If a particular brand is not easily obtained in your area, then I would recommend that you stay away from that brand. With the popularity of both MRC and Digitrax in the US, I would easily recommend either of those brands here, but I can't say how popular they are down there. I just thought I'd throw this in for your consideration.
-Joe

[grandeman]

I've said it before, but here it goes again. My main problem with MRC is the lack of backwards compatibility. In the last few years we've had them introduce three DCC systems, none of which are compatible with any of the others! Basically, there are only a few companies that specialize in DCC. In North America, Digitrax and NCE are the major players. All they do is DCC. They don't fool around ticking their customers off with compatibility issues and are serious about product support. They also typically offer the most advanced features. I'm sure the MRC Prodigy Advance/Express are good systems. I looked seriously at them before we bought a Digitrax Super Chief. The bottom line though, in my instance, is that Digitrax was worth more money. The rest is history. Two years from now, if Digitrax comes out with a new, must have component, it'll be plug and play with our DCS100. I like that.

[tstage]

ereimer,

My guess is that Digitrax and CVP will probably do a good job of the above. But, you are right. Anything computer or electronic related seems to be outdated or outmoded at a quicker pace then just about anything else we manufacture.

Tom

[ereimer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by peterjenkinson1956

1.6 amps vs 2.5 amps ... computerinterface ... all i want is a very simple system that i can run 3 x trains with 3 x locos on each train ... a switching loco and have all the locos run the same speed... price no issue.. $120 or $220 no diference to me HOWEVER i want a system that i can use easily and be able to get parts in 10 years time will mrc do this for me... peter

i think given those requirements the Prodigy Advance will be great . i suggest the PA rather than the Prodigy Express since i don't know yet if it is possible to add more throttles to the PE .

there is no guarantee that you will be able to get parts for any DCC system in 10 years . the good news is that almost any DCC decoder (the part that goes in the engine) will work with any DCC system . things like the throttles and base units are specific to each manufacturer , if the one you pick goes out of business you'll be out of luck to get those parts

[peterjenkinson1956]

1.6 amps vs 2.5 amps ... computerinterface ... all i want is a very simple system that i can run 3 x trains with 3 x locos on each train ... a switching loco and have all the locos run the same speed... price no issue.. $120 or $220 no diference to me HOWEVER i want a system that i can use easily and be able to get parts in 10 years time will mrc do this for me... peter

[skiloff]

Oh, sorry to get off topic.

[skiloff]

I already have the power packs, too. I've got a Tech II 2500 and two cheap ones (Bachmann and Model Power). The DPDT switches would be a bargain by comparison. I've done a cost sheet for everything I need to get running in DCC with all the track, engines and decoders, but there is no way I'm going to show it to her or I'd be shut down tomorrow. Somehow, $50 here, $75 there is easier to slip by than saying $1400 total cost. I still think when things start to take shape, she will be more than interested in helping out (she is the artistic one, I'm the math whiz).

Besides, we went to a hobby shop a couple months back to get some N scale Unitrack for the new layout, so I took my (choke) HO scale P2K diesel in as trade bait and she found some N scale Athearn Overton passenger cars that would work very nicely with her Kato steamer she picked up at a swap meet 10 years ago (cause she thought it was cute). I didn't really want to buy them, I wanted some track, but when I saw that look in her eyes, I knew this was going to further her interest, so thats what we did. She can deny all she wants, but she does like the trains - just not as much as my son and I. Oh, and my daughter now wants her own engine!

[davekelly]

skiloff,

I feel your pain! Of course, here's an idea. Take wife to the LHS or show her the Walthers catalog. What is the price (MSRP of course) of two good quality MRC Tech 4 packs. Then go to Radio Shack and show her the price of about 10 DPDT switches. Then go to Tony's site and show her the cost of, let's say the Zepher and two decoders. The total cost would be pretty close I'm thinking.

I'd use this idea myself, but with 4 MRC packs in the closet and a drawer full of various switches, it won't work for me. [:(][:(]

Dave

Besides, it's for your son!

[skiloff]

I'm in the same boat, davekelly. I can't afford an expensive system, but I do want room for expansion and looking at the various options, its tough. My son wants to run two engines at the same time (which I could do if I wired in a simple block system), but making the leap to DCC would make things so much easier. Except my wife would have some things to say about the cost side...

[tstage]

QUOTE: Originally posted by davekelly
So much fun!! Of course I do believe that no matter which one I do pick, it will be much more fun than DC cab control!

You got that right, Dave! [^]

Tom

[davekelly]

petejung,

I had to laugh at your post as I am going through the same thing! Hey, this one is good, but that one has this for $5.00 more, but the other one has that, and it's only $25.00 more than the second, but it doesn't have the thing that the first one has, but wait, the fourth one has . . . . . . .

So much fun!! Of course I do believe that no matter which one I do pick, it will be much more fun than DC cab control!

[Anonymous]

1.6 amps? I would still prefer the Zephyr, higher power, for only $20 more. The walk around throttle is would be nice, to have, though.

[davekelly]

Randy,

I agree re: MRC's position in the DC world. I have a 20 year old MRC that still works great. I hope they're on track to gain the same reputation in the DCC world.

Dave

[rrinker]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Javern

I wasn't reflecting towards any particular post when I made my above comment. I would hope everyone would be open to new MRC products and discuss them pro/con and not just base MRC on past items that didn't meet your expectations.

Actually, except for their earlier attempts at DCC, MRC has always met or exceeded my expectations. They still make the best DC packs around.
I'll keep quiet about Bachmann locomotives [:D]

--Randy

[rrinker]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Josh_A

Im a DCC noob, but 1.6 A should be enough to run three N scale engines right?
(A bachman 0-6-0, a LifeLike 2-8-8-2 Mallet, and most likely a miniTrix 4-6-2 Pacific). I have no plans to add more engines, those three are already probably overkill.

Should be. My 2.5 amp Zephyr has run 8 HO locos, so 3 N scale locos on more than half that should be no problem.

--Randy

[davekelly]

Javern,

That's what I thought. Sorry that I kinda spoke for you above.

Dave

[Javern]

I wasn't reflecting towards any particular post when I made my above comment. I would hope everyone would be open to new MRC products and discuss them pro/con and not just base MRC on past items that didn't meet your expectations.