Its good to see the progress. And the shallow profile ceiling system shows off well.
- Douglas
It's good to see the progress that you've already made in building your new layout, Sheldon, and I'm very-much looking forward to following along as you continue to develop it.
Cheers,
Wayne
Here are a few pictures of the progress in setting up the work bench area and the staging yard benchwork.
The bechwork along the wall is the 10 track stub end staging yard.
Paint booth and new duct work system in the works.
Five decades of MR on this shelf.
Boxing in the steel beams nearly complete, plumbing covers soon.
I am bumping this based on a request from a reader who could not find it.
And I have an update regarding my lighting.
After some research I havedecided to dim and control the lighting in the layout room using the X10 home automation products.
I have a long career experiance with the X10 system and wasa big user of it at my previous home. While a very old technology, X10 has recently updated their products to be LED compatible, and their dimmers will handle 600 watts of LED lighting.
Additionally, because it is a home automation system, multiple dimmers can be programed to work simultaneously, and they can be operated by a hand held remote.
This will allow three dimmers to control the whole layout, one dimmer for aisle lighting and two for layout lighting. And again the two for the layout can be operated together. Each dimmer will only be loaded to about 2/3rds of its rating.
The dimmers and nearly 2/3rd of the lights are installed now, and I will post some pictures soon.
Sheldon
Well, a very busy work schedule, and lots of family stuff with grandchildren, have kept me busy.
But there is progress, more photos soon.
ATLANTIC CENTRALI guess some would not like where we live, no curbs, no sidewalks, no public water or sewer serivce. No HOA, so no busybody rules, friendly like minded people who look out for each other but don't get in your business.
Sounds like heaven to me, we will all have our chain saws out and the road clear after a storm, long before the city shows up.
I will be following your build with interest Sheldon as I know I will learn a lot and get some good ideas. This thread and Daves Snow plow thread are the first stops with the morning coffee.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
rrebell ATLANTIC CENTRAL mobilman44 Wow, I think many of us are really looking forward to your work! IMO, you are the exception - having the knowledge, experience, skills, space, and bucks - and be able to put it all together and build a layout. One question...Do you have a place to put everything during construction? BEST WISHES !!! Everything as in all the stuff you see in the pictures? Yes and no. Some of it is on its way out of the space. Much of it is the trains. The other half of the space will provide enough room to juggle some of what must remain. And the layout will provide lots of storage space below as it progresses. Four years ago we moved from a 4000 sq Victorian house (not counting its 1350 sq ft basement) that also had a 2200 sq ft two story detached garage/workshop/train room into this 2400 sq ft rancher with a 1500 sq ft basement and a simple two car garage. We got rid of a lot of stuff before we moved, and have continued to go through stuff and downsize our "things". There is also a medium range plan for a detached garage/workshop - but I am simply not waiting any longer to get the layout started. It is an incentive to get rid of things we don't need. Even right now, I can easily move a few things and have 1/3 of the space completely empty for benchwork. Sheldon So do you miss your old house, sometime we do with the 10' coved ceiling heights, marble mantel, marketry floors and a very large stained glass window in the entry. Not to mention the marble floor in the bathroom with a 6' long sunken cast iron tub.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL mobilman44 Wow, I think many of us are really looking forward to your work! IMO, you are the exception - having the knowledge, experience, skills, space, and bucks - and be able to put it all together and build a layout. One question...Do you have a place to put everything during construction? BEST WISHES !!! Everything as in all the stuff you see in the pictures? Yes and no. Some of it is on its way out of the space. Much of it is the trains. The other half of the space will provide enough room to juggle some of what must remain. And the layout will provide lots of storage space below as it progresses. Four years ago we moved from a 4000 sq Victorian house (not counting its 1350 sq ft basement) that also had a 2200 sq ft two story detached garage/workshop/train room into this 2400 sq ft rancher with a 1500 sq ft basement and a simple two car garage. We got rid of a lot of stuff before we moved, and have continued to go through stuff and downsize our "things". There is also a medium range plan for a detached garage/workshop - but I am simply not waiting any longer to get the layout started. It is an incentive to get rid of things we don't need. Even right now, I can easily move a few things and have 1/3 of the space completely empty for benchwork. Sheldon
mobilman44 Wow, I think many of us are really looking forward to your work! IMO, you are the exception - having the knowledge, experience, skills, space, and bucks - and be able to put it all together and build a layout. One question...Do you have a place to put everything during construction? BEST WISHES !!!
Wow, I think many of us are really looking forward to your work!
IMO, you are the exception - having the knowledge, experience, skills, space, and bucks - and be able to put it all together and build a layout.
One question...Do you have a place to put everything during construction?
BEST WISHES !!!
Everything as in all the stuff you see in the pictures? Yes and no. Some of it is on its way out of the space. Much of it is the trains. The other half of the space will provide enough room to juggle some of what must remain. And the layout will provide lots of storage space below as it progresses.
Four years ago we moved from a 4000 sq Victorian house (not counting its 1350 sq ft basement) that also had a 2200 sq ft two story detached garage/workshop/train room into this 2400 sq ft rancher with a 1500 sq ft basement and a simple two car garage. We got rid of a lot of stuff before we moved, and have continued to go through stuff and downsize our "things".
There is also a medium range plan for a detached garage/workshop - but I am simply not waiting any longer to get the layout started. It is an incentive to get rid of things we don't need.
Even right now, I can easily move a few things and have 1/3 of the space completely empty for benchwork.
So do you miss your old house, sometime we do with the 10' coved ceiling heights, marble mantel, marketry floors and a very large stained glass window in the entry. Not to mention the marble floor in the bathroom with a 6' long sunken cast iron tub.
No, not really. Maybe I miss the garage, I plan to build another one soon enough.
If you want the full tour of the old house, here is a link:
https://app.photobucket.com/u/carrollhome/a/bfdbd701-abf4-4d5f-bb20-786bbc5599c9
That house was the adventure of a lifetime, I would not trade one minute of the memories of that adventure for anything. It was an honor and priviledge to restore it, be its steward, and enjoy its pleasures for 25 years. But life moves on and things change.
Looking back, the layout I had at the old house was a compromise to that situation. The basement was not layout friendly, so the layout was in a second floor room over the garage. The garage was 32' x 40', the upstairs was 25' x 40'.
Taking materials up there was a lot of work, work I am happy to not be doing a second time.
That room was 1000 sq ft. The layout space here is 1500 sq ft.
This house requires a lot less care, giving more and more time for trains and other hobbies as I shift into semi retirement.
This house was move in ready for the most part, with only four small to medium "projects" we wanted to do, did not have to do. The biggest of which is complete.
The yard here is bigger, but the landscaping is MUCH simpler, so there is less yard work. And I have the best tool in the world for that, seen here in fall cleanup mode for the leaves:
This a well built brick rancher with plaster walls, solid wood doors, hardwood floors, in one of the most desireable neighborhoods around here. We have 2.3 acres. There is little traffic on our little street.
The old house was in moderately busy little village on a state highway, not real busy when we bought it in 1995, pretty busy road today.
I guess some would not like where we live, no curbs, no sidewalks, no public water or sewer serivce. No HOA, so no busybody rules, friendly like minded people who look out for each other but don't get in your business.
Yet we are 8 minutes from downtown Havre de Grace, MD, a historic town at the mouth of the Susquehanna River where it enters the Chesapeake Bay. If you like dining and culture, Havre De Grace is your spot, festivals and activities every weekend, waterfront parks and promanade.
And it is a great place for my business of restoring old houses like this one I did a few years ago:
Not that I am much of a modern railfan, but the AMTRAK and CSX mainlines go right thru the town.
And it is only a 45 minute drive to Strasburg PA......
Miss the old house, like I said, not really. And if I want to drive by and reminisce, the old house is only 20 minutes away.
With some luck I will make some layout progress today.
Looking forward to seeing more of your progress. John
Hi Sheldon,
I am looking forward to following your progress.
Cheers!!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
ROBERT PETRICK Hey Sheldon- I'm glad to see that things are moving along. Good luck. Robert
Hey Sheldon-
I'm glad to see that things are moving along.
Good luck.
Robert
Thank you again for your help, more progress soon if things stay on track.
Tin Can II Looking forward to seeing the progress you make on your build. I have a similar sized basement, although it is already finished. The lighting leaves much to be desired. We have placed those flush LED lights in several rooms upstairs as part of our remodel, hope to be able to do something similar in the train room. I have a similar plan to store stuff under the layout in clear plastic tubs.
Looking forward to seeing the progress you make on your build.
I have a similar sized basement, although it is already finished. The lighting leaves much to be desired. We have placed those flush LED lights in several rooms upstairs as part of our remodel, hope to be able to do something similar in the train room.
I have a similar plan to store stuff under the layout in clear plastic tubs.
Yes, we love the plastic tubs....
LINK to SNSR Blog
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
Track fiddler Still droped them down 2 3/4" for 7 foot drop ceilings in Minneapolis though. The only problem is if you ever have a problem from above anywhere in the room, you need to access it and make it go away like it never happened. Grid to rafter systems can be dismantled from the outside of the wall but make it that much more difficult, than cut out drywall repair. The Saving Grace could be (IF) something ever happens though. TF
Still droped them down 2 3/4" for 7 foot drop ceilings in Minneapolis though.
The only problem is if you ever have a problem from above anywhere in the room, you need to access it and make it go away like it never happened.
Grid to rafter systems can be dismantled from the outside of the wall but make it that much more difficult, than cut out drywall repair.
The Saving Grace could be (IF) something ever happens though.
TF
You are mistaken there. This system can be disassembed anywhere in the field. I have already had to do it while installing it.
Simply find a joint in a runner, use a small pick/screwdriver to unlock and pull down the lower tee, the tiles come right out. You may have to take a little more area than you need for access, but it is easy enough and goes right back together.
You might want to learn more before you judge:
https://www.ceilinglink.com/
I don't really care for the look of drop ceilings, but on the other hand I would never buy a house with drywall ceilings in a basement.
Still droped them down 2 3/4" for 7 foot drop ceilings in Minneapolis.
The only problem is if you ever have a problem from above anywhere in the room. You need to access it and make it go away like it never happened.
Grid to rafter systems can be dismantled from the outside corner of the room but make it that much more difficult than cut out drywall for repair.
The Saving Grace could be (IF) something never happens.
Must be trick photography, that ceiling is only 6'-11" high. That's why a zero clearance system was so important.
A good answer.
Flipping homes in MPLS for over 25 years I learned 2 3/4 inches was the safest bet for a drop ceiling. There were lots of soffits with that.
I tried one of those ceilings at a 2 1/2" drop one time and that extra quarter inch less gave us nothing but problems. Accessing a problem in the ceiling in the middle of the room is another story as well.
My partner and I considered residential flips as commercial finding the fastest way to polish a diamond in the rough.
It appears you have 9-foot ceilings down there and if not you wanted to keep them looking that way with your head-room rather tight.
Looks good to me Sheldon as I see you achieved your objective I will also say, I bet you'll never do one of those again
Track fiddler No residential drop ceiling customers on my 35 year watch either, only commercial is why I stated I only fiddled with two of those. I just wanted to see what you thought after using it on your own home. I was just curious to see what you thought about that system. TF
No residential drop ceiling customers on my 35 year watch either, only commercial is why I stated I only fiddled with two of those.
I just wanted to see what you thought after using it on your own home. I was just curious to see what you thought about that system.
OK, like I said somewhere above, it has a learning curve, but I would use it again. Planning is a little different than regular drop ceilings. It is very versital, and I really like the the fact that the top channel and the bottom channel are the same part - unlike the other two systems on the market.
Important point - it is much more forgiving than you first think, more forgiving in many ways than regular drop ceilings.
Track fiddler Sheldon. Respectfully asking...Have you figured out where your going to put all that other good stuff to make room for a productive work environment down there? TF
Sheldon.
Respectfully asking...Have you figured out where your going to put all that other good stuff to make room for a productive work environment down there?
Well, half of the stuff you see is the trains, most of the rest is working its way up and out, what remains will eventually be stored under the layout.
There is a plan to build a detached garage, but given a lot of factors, I am actually saving that prolect for last around here - I can make do just fine.
In the area that is completed, the ceiling work and wiring was done in about 10 hours, with all stuff right where it is.
Track fiddler Did two of those plastic channel hug the rafters ceilings Sheldon. The bigger one was easier. It's when you get into a small room and the young carpenters that built the structure didn't crown the rafters all the same way that made things really difficult for the later guy. Shims were needed on that 2' on center runner. That last corner ceiling tile was a bit of a challenge to figure out to finish the room until you did the second ceiling. Your basement is looking really nice though and it's good to see you start TF
Did two of those plastic channel hug the rafters ceilings Sheldon.
The bigger one was easier. It's when you get into a small room and the young carpenters that built the structure didn't crown the rafters all the same way that made things really difficult for the later guy.
Shims were needed on that 2' on center runner. That last corner ceiling tile was a bit of a challenge to figure out to finish the room until you did the second ceiling.
Your basement is looking really nice though and it's good to see you start
Not sure I understand if you are asking a question? This system atttaches directly to the joists and then snaps together.
I did not worry about all the joists being perfectly in the same plan - and once it is done it is not noticable if there are minor ups and downs - just look at the pictures.
After considering a number of factors, I started in the middle of each area, as you can see from the area not yet finished. I am only using L channel on the outer walls, not near the steel beams. I will post the details of that construction when I get some of it up.
I also experimented with multiple ways to layout and mark where the tracks go, then I realized with each area only being about 12' wide, and starting in the middle, I only needed to get the first one straight....... Then I used that as a guide for fixed measuring stick to mark the next row, and so on out to each side.
I never used this product before doing this project, I don't do commercial work and most of my customers are not the drop ceiling type.....
Rich, I don't have the numbers in my memory or close at hand, but I used a lumen formula based on kitchens and work spaces, knowing I could dim them from there.
I have good vision for my age (reading glasses only), but I'm not so good (or happy) doing things in dim light any more.
rws1225 I used the same ceiling system in my now 70 year old house's low basement. I used different light fixtures and I wish the ones you are using were available 15 plus years ago.
I used the same ceiling system in my now 70 year old house's low basement. I used different light fixtures and I wish the ones you are using were available 15 plus years ago.
This house is almost 60 years old. We just moved here 4 years ago from one that is now 121 years old - where we had been for 24 years after completely restoring it.
The basement there was completely unacceptable for a model train layout - my last layout was above my detached garage/workshop.
That was a 1000 sq ft room. I now have a bigger yard, smaller house, and a bigger layout space.
The bigger ones were easier. It's when one got into a smaller room and the young carpenters that built the structure didn't crown the rafters all the same way that made things really difficult for the later guy.
Shims were needed on that 2' on center runner. That last corner ceiling tile was a bit of a challenge to figure out to finish the room until completing the second ceiling.
York1 Sheldon, thanks for all the photos, and I'm looking forward to more showing your progress. I also used this ceiling system. My basement ceiling height is 7'6", which isn't really too low, but I wanted as much clearance as I could get. I saw this system at a Menards when I was looking at suspended ceilings, and I decided to give it a try. The only issue I had was some difficulty getting the panels into the last row, but after several tries, I figured it out. I lost only one inch of room height. As has been mentioned, I wish those lights had been available when I did the work. I had to put in regular can lights, so there was some planning to make sure each light ended up in a space between the joists. Thanks!
Sheldon, thanks for all the photos, and I'm looking forward to more showing your progress.
I also used this ceiling system. My basement ceiling height is 7'6", which isn't really too low, but I wanted as much clearance as I could get.
I saw this system at a Menards when I was looking at suspended ceilings, and I decided to give it a try.
The only issue I had was some difficulty getting the panels into the last row, but after several tries, I figured it out. I lost only one inch of room height.
As has been mentioned, I wish those lights had been available when I did the work. I had to put in regular can lights, so there was some planning to make sure each light ended up in a space between the joists.
Thanks!
Yes there is a learning curve to installing the panels.
None of the retail stores in this region carry this or any of the competing systems, I bought mine direct. Glad I did, everything negative the "other " company said about this product was a lie Ceilinglink is a simple and well designed product - those others are needlessly complex.
Yes, we have been installing these kinds of lights in our work for a few years now, they finally came down to eearth in price. 4-5 years ago a single light was $28, I bought these for less that $9 each and they have ajustable color index.
York1 John