hon30critterSo now I have to make a choice. Either I mess with the track plan which I am very happy with, or I mess with the Walthers cars to get them to run on 22" if that is possible, or I get rid of the Walthers cars and buy something more reliable.
After studying the plan I realized that I could get 24" radii curves on the outer loop without having to change much, and I would still not have any track that is running right next to the fascia (which I really dislike).
I also recalled that I had attempted to run the Walthers Canadian cars on my old club's portable layout a while ago and three out of eight cars had problems. That was on 32" radii so the odds on getting them to work nicely on 24" curves are pretty low. I will have a look at the three cars that had problems to see if there are any solutions, but quite frankly my current feelings are to just get rid of them and invest in something that will work. I'd rather spend my time on other projects.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
mbinsewiI know NOT to buy Walthers passenger cars.
Hi Mike,
I wish I had known that a couple of years ago when I bought eight Walthers CP passenger cars. I already had a set of Con-Cor cars but the Walthers ones were much better detailed including having interiors, and they were ridiculously cheap. Now maybe I know why!
So now I have to make a choice. Either I mess with the track plan which I am very happy with, or I mess with the Walthers cars to get them to run on 22" if that is possible, or I get rid of the Walthers cars and buy something more reliable.
Hmmmm....
Not sure why Walthers can't get their new stuff to work on smaller curves. Rapido is just better engineered I guess. They have FAR more detail than any Walthers car ever made, yet the trucks do not snag on it. And they don't have any sort of odd geared swivel coupler mount like Bachmann used on some cars (maybe all? I don't do passenger trains). There's a reason Rapido costs a bit more. I almost want one of those diners even though they aren't even close to anything my railroad would run - china and silverware on the tables, and WATER PITCHERS! Not to mention a fully detailed kitchen even though on some cars there aren;t even any windows on the kitchen side so you can't see in there unless you take the shell off!
Please do some standard Reading cars (not special ones like the Crusader set) and I will run a passenger train or two in my schedule.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
I have 24" r., and Walthers 85' passenger cars have problems, but Rapido, Kato, Rivarossi and Bachmann don't. Go figure.
I know NOT to buy Walthers passenger cars.
Mike.
My You Tube
CNCharlieIf I had 5 feet I would have put in 24 inch and try for 26.
Hi CN Charlie,
You have caused me to re-examine my plan to see what it would take to increase the radii. I really want to be able to run the Canadian. Obviously I haven't given that enough thought. The current plan is to make the benchwork 64" wide but that is not set in stone. Even at 64" I can get more than 22" radii fairly easily.
Thanks for the heads up!
Dave,
I have 22 inch max and run Athearn 72 foot heavyweights with talgo trucks .They look ok and run fine. If I had 5 feet I would have put in 24 inch and try for 26.
I tried 85 foot cars and it was a no go. My brass K5 Hudson makes it but only at a slow speed.
I love passenger trains but my layout is too small.
CN Charlie
CNCharlieWhat radius are the curves at the ends?
Hi Charlie,
The curves are all at least 22". I could make them a bit larger but I prefer to have a bit of scenery between the track and the fascia. I will be running mid 50s stuff so most of it will do fine on 22" radii. I do want to run The Canadian but I won't know if the longer passenger cars will work properly until I test them. The first track that I will lay will be the outer loop so I can test run the Canadian before anything else is in place. If it won't work reliably then I will have to expand the radii of the loops. That won't affect the rest of the plan too much. It will just bring everything closer to the fascia.
Hi Dave,
What radius are the curves at the ends?
Interesting thread!
Wait, 8 pin DIP sockets are too wide - so what you want really is more like the 8 pin decoder socket? Those are much narrower as they do not have the whole in the middle (for the standard IC pin spacing).
You can buy NMRA 8 pin sockets in bulk. You can also make them out of what you already have - cut the 8 pin IC socket down the middle and flip the pieces around and glue them together. I may some day come across the decoder tester I built and promptly never used, and then cannibalized parts from, and that's exactly how I made the 8 pin socket to plug the decoder being tested into.
I received the IC sockets today that I intended to use to mount my signals. Unfortunately, once I had them in hand, I realized that they won't work for what I need. The hole in the center of the socket is way too big to mount a signal post without doing a whole lot of additional work. Also, the eight pin configuration doesn't work on the breadboards that I will use to attach the larger diameter wires to the bottom signal mount. So, I have ordered a bunch of six pin sockets which are what I used the first time around for the signals at my old club like the one shown above. The six pin sockets preclude getting a yellow indication on one head of the double headed signals but that is absolutely minor! Prototypical signal indications are years down the road and I might not ever get to that stage anyhow. Fortunately the sockets are pretty cheap, and I now have the raw materials for a lifetime supply of micro connectors!
SeeYou190I bought these old brass signals on eBay. There are nine, so I should have two spares.
Hi Kevin,
I forgot to congratulate you on your signal purchase. They are very interesting and nicely detailed. I'm glad that you managed to get enough of them to meet your needs.
SBXI have a similar problem and cannot work under my railroad. However, I avoid using a soldering iron by using lever nut connectors which come in sigle pole or double pole versions. The single pole can be got with up to 5 connections.
Hi David,
I am familiar with the connectors, although I have never used them. The track feeders will be soldered (old school eh?!?). Since I will have the layout on its side when doing the soldering there won't be any risk of hot solder dropping in my lap. The other connections will be done with terminal strips (more old school). I want to keep the wiring as neat as possible and the terminal strips appeal to me for that reason.
Thanks for the suggestion.
hon30critterThe signals will be used to indicate turnout position, not track occupancy, so they aren't going to be prototypical in any way
Mine will be used exactly the same way. Maybe as the layout gets built I will identify more locations where they are needed.
rrinker S&G is in rare company. Major users of the Type G signal were NYC and Reading
Yes, that is why I was so excited to find them. I am hoping that by using components that are unusual, but still look "right", it will make the layout look absolutely fanciful, yet remain reallistic.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
SBX Tinplate Toddler Dave - I may be wrong, but most of your track is either in the upper part of the layout, or the lower, so most of the wiring will have to be there. I wouldn´t want to handle a hot soldering iron with my hands raised nearly above my head and risk hot solder dripping down on my face. I have a similar problem and cannot work under my railroad. However, I avoid using a soldering iron by using lever nut connectors which come in sigle pole or double pole versions. The single pole can be got with up to 5 connections. Get the from Amazon https://amzn.to/356gf5J
Tinplate Toddler Dave - I may be wrong, but most of your track is either in the upper part of the layout, or the lower, so most of the wiring will have to be there. I wouldn´t want to handle a hot soldering iron with my hands raised nearly above my head and risk hot solder dripping down on my face.
Dave - I may be wrong, but most of your track is either in the upper part of the layout, or the lower, so most of the wiring will have to be there. I wouldn´t want to handle a hot soldering iron with my hands raised nearly above my head and risk hot solder dripping down on my face.
I have a similar problem and cannot work under my railroad. However, I avoid using a soldering iron by using lever nut connectors which come in sigle pole or double pole versions. The single pole can be got with up to 5 connections. Get the from Amazon https://amzn.to/356gf5J
That's why he's putting it on a rotisserie. To flip the bottom side up to do wiring, among other things.
But you think I'd have a completely burned face by now if solder dripping was such a problem, I've been soldering under the layout for more than 40 years. I can't remember ever having hot solder drop onto unprotected skin. The danger level seems greatly exaggerated.
With my vision issues, you should see how I solder circuit boards and decoders and so forth at the bench. My nose is about 3 inches from the tip of the soldering iron. Magnifiers don;t help, the loss of vision is not just correctable focus, and the corresponding loss of depth perception means no matter how much I magnify the work space, if I am in a normal sitting position with my arms on the bench, I will most likely not be able to put the tip on the joint without hitting my finger first. ANd I haven't burned myself with a soldering iron in all the time I've been soldering, and I don't expect to start now. It was getting my finger burned by my Mom soldering for me that made me say enough, I'm old enough to do this myself (I was about 8 or 9).
S&G is in rare company. Major users of the Type G signal were NYC and Reading. And that's about it. Many times they are simply called "NYC signals" and Reading just gets ignored.
Long Haired DavidA.K.A. David Penningtonmain man on the Sunset and North Eastern R.R.http://www.gmrblog.co.ukfrom the UK
SeeYou190I really like your work on the signals. I am surprised you need 25 of them.
Thanks Kevin,
There will be a total of 17 tall signals and five dwarfs. The signals will be used to indicate turnout position, not track occupancy, so they aren't going to be prototypical in any way other than appearance. I'm going to make them all removable using eight pin IC sockets so if things get too busy looking I can simply pull some out.
These are how the sockets will work. The sockets shown are six pin but I'm going to use eight pins so that, if I want to get into more prototypical signaling at some point, I will be able to get RGY colour indications from the double headed signals without having to change the signals. There are two IC sockets. One is attached to the bottom of the signal and the other is soldered to a circuit board which is mounted in the layout.
This is what the finished product will look like, except I'm going to put two platforms on the double headed signals.
I really like your work on the signals.
I am surprised you need 25 of them. I think I will only be using 7 on my layout. I bought these old brass signals on eBay. There are nine, so I should have two spares.
Thanks Mike,
Nice project Dave. I like the way you "assembly line" the signal heads.
Twenty five VERY rough signal heads! Took me about three hours to make them. Polishing them up will probably take about the same time:
I need about 25 searchlight signal heads. I am using #6 brass washers for the targets. They are initially soldered on to 5/32" brass tube. The washers have to be reamed slightly to fit onto the tube. Ideally you want a fairly tight fit so that the washers naturally sit perpendicular to the tube, but if they are a bit loose that's okay.
Here are the washers soldered to the tube:
Here is the reamer that I used to enlargen the washer holes. It is a standard Dremel tool:
Note that the 5/32" tube is too big to use as the light shade so I will insert a 1/8" tube inside it which will be filed into the light shade shape. The 5/32" tube will stick out of the back of the signal head by about 1/8". That will form the prototypical housing for the signal electronics.
I just ordered a bunch more 0606 RG LEDs for the signals. These are not pre-wired. I have about 50 0606 RG pre-wired LEDs but the wires are too large to fit inside the signal posts on a double headed signal. I'm going to get lots more practise soldering magnet wire to tiny LEDs!
More pictures soon.
I have managed to solder leads to six 0606 RD LEDs and I have coated them in epoxy. The epoxy serves three purposes. One is to insulate the wires where the insulation was removed before soldering. The second is to reinforce the wire connections which tend to be very fragile, and the third is to create a lens for the signal light.
Here are the finished LEDs with an unwired one for comparison. The drill bit is 1/16":
They fit very nicely inside the dwarf signal housings.
I spent some time trying to figure out the easiest way to install LEDs in the dwarf signals. I had originally planned on using 1208 tri colour LEDs to get the best colour, but getting the LEDs lined up properly behind the lens is a bit of a challenge. I will probably revert to using smaller RG LEDs to make the job easier.
Update: I found some 0606 RG LEDs that will fit nicely inside the dwarf signals so I'm going with those. I have to solder the four leads on to them. I managed to do the first one quite easily, which amazed me since I haven't soldered leads onto 0606 LEDs for quite some time. I will give part of the credit to my Xytronic soldering station.
Thanks Rich,
Looks real good, Dave.
Rich
Alton Junction
Here is the first attempt at scratchbuilding a dwarf signal:
I still have to create a base and fill in the bottom of the lamp housing.
I primed the Baum Blvd building today using white primer. I'm hoping that the primer will serve as the finished colour for the window frames but I wasn't too impressed with the coverage. The walls are still in the garage drying which will take some time because it was only 6 degrees Celsius outside. I will bring them in before I go to bed. I may have to give them a second coat.
I also started building the searchlight signals. There will be 17 signals with a total of 25 heads, plus five dwarf signals. After looking at the price of dwarf signals I decided to scratchbuild them myself. They won't have the fine details of some of the commercial offerings, but I think I can come up with a reasonable approximation.
Cheers!!
Bayfield Transfer RailwayWhat about something like an artist's easel to hold it, but pick it up and flip it over manually? Seems a lot simpler.
Hi Michael,
The issue is with the 'picking it up' part. My back won't allow me to pick up anything of any weight. Even grocery bags cause pain.
There is also the issue of the size of the layout. It will be 5' 4" x 12'. That is a pretty unwieldy size for one person to handle. At my old club I was working on removable segments of a mountain scene that were roughly 2' x 5' and weighed next to nothing. I still had trouble lifting them because of my back.
A third aspect is that I want to be able to work on the layout while sitting as much as possible since standing without support gets painfull almost immediately. If I flip the layout completely upside down I will still have to stand to reach into the middle. The rotisserie will allow me to turn the layout on to its side so all of the under layout work and much of the up top work can be done from a chair. Some things will require that I stand. That will likely be the case for track laying so I can get the perspective correct, and loose scenery etc will have to be done with the layout flat as well.
The bottom line is that I can't lift anything of any weight and I can't stand for more than a few minutes. The rotisserie addresses those issues, for the most part. There will be some things that I will need help with.
Thanks,
What about something like an artist's easel to hold it, but pick it up and flip it over manually? Seems a lot simpler.
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!