Guys
We are building train layouts not something that will support a house (50 tons). That is the reason 2x4 studs are put on 16" centers (or 2x6 on 24" centers) in wall construction.
Cut your 2x4 into two 1-1/2" x 1-1/2" pieces. I use 2x2 to support an open grid layout 48" (could be 50+") above the floor. What is important is to brace the legs so they are stable. Makes for easier access under the layout using a roll-about office chair. These legs support 12 foot long pine L-girder (1-1/2" x 3-1/2)
I also have open grid 2'x6' modules using 4" strips of 1/2" thick birch plywood [from HD] with plywood cross joists 24" centers. For portabulity I use 1"x1"x 40" aluminum legs and 1/4"x1" aluminum braces.
Ed
https://goo.gl/photos/Fa7XcbJ1M8MhvFgr7update i made some changes to tabletop like i remove the 2x4s in middle and exstened the table in one way about 2 inches. it look alot better and i donno if you can see it in photos.
so over the weekend i added legs to my table, 2x3 i cut up from 2x6s and i got to say it very strong. i walked ontop of it many times testing the the build and i didn't add bracing yet. there wabbel but little bit. now i set up temperary train set using e-z track and i used bachmann empire builder and royal gorge train cars these cars uncouple like crazy on my old layout so i put them away for few years. but on my new table they didn't uncouple once. i was very very impressed. and i haven't even added the foam board it on osb bored. now i did try even out legs best i can cause few legs are milameter of the carpet but let you said i add shimes to thouse legs later on. but ya it working out extremely well. also i just pick up bowser second run of sd40-2 cp rail beaver logo and it awesome and it come with class lights.
now i thinking about noise dampering foam idea i been hearing latey but since i be using e-z track on my layout i don't know if it worth it it might not work since track is on pastic roadbed.
1x4's would be better, but the OSB should be alright. You might want to ad a few extra diagonal braces to keep the table from wobbling or shaking.
Depending on how flat your floor is, you might have to ad shims under some of the legs. If you do, just spread a small amount of caulk or glue on the shim, then drive it under the leg. This will keep the shims in place.
Mike.
My You Tube
so i now working on the legs for my table now i rip up the long 2x6 in half so there 2x3ish i will cut to 32inchs, and i have lot of osb bored from my old tabletop. if i rip the osb bored to 4 inchs can they work for bracing the legs? now for length of the legs i will make it 32inchs. easy to craw under witch means some of the 2x4 that are 2ft i will add 8 inches using left over 2x4s that are under 2ft. here what i was thinking for bracing idea.
so over weekend i took down my old layout, what a job and ahalf WOW lol. i saved all the legs and few of the 2x6s. some have glue and old osb on it. and few of the old osb bored. i found out 31 out of 46 where 2 feet tall and rest was little under 2 feet but i'll find good use for them on my new taple top. and i clean out the area. alot of cobwebs lol then move my table to basement. love the new tabletop so much lighter to move and stuff. still have to add legs to it.
Looking good! The OSB is fine. It will make a good base structure for foam, track bed, whatever. Diagonal bracing on the legs will make it nice and sturdy, especially if you have to put your weight on it to access that large area.
As you found out, getting a scew started in OSB can be a challange. Drilling a pilot hole is the way to go.
ah ya i used osb board. i found it easy to join the right sections by using the green edges. so all my outer ends or edges have green around it and insides have cuts edges. and for middle green edges around. thanks the bracing really help and make it strong. now i going to have legs install like that and 2 screws on outside frame so if i make all the legs exactly the same size then the table would be leveled to point.
so i have built my new tapletop for my layout. home depot had some straight wood. i cut the plywood first to right size then made the frames around it and but stringer every 16 inces oc. and i used 1/2 bolts to join sections together. i still have to take down my other layout but i'm waiting for bowser sd40-2. anyway what i like about this new layout is that there some waight to it. so the waight load should be put on all the legs. and it alot cleaner even on the edges. i still have ot make hold for wiring. and bolt give it little bit of flexabilty. and it easy ot put together. i used 1x4s for frames and 7/16 osb plywood. by the way predrill your holes for screws when making new tapletop it works wonders.
I agree there, Henry. Mine is 52". Looking at the way the OP's current lay out is supported, a revised 1" x 4" grid with diagonally braced legs would be 3 times sturdier that what is excisting. His current bracing reminds me of my 2nd plywood cental I built. Started with a table here, added on an extension there, more extensions over there, extra width here, etc., with whatever was needed to support the extensions, as I went.
BigDaddy It's none of our business but is there a medical reason to have the layout 3' tall?
easier to crawl under
Not for us old guys 48" also brings it closer to eye level.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
i don't think there lumber mill i live in city. but i will try and pick the straighest wood they have. as for claymark i look around tomorrow.
hon30critterHome Depot may not be the best place to find 'straight' wood
Actually, Dave, H-D has a brand called Claymark from New Zealand that is pretty nice. Of course the price is in line with select grade lumber, however for many of my more critical projects I find it is worth the extra cost. NO knots, smooth finish and 99% straight.
http://www.claymark.com/
Regards, Ed
Home Depot may not be the best place to find 'straight' wood. Do you have any lumber mills close to you? Companies that specialize in mouldings often carry poplar dimensional lumber as well. Poplar stays very straight and is knot free. Poplar will be more expensive than what HD offers, but it is so nice to work with that it is worth the extra money.
Another thing that a lumber mill may be able to do for you is rip plywood sheets into 3" or 4" widths. Plywood makes great framing material and it may be more cost effective, although you may have to do a little more work at the joints to make them strong. Home Depot does not have the proper equipment to rip 3" or 4" strips.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
so i be getting the wood and making my new tabletop sometime next week. i do have another question abouit 1x4s. now i going to try and fine the straightest wood home depot has. but if i pick some peces that are little uneven will the legs somewhat even it out best it can when standing the table up?
stello Hi Raptorengineer, I built my layout (12 x 12 dogbone) using 3/4" and 1/2" plywood. I cut the 3" strips in the 3/4" for framing and cross braces (every 16"). 2x2 for legs and 1/2" plywood for decking. The modules are 30" wide (so I can move out of my basement door if I need to) and roughly 4' to 6' long. The modules are then bolted together - this is a very sturdy build - I can climb on top of the layout if need be. The use of 3/4" sheets of plywood was my son-in-law's idea, and it worked great. Just cut up a 4 sheets and got to work. This is an image earlier in the build - I have added additional bracing since. https://goo.gl/photos/pcFxMoi1XaAsf7BZ6 Steve
Hi Raptorengineer,
I built my layout (12 x 12 dogbone) using 3/4" and 1/2" plywood. I cut the 3" strips in the 3/4" for framing and cross braces (every 16"). 2x2 for legs and 1/2" plywood for decking. The modules are 30" wide (so I can move out of my basement door if I need to) and roughly 4' to 6' long. The modules are then bolted together - this is a very sturdy build - I can climb on top of the layout if need be.
The use of 3/4" sheets of plywood was my son-in-law's idea, and it worked great. Just cut up a 4 sheets and got to work.
This is an image earlier in the build - I have added additional bracing since.
https://goo.gl/photos/pcFxMoi1XaAsf7BZ6
Steve
raptorengineercool i going to bolt the legs to the table. now since each section is 6ft long would it be wise to put 2 legs in middle of 6ft or no? i will add legs at each end of table section.
As long as your 1x4 frame is sound then you don't need additional legs in the middle of a 6' span.
The biggest enemy is leg wobble since that can weaken the whole structure. My solution prevents wobble because there are two bolts connecting the leg to the frame in both directions. Just bolting up 2x4 legs at each corner won't accomplish the same thing. You can always add cross bracing to the straight legs which is the more common solution.
Huntington Junction - Freelance based on the B&O and C&O in coal country before the merger... doing it my way. Now working on phase 3. - Walt
For photos and more: http://www.wkhobbies.com/model-railroad/
UNCLEBUTCH If your not really changeing anything, and what you have is working, Why bother to to tear down and rebuild?
If your not really changeing anything, and what you have is working,
Why bother to to tear down and rebuild?
It's none of our business but is there a medical reason to have the layout 3' tall?
Live and learn!
this is the video i saw that got me thinking about redoing my layout table
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qc1n7jitv3g&t=377s
HObbyguy A 1x4 grid is extremely strong. Absolutely no need for 2x4's. The potential weaknesses are the joints and the leg connections. So I glued and screwed my 1x4 base grid together. And my L-shaped legs are ripped from 1/2" ply using carriage bolts to attach them to the frame. No leg X-bracing is needed and access underneath is very clear for working underneath and storage. In fact I used to slide this whole section around on the carpet and the legs never wobbled at all. This is a very early picture but the leg design was so successful I built the rest of my layout the same way. Funny thing, my dad was building a layout at the same time and when I went to visit I found he built his legs the same way. We never discussed it before-hand, just had the same exact idea.
A 1x4 grid is extremely strong. Absolutely no need for 2x4's. The potential weaknesses are the joints and the leg connections. So I glued and screwed my 1x4 base grid together. And my L-shaped legs are ripped from 1/2" ply using carriage bolts to attach them to the frame. No leg X-bracing is needed and access underneath is very clear for working underneath and storage. In fact I used to slide this whole section around on the carpet and the legs never wobbled at all. This is a very early picture but the leg design was so successful I built the rest of my layout the same way.
Funny thing, my dad was building a layout at the same time and when I went to visit I found he built his legs the same way. We never discussed it before-hand, just had the same exact idea.
Yes the foam will dent.
riogrande5761 raptorengineer cool cool. i going ot reuse 2x4 legs and look at ways ot make them taller by jointing another 2x4. and find way ot braces them too. 2x4 legs are overkill but if you want to reuse wood and save on costs, there is no reason you couldn't reuse them to legs. I use 2x2's for benchwork legs, and 1x4 for open grid framing and 1x3's for cross members and 7/16" thick OSB wafer board instead of plywood. The OSB is cheap and cheerful and I've used it on 2 different layouts with great success.
raptorengineer cool cool. i going ot reuse 2x4 legs and look at ways ot make them taller by jointing another 2x4. and find way ot braces them too.
cool cool. i going ot reuse 2x4 legs and look at ways ot make them taller by jointing another 2x4. and find way ot braces them too.
2x4 legs are overkill but if you want to reuse wood and save on costs, there is no reason you couldn't reuse them to legs. I use 2x2's for benchwork legs, and 1x4 for open grid framing and 1x3's for cross members and 7/16" thick OSB wafer board instead of plywood. The OSB is cheap and cheerful and I've used it on 2 different layouts with great success.
thanks for all the help. one other question i'm looking at 1'' inch pink foam board for top layout. would foam board leave indents if i have to crawl over to reach something on my layout.