Benchwork Sections Design Advice

[Nerfball6]

Hi All, I’m seeking some benchwork design advice.

I have finished my new track plan (see image 1) and am ready to start building the benchwork. The layout is going into a portion of my basement and will have concrete block walls on three sides. I don’t want to drill into the concrete blocks so it will be freestanding; with the background attached directly to the benchwork.

While I don’t plan on moving anytime soon, I do want the layout to be sectional in case I have to take it apart to move. Though I am not going modular.

While designing my original benchwork plan (image 2), I found some advantages and disadvantages. While I liked the smaller, more standard sizes of the sections (most are 4’ long and either 24” or 28” wide). And that it would be easier to cut the boards with less waste, I found that I was not able to design the track plan without a lot of switches sitting right on top of section joints. It would mean a lot of track would need to be torn up if I DID move. Though the sections would be a lot easier to handle.

So I decided to revise the section sizes (image 3). I found that if I went with three sections that were 7’ feet long, I was able to keep all my turnouts off of section joints completely. I really liked that, however, it made the sections some pretty odd sizes, and if I moved, it would mean I’d have those 7’ long sections to deal with.

I haven’t decided if the gate will be a hinged swing-open, or lift-out yet.

So … I am wondering which design you would choose and why. Or if there are any considerations I haven’t thought of yet. I am not looking to change the track plan, but just wondering which size sections make the most sense before I commit and start cutting wood.

Image 1.

Image 2

Image 3

Thanks!
Dave

[rrebell]

Design a standard corner module instead of rectangles into the corner.

[FRRYKid]

rrebell

Design a standard corner module instead of rectangles into the corner.

Given the way that at least the standard NMRA corner module works with the inside corner being cut off, I can't see that working with all but one of the corners.

I use probably use image 2 with one slight modification: I don't like to put water on a joint if at all possible. I would change those two sections to having one as a 5' and the other as a 3'. Either that or else move the water off the joint.

As for the turnouts, a lot would depend on what sort of control you are using for the turnouts. If it is an attached control (i.e. HO or N atlas), the ballast can be attached with duct-type tape which would let the turnout "float" on the roadbed which wouldn't tear up the roadbed when separating (extra rail joiners might be needed). If it is a ground throw type or an undertable unit, that would take a little more thought but a little more detail would be helpful to clarify that.

Hope this helps.

[BigDaddy]

I am working on a much smaller L-shaped layout because I am planning to move.  I came to the same conclusion as you did, 7 foot is superior to 4.  Mine is 2x7 on foam and so far, is light enough to be handled easily.

The suggested tape-ballast-turnout is a suggestion I have not seen before.

jlwii2000, who did a recent youtube video of MR's offices, is military and he has moved a couple of times. He has hinted that moving has not gone well and he has minimal mountain scenery. 

Boxing up what you have designed will be a big project. Anything is possible if you throw enough money at it, but bear in mind that if you are going to move more than a couple hours away, it's going to be professional movers.

 

[hon30critter]

Hi Dave:

I think you are much further ahead to use the larger modules. Smaller modules would be great if you were disassembling the layout and transporting it on a regular basis but that's not what you are planning to do.

I also think you have already convinced yourself that you should go with the larger modules, but just in case you need further encouragement I'll offer a few observations:

The larger module plan means that you only have eight sections to deal with plus the bridge, whereas plan #2 has 12 sections. That's 50% more joints to deal with when you want to take the layout apart and then put it back together.

You have already determined that the larger modules significantly reduce the complications involved with having turnouts sitting over the joints.

You are going to mount your back drops on your modules. That goes back to the issue of how many joints you have to deal with. Do you want eight seams in your backdrops or 12?

 

I'm going through the same thought process with my own layout. In my case I don't think we will be moving until we get carted off to the old folks home. However, I need to be able to work on the layout from a sitting position. My back is toast. The fewer the joints the better.

I'm also planning on making my background scenes removable just like Mike Lehman has done. That will allow me to work on them when they are right in front of me and then I will simply lift them up and set them at the back of the layout when they are done or when I want to take a break from working on them.

Nice track plan by the way!

Regards

Dave

[riogrande5761]

What show in your figures is basically what I did - I have open grid sections which were around the wall in similar dimensions made of 1x4 frame, with 1x3 cross members.  It was not designed to be moved but mainly to be "removable".  In my case all the benchwork and subroadbed is sectional, but the track is laid across the sections so it will have to be removed or cut when the house is sold and it needs to be removed.

Construction photo's are posted here:

 

http://atlasrescueforum.proboards.com/thread/3737/jims-layout-progress?page=1

[UNCLEBUTCH]

Nerfball6

While I don’t plan on moving anytime soon, I do want the layout to be sectional in case I have to take it apart to move. Though I am not going modular.

   

Seams to me that your injecting a lot of stress and worry into the ''what if '' column.

Build the layout,to your plan. If the yet unplaned move ever comes to be; cut thru the track with dremel, sawzall thru the rest, carry away. There will be some damage/loss no matter how well you plan.

A very good bet that the layout won't fit into the as yet unknown, new basement anyway.

I think your wasteing time to worry, that could be used building.

[Choops]

I recommend an 8' and 6' section below the main yard. then the opposit wall town the you have it (7' and 5') then bridge the gap along the top wall with a 7' section. peninsula looks good as a 7' piece.

Use as long of a section as possible. less legs.

Steve

[RR_Mel]

 

Hi Dave

 

When I designed my current and last layout back in 1989 thoughts of making it movable was a high priority.  My layout is a 14’ x 10’ somewhat L shaped.  Because my layout was going to share our garage I went into overkill mode mainly so that the space under the layout could be used to store my tools, another high priority.

 

I also wanted to have the ability to move my albatross to clean the garage floor, Bakersfield has hundreds of mini creatures and varmints that need eliminated from time to time.

 

For construction I used 2x4s and plywood, lots of Elmer’s Carpenters Glue and screws.  I built four identical 4’ x 8’ frames, two tops and two bottoms.  I covered both bottom frames with ½” plywood top and bottom to support my tool storage.  Each bottom storage section has 4 casters with 850 pound capacity each.  I used ¾” plywood on the 4’ ends to support the top frames then bolted them together to form an L.   I covered the entire top with ½” plywood with a 12” overhang, the final layout size is 14’ by 10’.  At this point I had an easily movable layout that could be separated into two smaller sections for a major move if necessary.

 

This is my 27 year old CAD drawing of my layout construction.

 

 

Dave only you know your ability on what you would have to do to make a major move, as long as you make the section joints take apart friendly the size of each section is up to what you can handle.

 

My layout is over the top on overkill but it is exactly what I needed and has worked out great for me.  One thing I didn’t realize when I built my layout on castors was the ability to roll it out onto our driveway to give the garage a good cleaning, with it out on the driveway it’s a neighborhood Kid and Daddy magnet.  In less then 30 minutes there is a good gathering around my layout.  

 

 

 

Mel

 

Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951

 

My Model Railroad   

http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/

 

Bakersfield, California

 

I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.

[carl425]

UNCLEBUTCH

Seams to me that your injecting a lot of stress and worry into the ''what if '' column. Build the layout,to your plan. If the yet unplaned move ever comes to be; cut thru the track with dremel, sawzall thru the rest, carry away. There will be some damage/loss no matter how well you plan. A very good bet that the layout won't fit into the as yet unknown, new basement anyway. I think your wasteing time to worry, that could be used building.

I'm with Butch - especially on the issue of fitting the new space.

I'd add that by the time you get that layout to the point where it would be worth moving, your skills will have improved and your preferences will have evolved to the point where you'll welcome the opportunity to start over anyway.

But... if you stick with your plan to make it movable, make sure you trace a path from the layout out the door and verify that all your sections will fit.  Keep in mind that you very likely will have some sections you won't want to tip up on edge when you move them.

[Nerfball6]

Thanks for all the replies everyone. A lot of geat suggestions and food for thought. I guess I had pretty much made up my mind about using the larger (and fewer) sections, but started to have second thoughts. I'm glad I posted this here, I feel much more confident jumping in and starting to build.

I've been a modeler since i was a teenager in the 70's; but haven't had an actual layout since then. I worked as an art director  at Walthers for a number of years back in the late 80s/early 90s and built a number of the dioramas and models that were used on covers and in ads. But since I had always lived in apartments, I was never able to construct something permanent. Until just recently,  I had gotten out of the hobby completely. I guess It's hard to shake that feeling that I might need to move at any time; even though I now own my home and have no plans on leaving anytime soon.

Thanks again!
Dave

[hon30critter]

Dave:

Nerfball6

I now own my home and have no plans on leaving anytime soon.

Congratulations on buying your own home! Mortgages are scary, but in reality what they are doing is reducing your monthly rent payments, and you are increasing your share of the ownership every month. It's a bonus if you manage to pay the mortgage off sometime down the road but in the interim you will have paid a lot less per month than if you were renting a similar home.

AND!.... You now have space for a model railway (which is the primary reason for the mortgage anyhow but just don't tell that to your wife!).

Keep us posted.

Regards,

Dave

[rrinker]

 When I built my previous layout, I had no vehicle capable of handling 8' piece of wood, so I built it all as 2z4 sections, but every 2 sections was permantly connected to make 2z8 modules. Only 1 set had 4 legs, the rest bolted on in sequence and had legs on the free end, then the next section connected, etc. There were some areas where I was narrower than 2' wide, and a couple of odd size bits to fill in the space. I didn't cut the track or roadbed at the sections gaps, I just laid it all continuously. When I moved, I Dremeled through the rails and roadbed and unbolted the sections and unbolted the leg units. Being a maximum of 2' wide, each section was eaily handled through 2 flights of stairs with 180 degree turns at each landing, with standard interior doors. I used 1x3 and 1x4 pine, with 4" of extruded foam, so each section is not very heavy.

 SO after all that builing in sections - it now sits piled up on the floor of my basement, and I have no plans to rebuild it as it was. I'm not even sure what I am going to do with the track - it's all Atlas Code 93 and I am planning to use Peco on the next layout. I may use some of the Atlas in staging areas, except the turnouts are all #4's and I have practically no use for them in the new plan. The foam layers I can pull off and cut up to make land forms on the new layout, and I might be able to salvage some of the wood, though the new plan is designed to have as few legs as possible - since it's my house this time and not an apartment I can mount whatever I want to the walls.

                      --Randy

 

[Anonymous]

What door are you blocking? 

Also you might want to consider this:

A. Can you transport a 7'x2' wide section of layout through your house to a vehicle for transport?

B. Do you own a vehicle that can transport 7' sections, or are you locking yourself into renting a U-haul for moving?  

C. Can you purchase 14' boards in your area?  Otherwise you could be wasting a lot of wood. 

I primarily went with 4ft sections for reasons B and C.   Wood almost always can be found in 8ft-12ft sections, and is easier to transport than longer sections.  Some places you can find longer dimensional lumber.  Some lumber yards will cut wood so that you can transport it, but you generally are at their mercy for where they cut it unless you specify in advance.  

My fiancee and I went through the trouble of pre-planning the benchwork right down to the individual boards and found that 12' sections were the cheapest route to go (the longer the piece wood generally the less $$ per foot).   We also needed a few longer 14' ft sections.

Also they typically charge you after the first few cuts.  That expense can add up pretty fast.

[Nerfball6]

I have started working on my Benchwork and have created the first two sections on the left side; The 7' x 28" section, and the 5' x 28" section.

The grid frame is 1x4 pine construction with 2x2 legs and 1x2 bracing. I'm using wingnuts to attach the legs and bracing so that I can remove them and get the sections upstairs and out the door if need be.

I'm not sure of the grade of the pine, but it's fairly free of knots and has been very straight. Everything has been squaring up nicely.

I still need to add 1/4" plywood and 2" foam to the top. And will be adding a removable masonite backdrop to each section.

What suddenly has me nervous however, is that I've been seeing a bunch of threads lately where people have been warning against using dimensional lumber and suggesting going with all plywood construction. Is this really necessary? I'm guessing the vast majority of layouts are made with dimensional lumber. Do I really need to be that concerned about warping? Should I cut my losses and rebuild with plywood? I don't have a table saw so that would be a pain in the rear.

Thanks!
Dave

[hon30critter]

Dave:

Literally thousands of modelers have used dimensional lumber for their layouts with huge success. I think you are pretty safe.

However, if you want to test your benchwork simply leave it in the layout room for a couple of weeks. If anything is going to cause a problem it will be the change in humidity. The wood will acclimatize in two or three weeks and any tendancy to warp will show itself.

For future reference, you should acclimatize all lumber by storing it in its final location for two or three weeks, or longer if the wood is really wet. (Actually, if the wood is really wet, I wouldn't buy it at all. I would find another supplier.)

If you feel more comfortable using plywood then by all means build the rest of the benchwork with it, but I wouldn't scrap what you have done just yet.

FYI, most lumber yards will rip plywood sheets for you. They may charge a small fee which is reasonable since you are asking them to do a fair amount of work.

Dave

[nealknows]

I have rebuilt my layout 3 times in 16 years. I've used 1"x4" and 1"x3" #2 pine from Home Depot. First thing I do is let it aclimate to the room, at least a week. Then I assemble my frames, usually in 4' or 8' foot sections 24" wide or 30" wide. I use 1/2" AC plywood for the subroadbed which is not available at a Home Depot or Lowes, usually at the lumber yard. I let that aclimate for the same period of time, then I paint it top bottom and sides to seal it to prevent any other moisture. I use cork on top of the wood. I have no issues with climate change and the room I have my layout is temperature controlled.

Good luck!

Neal