Hello everyone!
I have come to a point in building my layout where I can't put any more track without looking extremely cluttered. I have the room and the track to make a few hills/raised track areas, but I have had several problems doing that before.
Currently I am using Bachmann EZ Track. I don't really run into many problems with the track. The problem I run into is making the engine go up too steep of a grade. I have the Bachmann EZ Track tiered set, but most of my engines have a hard time getting up that hill (with the exception of my BLI engine) because the hill is just way too steep, even when putting the tiers at the spacing that the instructions suggest. Is there an easier/smarter way of doing this? All I'm looking to do is make one of the inner mainline tracks go up and over the outer mainline. Or, if it's possible, just make the outer mainline go up "on a hill and over a bridge" to make it seem a little more interesting than how it looks now. I don't have a current picture of the layout, but here is the most recent video that I made of it:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6wujIu15wo
Thanks in advance for any helpful tips/suggestions on this predicament! :)
Are you in HO or N? How steep is the grade you are trying to climb? How many cars are you trying to pull up and how are they weighted? What model and brand are the locomotives that are having problems? Adding weight to a loco can help it's pulling power. Also adding traction tires or bullfrog snot should help, but you will loose some of your electrical pick up.
A 2% grade is considered about the maximum for normal operations. Logging railroads handle steeper grades and some folks do have steeper grades on their layouts successfully. Not sure how. I don't know what the % grade is on the tiered set you have, I do remember the set I had years ago was pretty steep for an up and over figure 8 on a 4'x8' sheet of plywood.
You don't say how much space you have to work with. Since it takes 100" of run to gain 2" of elevation, in HO you have to go almost all the way around a 4'x8' sheet to gain elevation to pass one track over another. One way to shorten the distance is to have the lower track drop.
If you can answer some of the questions, maybe someone here can give you some more precise advise to help solve your problem.
Good luck,
Richard
Wow. I had no idea that all of those factors played a part! Let me start by answering your questions...
My layout is a HO layout on a 5x9 sheet of plywood. I don't really know how steep I want it to be. I'm guessing I'd like it to be at least an inch, maybe two, above the rest of the tracks...but only for a moment before descending again. The most cars that any of my engines would be pulling is a Kato SD40-2, and it carries 9 log cars and a BN caboose. The strongest engine I have is my BLI Pacific. It carries 5 heavyweight passenger cars.
I hope that this gives some insight. :) Looking forward to whatever you guys have to say!
anoles22:
Take note of what Richard said in his post, that is to have the lower track go down into the benchwork as well as having the upper track go up. This will theoretically cut your grades by half because instead of having all of the slope on just one track, you can achieve the same vertical separation by putting half of the height change into each of the two tracks. It will also add to the visual interest a bit.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Dave,
I did take note to what he said about that. The only problem is that I don't have room to go any lower :( Only up
Ok I am new to model railroading but not new to engineering. So perhaps I can simplify. I have 3% grade on my railroad (designed 2% but ended up 3% in a couple spots). My Athearn P42 can pull 5 walthers super liners. Probably could pull 6. Through a 30" radius curve.
I saw your YouTube, sounds like you are building directly on plywood (most people seem to do this).
I would get woodland scenics risers and inclines: they have 2/3/4 percent and they work really I well. You would need to go 3.5" up in order to clear the line below, and at 3% that would take 120" or 10 feet. It depends upon your track plan how you get the over/under arrangement.
I must applaud you for going 5x9 rather than 4x8. Consider using a 2" extruded foam sheet- it will allow you to go down and also allows you to make uneven ground more easily (like making a small stream).
Hope this helps.
If you go over to the General Discussion section of these forums, you will find a thread "Math Question About Grades." You may find some related information there that can help you.
Looking at your video everything is very neat and simple and you are starting with 5x9 which is much better for HO than the 4x8 that most of us start with. Good for keeping out of trouble. But as you are finding elevated crossovers add a whole new dimension- in more ways than one.
I am building them into my new layout but working with a much bigger area than you are and did careful planning to make sure I would not run into trouble. I also tested various elevations with my engines just to see what would happen before setting the risers.
The guys are right- 2% grades will allow just about everything to work fine, although you may find that locos like your little steamer may not be able to pull a whole lot of cars up the hill. In order to cross over you need 3-1/2" minimum, so at 2% that works out to be 175" (14.5') both up and down. Up to 3% can work OK if you have locos with very good traction and/or run consists but consider that the absolute maximum. A 3% grade you still need 117" (approx 10') both up and down.
Seems like it should be possible to work in a crossover on a 5x9 but you will need to totally re-think your layout design to get the needed run lengths and/or lower the track that is being crossed using the same rules for % grade. You definitely should be able to get a small hill into the design without a crossover but it will still take some thought and the hill will need to be rather low without changing the layout.
What length of track are you currently using to try to reach crossover height?
Huntington Junction - Freelance based on the B&O and C&O in coal country before the merger... doing it my way. Now working on phase 3. - Walt
For photos and more: http://www.wkhobbies.com/model-railroad/
As noted using Woodland Scenics risers may be your best bet. You can use 2" elevation for the base level, then your line can go both down and up to spread out the grade.
Note however that on a small layout, to get an acceptable grade, your mainline is pretty much all going to be either going up or down...once the engine goes under the bridge, it's going to start the long climb to go over the bridge. If you're doing a twice-around it might be better to go with a level crossing-at-grade.
BTW I'm surprised you could find a 5x9 sheet of plywood, I looked around recently and couldn't find anyplace that still had them.
Try stuff first! You hopefully have an idea of what you want to haul, (how many engines, how many cars), upgrade.
Get a 1X6 plank or shelving piece over 8 feet long put your track on it and see how many cars you can haul up varying grades as you raise and lower the board. You might be surprised!
Nothing is worse than making a grade and run of track on a table and finding your favorite engine can't manage more than 5 cars on the grade you have chosen or to find out half your engines won't pull longer trains up the grade you just finished making.
Avoid sharp curves on steep grades as the pulling power is reduced in some curved areas or, if running a strong engine and a long train, you may pull the longer part of the trailing train off the rails while in the curve.
Grades and curves can be tricky especially if you are into long trains.
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so it can't be fixed