Crandell,
Really nice to see more progress on your layout! You're doing a great job on that mountain. I don't know how you can possibly do better with the new mountain, than your old layout. But apparently you are out-doing yourself with this new one.
Well done sir, well done (golf claps).
Michael
CEO- Mile-HI-RailroadPrototype: D&RGW Moffat Line 1989
Wow! What an exciting read! Full of suspense and drama (not the good kind). And you'll be happy to know I helped you find hand holds in your climbing video. I enjoyed the progress. Very nice.
Chip
Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.
Thanks, Chip. I have lived a lot since my last entry, but I have also done a lot since then. First, I meant to post this earlier than now, but the first mountain is largely completed...just some rock carving and staining over the tunnel portal just to the right of the bridge in the distance, and some trees. Later, I'll tackle the close wide portal and its surrounding terrain to complete it.
Next, I am doing the facade, or the frontal face, of the helix mountain. I have applied the hot glue and screen to the embankment below the tracks, and have applied it to create washouts or ravines between the tunnels. Above thaem, seated atop the shaped plywood deck, notice that there are two separate smaller removable frames of 1X2 with screen applied. They will be removable, and behind them, covering the bast opening, will be two larger frames covered in the eco-cork. I won't be scenicking the rear side of the mountain because it won't be visibel much of the time, and won't be in images due to its location across an L-shaped aisle...biiiig gap!
This doesn't look any screamin' heck, but I hope it will look pretty decent when I am through with it:
I haven't really provided a good look at the last rock face near the portal leading to the tail of the wye that doubles as access to lower level staging. I am slowly carving it up to look like real rock. It will take some time. It's easy enough physically, but artistically it takes some experimentation and learning for me.
Also, it shows what I mean by not scenicking the rear 2/3 of the helix mountain. I don't need it for an illusion, it would add many hours of time and dollars of material to scenick it, and I don't ever expect to image it for reasons already given. So...
Tomorrow I begin to mix the probably 26-30 batches of ground goop it will take to cover all the screen. I have to scrub the utensils and the bucket between mixes, so it isn't very fast.
Crandell
And lightning-fast man strikes again!
Looking great, Crandell! Want to come to South Carolina and do some fast work here?
Mark P.
Website: http://www.thecbandqinwyoming.comVideos: https://www.youtube.com/user/mabrunton
I love how you landscape your mountains, they are so real looking its crazy good.
That opening (first pic) in the side of the mountain. Are you planning on closing that up? Or is that for track access?
Do you have any plans for backdrops?
Thanks, Mark and Mike.
That opening, Michael, since it is vertically aligned with the edge of the layout and the aisle, will be covered with 1/8" mahogany plywood or doorskin fascia. I know it looks a bit weird, but once the fascia has its top edge mated to the surface of the mountain there, and is screwed into position, and possibly painted (not sure yet because they came off the outside of the last layout and were painted with urethane. I don't know if their natural wood colour will look good or if I'll have to paint it a dark green or something else...it won't be black, probably not grey) it will look like a typical layout with fascia applied.
I have been spending a couple of hours most days in the train room. Here are some photos showing progress.
First, I have started the fascia which is recycled cladding from the old layout cut down to length and width. It will be painted.
In the first photo, I tested a steamer by placing it slightly outward from the rails and encouraging it to fall over. This is how it came to rest...confirmation that I have the top edge of the fascia at the height where it won't interfere with enjoyment of the view but where it still saves a top-heavy steamer that jumps the rails.
Next, a view from near the entryway looking along the yard module and the far mountain showing the fascia.
Wife has agreed to get some darker cotton material to fashion some short drapes to hide the rest of the legs.
Lastly, what the Big Mountain looks like. It is in four pieces. The lower front face with the tracks and portals is one piece, including the steep slopes between the tunnels. You can make out the seam behind which are two lift-out sections, one larger one on the left and a smaller one over the middle tunnel. I have not covered the entire mountain, but fashioned a lightweight frame and cover of EcoCork Foam to darken the inside of the mountain. I sprayed the inside surface of the cork foam with flat black paint, and all the tunnels have black Bristol Board light baffles running back from the rear face of the portals.
The top rear frame slides back on rails and can be lifted off with ease. It would have taken many hours and a lot of expense to cover this monster, about 6.5 feet across.
I'm having fun, taking my time (no, really...), trying not to make any errors that really set me back. So far, so good.
Very cool. Big Mountain should be named Peek-a-Boo Peak though.
this is looking great... I'm glad I took the time to leaf through this thread
Hey Crandell you can't be running your steamers at full speed along the edge like that. LOL
Great progress, Crandell. The facia really brings it all together, like the scenery contours. Figure out what color yet? Dark or Olive green (pullman green would work also) Hope the "Semi-permanent" layout can end up being more permanent.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
Thanks, fellas. Bob, I have some paint left over from an interior paint job on the house about six years ago. It is called 'smoked oyster', and I would call it a slightly purplish-brown. Hard to describe. Anyway, I want to try that first to see if it 'works'. I can always paint over it if it's a bust.
I have added more fascia elements today. I have also been painting all the rock faces. I tried a tanny-grey, but it was far too grey. I have spent the last 25 hours in about five short sessions trying to stain the grey surface back to a lighter tan. I think I'll have to do more of that, and also paint some streaks of white and darker brown to get more realism. I'm learning as I go, and so far the grey was a complete bust.
As in....YIKES!!!
Mouse, I'll have to come up with a name for both the pike, itself, and the mountains....I guess. That task is always one of the last things I do before I consider the layout 90% complete...with the remaining 10% taking a few years. No more Seneca Falls, though.
selector Thanks, fellas. Bob, I have some paint left over from an interior paint job on the house about six years ago. It is called 'smoked oyster', and I would call it a slightly purplish-brown. Hard to describe. Anyway, I want to try that first to see if it 'works'. I can always paint over it if it's a bust. I have added more fascia elements today. I have also been painting all the rock faces. I tried a tanny-grey, but it was far too grey. I have spent the last 25 hours in about five short sessions trying to stain the grey surface back to a lighter tan. I think I'll have to do more of that, and also paint some streaks of white and darker brown to get more realism. I'm learning as I go, and so far the grey was a complete bust. As in....YIKES!!! Mouse, I'll have to come up with a name for both the pike, itself, and the mountains....I guess. That task is always one of the last things I do before I consider the layout 90% complete...with the remaining 10% taking a few years. No more Seneca Falls, though. Crandell
That "Smoked oyster" paint may just work out. I wouldn't worry about the "too" dark a grayish coloring on the rocks. Actually , I will start w/ a dark color or wash to fill-in the deep craigs, etc then apply washes or dry brush the lighter tan, browns and various other reds, rust and even greens and blue. You'd be surprised at the colors that minerals will produce in the rock from leaching. Of coarse it really depends on the geography of the area modeled. I will even try to model the specific "rock" and it's strata along w/ the colors (granite, shale or sedimentary) .
Your rock face is excellent, Bob. I hope to derive a result like yours some day.
For now, here is the first staged image from the new railroad-without-a-name. It was done in rather poor light with a camera not designed for indoor use, and not stacked for good depth of field, so it is what it is...smoke, steam, and all.
selector Thanks, fellas. Bob, I have some paint left over from an interior paint job on the house about six years ago. It is called 'smoked oyster', and I would call it a slightly purplish-brown. Hard to describe. Anyway, I want to try that first to see if it 'works'. I can always paint over it if it's a bust. I have added more fascia elements today. I have also been painting all the rock faces. I tried a tanny-grey, but it was far too grey. I have spent the last 25 hours in about five short sessions trying to stain the grey surface back to a lighter tan. I think I'll have to do more of that, and also paint some streaks of white and darker brown to get more realism. I'm learning as I go, and so far the grey was a complete bust. Crandell
That color sounds like "Eggplant", might actually look decent.
If stains are not working, you may need to go w/ artist's acrylics (tube paste form), they are quite heavily pigmented and you can dry brush the rocks and won't have to worry about a thick "coat" of paint obscuring some of the rock detail. You could also try airbrushing or spray can, that will allow dusting a coat of the "base" tan and should cover well. I had to color Cripplebush "rubber" rock ( came prepainted to a Dave Frary dark gray. Most of my coloring to get the reddish brown and tan was dome w/ rattle can. from there i installed them and went w/ the dry brushing
Crandall, you may have seen these pics before, they were extremely dark gray rubber rock
Early pics before any final dry brushing (tans, cream/ white, red/ rust and greens) This is a final pic of the outcropping shown in the previous pic May not be the exact coloing you want, but you get the idea Also when painting, take the lighting in to account this is the same rock but w/o the halogen track, I found I needed to vary colors of the final dry brushing to gain the look under all lighting conditions This may work for you to get that lighter coloring
Early pics before any final dry brushing (tans, cream/ white, red/ rust and greens)
This is a final pic of the outcropping shown in the previous pic May not be the exact coloing you want, but you get the idea Also when painting, take the lighting in to account this is the same rock but w/o the halogen track, I found I needed to vary colors of the final dry brushing to gain the look under all lighting conditions This may work for you to get that lighter coloring
This is a final pic of the outcropping shown in the previous pic May not be the exact coloing you want, but you get the idea
Also when painting, take the lighting in to account this is the same rock but w/o the halogen track, I found I needed to vary colors of the final dry brushing to gain the look under all lighting conditions This may work for you to get that lighter coloring
Also when painting, take the lighting in to account this is the same rock but w/o the halogen track, I found I needed to vary colors of the final dry brushing to gain the look under all lighting conditions
This may work for you to get that lighter coloring
I like to start my rock colors quite dark with washes of black acrylic, then build up lighter colors in several passes.
Here's some rock after the black wash.
This is the same scene after final color has been applied. The initial black stays behind to enhance shadows, but is otherwise not prominent. All of this coloring was done with dry-brushed acrylics of progressively lighter colors to build up depth, and is not the result of staining. Dry brush techniques should allow you to recover any rock areas that became darker than desired.
Rob Spangler
Very natural looking, Rob, and highly creditable! Thanks for taking the time to post your tips. I may have to bite it and do the same, paint it all a dark grey and work my way up from that base. The base I have now is qute a bit lighter.
-Crandell
And the water looks great too
Bob
Don't Ever Give Up
Crandall,
Layout is progressing nicely, thanks for posting pictures, I am really enjoying your layout via the web.
Rob
I am pleased you are finding it an enjoyable thread, Rob. I hope it encourages other onlookers to get pencil to paper and to begin to cut materials over the next few months if they have been looking for inspiration.
I wanted to talk about that Walthers 30 degree crossing on the scissors-style reversing wye at the base of Big Mountain. I found that I had cut gaps on one leg due to problems getting my PSX-AR to work properly, but they were too far apart. I had steamers stalling on it, even with tenders with full pickup. So, I soldered the gaps closed and cut ones closer to the frogs. Now it all works better. Lesson learned.
Still, that's not my beef. My beef is that the engines would also wobble through it, and I thought that was the problem. If I cleaned out the flange paths once I did it twenty times, but they'd still wobble. It wasn't until I closed the distance between the gaps on either side of the crossing and found they still wobbled that I put two and two together. It must be high rails. I ran a finger transversely across a route and found my finger snagged on the inner guards on three of the four exits. I got out my Dremel-like hobby tool and a thin stone and ground them down. Of course it tore up the insulating black at the V's of the frogs, but since I have gapped the one route anyway, I don't have to worry about any conflicts.
Moral of the story: if any of you purchase a complex piece of rail commercially, check it out right away for how well your locomotives will move through its various routes. I found out nearly a year after its installation that it was improperly assembled. Fortunately, I have some tools that allowed me to make it useful, and it works a lot better now.
That's a good point and a reminder to check prefab track. I noticed on some manufacturers track and turnouts there was a lot of flash around the frogs. sometimes the frog sits a bit proud compared to the tops of the rail. My guess, the molds might be getting a little "worse for wear" for the plastic components around the frog. A quick fix before installation helps keep thing running smooth.
Rob Spangler,
Your scenery is absolutely killer. Great execution of going dark to light colors on those rock faces!
Inspiring thread all around!
Chris Palomarez
Commercial parts can have flaws. Bought a Shinohara 3-way code 70 and had to trim down the plastic spikes a bit to make them RP25 compliant after it was installed, what a pain, but worked great with a chisel blade.
Thanks for your comments, gentlemen.
Well.
I've had an interesting morning. It started last evening, though. I decided to try the Sunset Selkirk 2-10-4 to see how it went around both main tracks. Those reading from the beginning will recall that I tested the tight curves on the scissors wye about a year ago to see if those curves were sufficient for the Selkirk. They were, but just. Other than that, I don't recall running the Selkirk much after that because I was in build mode.
Last night I got it connected to the tender, always a chore with those teensy connectors, and hooked up a sizeable consist of hoppers, a couple of boxcars, and a caboose. The True Line CPR reefer's metal couplers were much too low...or else the tender's coupler is much too high...take your pick. The reefer stays coupled with the car behind it, but not with the tender. The two come unhitched partway through the mountain. Also, there is too much resistance in that particular train and the Selkirk began to mark time in a couple of spots. The lead truck kept derailing at one spot, but I knew the rails to be generally okay there. Not enough to soften the ballast and pry up rails or anything. So, I removed the truck, adjusted the tongue angle, and clipped one loop off the coil spring. Rerailed the steamer and ran it again over the same spot.
The steamer ran into the first smaller tunnel and made funny sounds. Stopped it, pulled it out, and found the left main rod had separated from the crosshead. It took me 20 minutes to gather tools and lights and get the thing put back toghether. It ran fine. I ended up repairing some holes in ballast, you know, the kind that miraculously appear as soon as you vacuum? That was enough for yesterday.
Couldn't sleep past 0530, so I got up and made a big mug of tea. Went out to the loft and decided to see what gives. Took a couple of photos of the Selkirk where I had left it poking out of the downhill portal from the truss bridge, and then ran it up the grade, into the helix, and wanted to photo it at the other portals on the 'face' side of the spiral Big Mountain. Grumble, rumble, beep, beep, beep....and silence. Metal truck must have derailed and caused a short. Reached in and dragged it out of the tunnel. Rerailed, backed it up the grade, and tried again. Rumble, beep, beep,...
An hour later, after removing the top mountain modules, sliding back the rear part of the top, I had used a jig saw to cut out an access point to see what was going on. Cleaned up the sawdust, and ran the train viewing it from the inside. Same thing. But it was doing it at a point where I had verified the curve was no worse than 30". In fact, I knew it was at least 33". Maybe my eyes were not correct. Ran a finger, found a solder a bit high, and also a tight gauge at that join. Took maybe 15 minutes to tweek the inside rail a bit to widen the gauge and I filed down the solder bulge at the flange face. Rerailed the steamer and ran it back, and of course as it always does, it ran back flawlessly. Ran it forward....derailed rear truck and beeps.
Must be the loco. By this time I'm about 45 minutes into, 'Not getting breakfast until this is fixed," mode. I exited the mountain, removed the steamer, and set it on a towel. Removed, the rear truck and adjusted the tongue angle a bit to relieve pressure on the rear axle and to allow the lead axle to sink a wee bit. I thought about removing some of the flared coil spring, but it is not a very strong spring. So I decided to creep back under the mountain and run the truck, by itself along the tough spot. It ran fine. I had wondered if maybe the guage was a bit tight. So, back out to stand by the front sliding door where the morning sun would illuminate my problem and I had a closer look. Turns out one side of the rear frame of the truck has a thicker portion that sticks out and does make contact with the wheel's outer face when I slide the axle as far as it will go. The other side is flush and smooth. So, I used a thin blade-type needle saw to file away that bump. I have no qualms about doing this to a brass model because it won't be visible.
By now I have been up and in the loft for over two hours and have only taken some photos. Everything else has been putting out fires after finding them.
I restored the Selkirk to running condition and set it back on the rails. I backed it into the tunnel where the sticky point was and let it come forward again. It ran just fine.
Ssssooooooo.....I didn't have to take apart the mountain, crawl in and out of it about eight times, saw out a peephole to have a better look at what I had taken pains to ensure was bullet-proof track (although I did find a bit of a pinch-point, now fixed), and tear out handsfull of my hair. All I had to do was to remove the rear truck of the locomotive to see if flashing or some other problem was causing it to derail.
Apart from that, I think the Selkirk is a bit sensitive to one part of the outside main where my super-elevation might be a bit enthusiastic. I may have to soften the ballast along that curve and lift the inner rail about a mm.
I can't say I'm not having fun, but this is the point where the rubber hits the pavement, and I'm learning where my skills still need development. I have run my Niagara and the Pennsy J1 2-10-4 throughout the system, and both of them are happy. The only other loco I'm a bit worried about is the Pennsy T1 Duplex. It has both inner driver axles blind and I'm pretty sure it will be okay. But I'm always surprised at some point. Yesterday and today it was the Selkirk. Who knows what's next.
selectorWell. I've had an interesting morning. It started last evening, though. I decided to try the Sunset Selkirk 2-10-4 to see how it went around both main tracks. ... Yesterday and today it was the Selkirk. Who knows what's next.
I've had an interesting morning. It started last evening, though. I decided to try the Sunset Selkirk 2-10-4 to see how it went around both main tracks. ... Yesterday and today it was the Selkirk. Who knows what's next.
I'm glad you got the issues fixed. When are you going to share some of those photos you took? With the narrative you posted, they might be very educational.
It would be too labour intensive to post photos of all the work I did, Mark, but here are two that show the places where I had the problems. First, on the twinned main running near the aisle on the large yard module, the two tracks you see at left are the mains. It was the right hand main, where it curves right and begins to climb. There was a bit of a change of grade I hadn't detected at the joint about 3/4 of the way around the curve, toward the tunnel. I had to soften the ballast, pull up the rails gently with pliers, use my thumb to shove grains of beach sand ballast under the ties, and when I was satisfied, I groomed the damaged ballast profile with fresh sand and glued it. It works much better now. The camera angle in this view is where I first detected why the Selkirk was slipping a bit there because from here I could see the change in angle. Not much, but enough. Besides, the locomotives are always the final arbiters, not their owners.
Next, about six inches inside the portal shown here, I had to fiddle with a joint. It turns out that I didn't, as I explained in my lengthy tale, because only the rear truck of the engine had to be cleaned up. It's frame had flashing on it that prevented the rear axle from sliding over enough to round the curve. The track I'm talking about is the outside curve. Note that the portal, itself, was sawed in hald vertically at the apex and a carved blue extruded insulation board foam plug inserted. Nice and wide now.
Next post, I'll talk about how I am finished the truss bridge and river under the large glass brick window...that're really plastic. Surprised the heck outta me when I found out.
First, for the bridge module that is largely scenicked around the rails, minus some trees and bushes and some lineside details mebbe....I had to fashion bridge abutments. I could have ordered them from Chooch, but this was one project I wanted to do myself. I thought about making a mold, but Wayne broke the best I've seen and I decided I couldn't possibly improve on them. What else?
I thought about some left over 1/4" MDF from the spline roadbed experiment on the last layout. I had some that was pristine because I had stored it in our dry basement. I cut lengths of the spline section measured for the 1X4 wood blocks currently acting as the real abutments. Then I glued them all together, set them on aluminium foil, and let them dry, taking pains to ensure they dried in a plane. The foil had to be completely flat IOW.
Next, I painted them and set them in place, but not before applying a generous bead of the tan PL300 around their base and around the base of the ground foam on either side of the bridge. Remember, I was about to paint the river bottom and pour epoxy over the painted bottom, my usual technique. I didn't want the epoxy to run all over the place, so I had to create a gasket. That's the PL300. I used the green masking tape over the open edges of the river, pressed hard into position. Then, at the base of the tape, I applied a bead of DAP Alex Plus with silicone in their clear-drying version. I made sure the PL300 and DAP were uniformly forming a tight seal at the four corners of the river surface. I let it dry overnight.
Next day, I painted the plywood river bottom and let it dry. Here is is, not yet blended between the shades of green, and you can see that the paint is still wet.
The next step, once the painted surface was dry, was to pour the first layer of Nu-Lustre 55 finish quality epoxy from Swing Paints. I let it dry last night, and after verifying that it had cured (tapped it with a fingernail to hear the firm click), I mixed the second and last layer. To this batch I added some Hauser Medium Green from the craft paints section at Wal Mart, and a good sized pinch of plaster of Paris powder. I spread it and let the bubbles form and rise. I used a rolled up piece of waste black bristol board, the stuff I used in panels at the back of the lift-off mountain at the end of the yard module to keep it dark, as a straw. The idea is to wait about five minutes after you have helped the epoxy to cover 90% of the intended surface, and then let it spread out and level itself over the next hour or so. Meanwhile, bubbles, large and teensy, form inside the medium. Blowing over the surface with your breath, through a straw or rolled up bristol board if you forget the straw, raises the bubbles of all sizes and they pop on the surface. You end up with glassy smook and glassy clear epoxy if you do it well.
While the epoxy was finishing its spreading, I cut three twigs from the garden and shaped them, and inserted them into the epoxy. I placed the third after this photo was taken, so you'll see the snag on the close shore and the floater mid-stream. The large one right was the right size, but too high for the thickness of the hardening pour, so I selected its best profile and split it down its length to form a flat bottom. I then inserted it into the thin pour. After that, I placed some clean gravel around the river's edge and added some foam bushes.
This was as I left it about at 1200 hrs PDT. The last step will be to stipple a thin layer of gel gloss medium over the surface to make the surface look more natural.
The scenery and rock work is superb. Im thinking of switching from stains to acrylics (I still have a bunch of old stain to use up however). Its been fun following the progress.
Great work Crandell, I really enjoy your posts about your layout. I all most feel like I'm there.
A quick update. The water course is pretty much done, minus more bushes and trees to flesh it out. I'll get to that in time. I also have to figure out how to make a backrop for that scene.
I have been putting out fires for the past six days. Track fires. I have begun to run engines that have been in their cartons for the past two years to see how they handle the track. Not so great it turns out. They have turned their noses up at several points, almost always due to elevation differences or defects in the rails across from each other. IOW, I may have underdone superelevation in a couple of spots, and one of my vertical transitions was insufficiently long on the inner main. So, the past week almost has been one of running a steamer until it derails, fixing the defect, and running the loco at speed until it is a consistently good runner. Then, on to locomotive #2, and repeat. So far, the BLI J1 2-10-4 has been trouble-free, but the same wheel arrangement in my brass CPR Selkirk has not liked that one short vertical transition. In fact, there were two spots where I have had to soften the ballast, lift the track a smidgen, and force grains of beach sand under the ties to suspend them higher off the sub-roadbed. So far, I am winning the battles, and eventually I should win the war. As of this morning, the BLI Duplex 4-4-4-4 did not like the entrance to that large walled double-wide concrete portal going into the lift-off mountain at right, at the end of the large yard module. Using a strong light, I could see both the lead truck and the front driver lift sideways to pop out of the rails on the outside of the curve...meaning they fell to the right. That meant to me that the outside rail was not doing its job on the right driver's flange. Backed the engine down a ways and softened the ballast, lifted the rails, and jammed more sand under them, but moreso on the right side, increasing the superelevation a bit. Not waiting until the ballast hardens, I tried again and found that the loco liked the geometry this time. So, dribbled some glue mixture and will let it dry for the rest of the day. If it settles over that time and the Duplex derails again, I know I have more of the same to do.
I find that the articulated models are much more forgiving. The Duplex has a rigid wheelbase, a rather long one, just like its prototype. The two inner driver axles are blind (flangeless), which helps on the tighter curves on our layouts immensely.
None of my smaller engines, whether eight drivered or six, seems to have any problems around the track system. It's always my big steam that makes me beg. And oooohh...how I beg. On my knees, mostly, too. At least, for the past week, I've spent a ton of time on 'em eyeballing the rails.
I know things will not go well when I get around to running my modern Genesis SD-75M diesels. When I ran them on my last layout for the first time, they derailed at a couple of curves, again because the rails were not the correct height. Thank goodness the unspoken rules for the hobby, at least so far in my experience, state that a correction of the rail system on behalf of a newly introduced locomotive will not result in derailments for locos already accommodated with past corrections. It would be a nightmare!!
Hi there,
Such a great read, always keen to see how this layout is progressing. Keep up the great work and especially like the recent river addition.
Cheers
Chris
Cheers...
Chris from down under...
We're all here because we're not all there...