I am in the process of trying to improve my N Scale layout lighting by getting rid of the fluorescent fixtures and going with incandescent and halogen lighting. Recently I dumped several fluorescent fixtures when I made some drastic changes to my layout earlier this year. I always had several halogen track lighting fixtures up since a majority of my layout is a 27 foot long by two foot set up. (I also have two 8 foot by 3 foot loop back sections) I have repositioned the track lighting fixtures at least twice now trying to get a good balance of light and shadows. Fortunately the way the joists run in my basement the track lighting fixtures easily slip in between the joists and nearly disappear. Total wattage on those three halogen track lighting fixtures is about 800 watts. Another goal of mine was to eliminate the need for the general task lighting that I use for every day purposes such as layout building or model building. With my layout around the walls, the general task lighting distracts from the layout and the ultimate goal of installing layout-only lighting was a high priority. Going through some old issues of Model Railroader I came across an article dated March 1996 ‘Lighting the Great Western’ where the author discussed how to effectively light a layout. In the article he describes how John Allen’s infamous G&D layout was lit with over 4,000 watts of light, most of it neon. Allen rejected incandescent and fluorescents. Most of us would never consider neon nor would we be able to justify the expense. The author of the article ultimately used a combination of 100 watt and 75 watt incandescent bulbs and 25 watt blue incandescents. He emphasized lighting the back panels and backdrops with lights behind fascia panels that permitted the darkened aisles to add drama to the room. This was a goal of mine, also; darken the aisles so the visitors eyes are attracted to the layout and not the floor. For the 1,400 square foot layout the author installed just over 4,000 watts of light. That amount of light is not in the cards for my layout. The thing that caught my eye the most of this article was the use of low wattage blue lights for night time running and color balance. So I decided to give it a try. I installed a new fascia over one part of my layout that is primarily mountains. Before I did this I did a color test. I had a fluorescent fixture there with two 40 watt daylight bulbs that made my pink-fleshed hand look like day old chicken. There was no color to my hand. Holding my hand under a halogen lamp nearby showed the pink of my skin quite obviously. I constructed an eight foot long panel and installed five porcelain fixtures (like the author did) and installed three 100 watt frosted halogen bulbs and two blue colored CFL bulbs. The color difference is quite different. The look is more diffused, something the author discussed in his article, and certainly not as harsh looking. It kind of reminds me of an overcast day and not a bright sunny day. The dark greens are truly dark now, almost black, and the neon greens in some of my scenery is lessened so the bright greens are a more natural tone. And the white dry brushed tones on the mountains are now slightly grayer in color. I think the area could be brighter but that may take away from the effect the different bulbs are providing. It may only require a reflector panel installed to push all the light towards the layout instead of radiating it around the area. There may always be dark spots no matter what lighting is installed. I may also try different bulbs of varying wattages to achieve a better balance of light and color. In total now, I have almost 1000 watts of light for over 102 square feet of layout. I did search this sight for what others have done in regard for layout lighting but am curious if anyone has tried different things to get quality lighting and what if any success has any one had with using blue colored bulbs as the author did in the Model Railroader article. -Paul
I am in the process of trying to improve my N Scale layout lighting by getting rid of the fluorescent fixtures and going with incandescent and halogen lighting. Recently I dumped several fluorescent fixtures when I made some drastic changes to my layout earlier this year. I always had several halogen track lighting fixtures up since a majority of my layout is a 27 foot long by two foot set up. (I also have two 8 foot by 3 foot loop back sections) I have repositioned the track lighting fixtures at least twice now trying to get a good balance of light and shadows. Fortunately the way the joists run in my basement the track lighting fixtures easily slip in between the joists and nearly disappear. Total wattage on those three halogen track lighting fixtures is about 800 watts.
Another goal of mine was to eliminate the need for the general task lighting that I use for every day purposes such as layout building or model building. With my layout around the walls, the general task lighting distracts from the layout and the ultimate goal of installing layout-only lighting was a high priority. Going through some old issues of Model Railroader I came across an article dated March 1996 ‘Lighting the Great Western’ where the author discussed how to effectively light a layout. In the article he describes how John Allen’s infamous G&D layout was lit with over 4,000 watts of light, most of it neon. Allen rejected incandescent and fluorescents. Most of us would never consider neon nor would we be able to justify the expense.
The author of the article ultimately used a combination of 100 watt and 75 watt incandescent bulbs and 25 watt blue incandescents. He emphasized lighting the back panels and backdrops with lights behind fascia panels that permitted the darkened aisles to add drama to the room. This was a goal of mine, also; darken the aisles so the visitors eyes are attracted to the layout and not the floor. For the 1,400 square foot layout the author installed just over 4,000 watts of light. That amount of light is not in the cards for my layout.
The thing that caught my eye the most of this article was the use of low wattage blue lights for night time running and color balance. So I decided to give it a try. I installed a new fascia over one part of my layout that is primarily mountains. Before I did this I did a color test. I had a fluorescent fixture there with two 40 watt daylight bulbs that made my pink-fleshed hand look like day old chicken. There was no color to my hand. Holding my hand under a halogen lamp nearby showed the pink of my skin quite obviously.
I constructed an eight foot long panel and installed five porcelain fixtures (like the author did) and installed three 100 watt frosted halogen bulbs and two blue colored CFL bulbs. The color difference is quite different. The look is more diffused, something the author discussed in his article, and certainly not as harsh looking. It kind of reminds me of an overcast day and not a bright sunny day. The dark greens are truly dark now, almost black, and the neon greens in some of my scenery is lessened so the bright greens are a more natural tone. And the white dry brushed tones on the mountains are now slightly grayer in color.
I think the area could be brighter but that may take away from the effect the different bulbs are providing. It may only require a reflector panel installed to push all the light towards the layout instead of radiating it around the area. There may always be dark spots no matter what lighting is installed. I may also try different bulbs of varying wattages to achieve a better balance of light and color. In total now, I have almost 1000 watts of light for over 102 square feet of layout. I did search this sight for what others have done in regard for layout lighting but am curious if anyone has tried different things to get quality lighting and what if any success has any one had with using blue colored bulbs as the author did in the Model Railroader article.
-Paul
Over the weekend I installed an aluminum reflector sheet above the lighting panel to help push light back down onto the layout. It really helped to bring more light down instead of it being wasted in the rafters. I would say it is 25% brighter than w/o the reflector. I also tried an LED bulb and found the one I purchased has a harsh tone to it very simlar to the daylight fluorescents tubes I removed. LEDs are very efficient $wise but this one may need a shade to block the harsh look.
The other thing that I have noticed about the new 100 watt halogen and blue colored bulb combo is that the blue painted sky backdrops look, well, a better looking blue. There is a section where old track lighting fixtures with halogen only bulbs and the new combo overlap. Where the blue combo lighting is splashing on the backdrop, there is now a distinct difference between the white clouds and the blue sky. The white clouds have popped out in color. So there must be something to the blue color rendering that the original author of the MR article hit on.
I think this new lighting panel was a good choice, I'm very happy the way it turned out. Its bright and the colors look good. I hope my work helps out some one else who is undecided on layout lighting or is simply looking to improve layout lighting. I have a couple other ideas I want to investigate yet but if any one else has some ideas on this subject, I would like to hear them.
Paul, one thing you haven't mentioned (I think)... has the train room become a lot hotter due to the use of halogen bulbs? We have them in a very small form on our boat and they produce an amazing amount of heat even with a 12 volt battery powering them.
I've noticed that most big box store track lighting now comes with halogen lighting and was thinking of using incandescent bulbs in those fixtures instead.
What's the room temp difference in your train room before and after the new lights have been installed?
Thanks.
Raised on the Erie Lackawanna Mainline- Supt. of the Black River Transfer & Terminal R.R.
The layout is in the basement, of course, so there is no temperature difference that I can tell. When I have the dehumidifier running during the summer months, that's when I can tell there is a difference in the comfort level. Dry versus wet. My basement living area only gets warm when I have a bunch of people over. Otherwise, it is usually on the chilly side year round.
Thanks Paul. I'm upstairs in a room with no windows so completely different environments. Guess I'll just have to experiment. Hopefully most halogen equipped track lighting can take standard incandescent bulbs or at least reflectors... Glad your experiments seem to be working out for the most part.
Instead of dumping the fluorescent lighting in favor of halogen or incandescent, both of which produce a lot more heat than fluorescent, why not just find a more suitable fluorescent bulb which is available in many color shades?
Rich
Alton Junction
I have had a lot of Layout Owners seem confused as to layout lighting!
By confused - I mean they don't know how to light the layout (one 40 watt bulb in the middle of a 4x8 to having several fluorescent shop lights hanging around a 24 x 24 basement and then expect you to read the car numbers on the HO cars (let alone N Scale) and wonder why mistakes are made!
I decided early on with my latest layout I was going to light the thing up.
I have a LOT of Fluorescent lights in 4 ft & 8 ft configurations with single, two and four tube sets with a total of 8000 watts giving about 3.5 watts per sq ft in a room space of 2131 sq ft.
While the above value doesn't mean much - it gives me a good way to figure the brightness value of my room.
I also use a LUX meter and try to get a value of 100 plus with it setting on the layout itself!
As for those special tube colors (daylight - warm white - etc.) I want the layout bright enough to see the equipment and use the cool whites. As for taking pictures - that is for professionals - let them figure out how to make it look right under the available light!
And as for the Shadow Box effect and not wanting visitors to be looking at the floor - If I was that worried about the visitors not looking at the layout and had to force them to look at it - I would probably review my SCENERY techniques! ;-)
Besides I don't want someone tripping and falling because they can not see where they are walking - because the aisle ways are too dark!
BOB H - Clarion, PA
One last thing to address your question, Rich. (Besides I don't want to take over the OP's thread).
In my own case fluorescent lighting gives me severe migraine headaches. They are a common trigger for migrainers. Some of us (me included) can actually see the oscillations (light-wise) in the air! They also seem brighter to me even though (depending on the bulb) it might not be.
Many migrainers are light sensitive and have to wear shades out "there" in the real world.
I've tried several different types of fl. bulbs and no luck. Drop ceiling speckled glass or valances help but it's just going to have to be incandescent in my own case. Maybe someday, LEDs but I also require dimming capability and most LEDs are too bright for me to look into for more than a second.
There are tens of thousands of us in the M R world. It doesn't occur to most people but I've had to let ops hosts know why I'm wearing a broad brimmed hat sometimes. Maybe you've see "us" at an Ops session or open house...
So...that's MY story with lighting needs and switch to incandescent. Back to our OP!
We have a guy where I work who is always getting migraines so he wears sun glasses to help negate the effect of the fluorescents. My goal was to have a better lit layout and better color rendering. I was unhappy with the fluorescents and found a different method from an old MR article. I think I've accomplished both but still have a way to go. The blue CFLs seem to produce the desired color rendition as the article states. I may add more in other areas now. I don't have a problem with heat nor are my aisles darkened to the point where people can't see. There is plenty of wash light to navigate without tripping or falling. When I shut off the general task lighting the effect of light only over the layout makes for a professional appearance for lack of a better term. It looks like more thought and effort into my layout to make it more visitor friendly. That is probably a better description.
I think there is a lot more to model railroading than just putting train to track. I've been modeling trains since my mother purchased my first N scale Rapido set in the late 1960s. My first layout was a circle on the back of a small chalkboard complete with lichen as scenery. I've read hundreds if not thousands of magazines and have always been amazed at what was not only on the track but what was above and below as well. Isn't our mission to help each other when we find a better way to do things? I found something that improved the look of my layout and I wanted to share it with you all.
Fluorescents give me a headache, but not a migraine if I am in them too long also, BUT, I have had no such issue with my full spectrum Fluorescents in the train room. These give off a very close appearance to daylight, make all of the colors pop just right and there is no yellowing of the whites in photos. No need for other lights while taking pictures. It's worth your while to buy a twin pack of bulbs for about $5 and try them in one of your old fixtures
ratled
Modeling the Klamath River area in HO on a proto-lanced sub of the SP “The State of Jefferson Line”
Capt. Grimek One last thing to address your question, Rich. (Besides I don't want to take over the OP's thread). In my own case fluorescent lighting gives me severe migraine headaches. They are a common trigger for migrainers. Some of us (me included) can actually see the oscillations (light-wise) in the air! They also seem brighter to me even though (depending on the bulb) it might not be. Many migrainers are light sensitive and have to wear shades out "there" in the real world. I've tried several different types of fl. bulbs and no luck. Drop ceiling speckled glass or valances help but it's just going to have to be incandescent in my own case. Maybe someday, LEDs but I also require dimming capability and most LEDs are too bright for me to look into for more than a second. There are tens of thousands of us in the M R world. It doesn't occur to most people but I've had to let ops hosts know why I'm wearing a broad brimmed hat sometimes. Maybe you've see "us" at an Ops session or open house... So...that's MY story with lighting needs and switch to incandescent. Back to our OP!
Wow, I never knew that. I consider myself fortunate that fluorescent lighting does not adversely affect me.
I use fluorescent lights, but am lucky that I'm not one of those that suffers from headaches because of them. When I installed the lights, I had them directly over the center of the layout. THAT was the problem. They created shadows along the front and rear of the layout. When I moved them to just outside the edge of the benchwork, it made a world of difference. Check out the pics below. They are exactly as I photographed them (unedited).
Before
After
Marlon
See pictures of the Clinton-Golden Valley RR
I put up a pair of 4' flourescents over my yard area, hoping it would provide adequate light to facilitate car cards, car numbers and the like. I'm going to replace them with a couple of old bathroom vanity light bars, the kind with 5 or 6 sockets, and use CFL's. My general room lighting is 600 watts of directional, dimmable track lighting, and a 3-light fixture on the ceiling fan over the peninsula with CFL's.
My layout is in the attic of a 2.5 story old house, so I want to be mindful of how much heat is generated, and also of how much energy is being consumed. I have a couple of halogen lights I can set up for taking photos, but I'd never use them for regular room lighting.
Lee
Route of the Alpha Jets www.wmrywesternlines.net
" I'm going to replace them with a couple of old bathroom vanity light bars, the kind with 5 or 6 sockets"
Lee, that is genious. I would have never thought of that.
And Marlon, I had shadows, too and that's why i moved the track lighting fixtures, to get more light in front so as to not cast shadows.
Thanks guys.
I work at the Habitat for Humanity ReStore... you can find those light strips a dime a dozen these days. Look up to see if there's one close by.
If you've made up your mind to ditch fluorescents, there are good reasons to do so. I went another direction, in part due to a low overhead, suspended ceiling in my basement.
If you have existing fluorescent lighting and the main issue is color rendition, there is another solution, which is to use Chroma 50 (Sylvania 5000K is virtually the same) specification bulbs. These greatly improve the appearance of the light for me and are considered industry standard in situations where accurate color rendition is important. Model railroading fits that.
Another thing to consider is using track lighting to supplement the fluorescent lights. I used halogen lighting there, along with Chroma 50 bulbs, and greatly improved the appearance of my layout.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Paul
Thanks for sharing your experience with the halogens and blue CFLs.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
I had seven florescent fixtures put up in my spare bedroom layout but the humming was driving me crazy so I read up on flourescents (on the internet of course) and found that you can buy flourescents with electronic ballasts that don't hum or flicker. Cost maybe 1/3 more for the electronic ballasts and they are a little harder to find but I had all 7 fixtures replaced and it was worth the cost to exchange them out. No hum whatsoever with new fixtures. I did not notice any flicker with the original fixtures but I'm guessing that since the electronic ballasts are not supposed to flicker that they may not cause migranes, maybe something to check into if you have that problem.
Mike B,
Good point on up dating fluorescent fixtures. They're designed to save energy, but have benefits -- like buzz reduction -- that are worth the price of admission alone.
I'm not sure this helps those who are especially sensitive to the 60hz flicker thing, but is a decided improvement for those who just thought of it as an annoying noise.
In my case, I really NEEDED to put fixtures between the rafters because of clearance issues. Full incandescent would've been too expensive and hot when the room was prepped 20 years ago. The halogens I mentioned help with fill lighting and for those scenic features not aligned to be best lit by the florescents.
I'm hoping LEDs come down in price and improve in performance. If someone can come to market with the "right stuff" for the model railroad trade in LEDs at a reasonable cost, they'll be well-received.
Everyone's situation is different with lighting. Don't take anything as a prescription, rather as a possible solution pending further study for your particular application.
An excerpt from Wikipedia re: electronic ballasts:
"An electronic lamp ballast uses solid state electronic circuitry to provide the proper starting and operating electrical condition to power one or more fluorescent lamps and more recently HID lamps. Electronic ballasts usually change the frequency of the power from the standard mains (e.g., 60 Hz in U.S.) frequency to 20,000 Hz or higher, substantially eliminating the stroboscopic effect of flicker (a product of the line frequency) associated with fluorescent lighting (seephotosensitive epilepsy). In addition, because more gas remains ionized in the arc stream, the lamps actually operate at about 9% higher efficacy above approximately 10 kHz. Lamp efficacy increases sharply at about 10 kHz and continues to improve until approximately 20 kHz.[3] Because of the higher efficiency of the ballast itself and the improvement of lamp efficacy by operating at a higher frequency, electronic ballasts offer higher system efficacy for low pressure lamps like the fluorescent lamp. For HID lamps there is no improvement of the lamp efficacy in using higher frequency, but for these lamps the ballast losses are lower at higher frequencies and also the light depreciation is lower meaning more light after a given operating time of say 10 000 hours. Some HID lamp types like the Ceramic discharge metal halide lamp have reduced reliability when operated at high frequencies in the range of 20kHz to 200 kHz and for these lamps a square wave low frequency current drive is mostly used with frequency in the range of 100 to 400 Hz, with the same advantage of lower light depreciation. Electronic ballasts are often based on the SMPS topology, first rectifying the input power and then chopping it at a high frequency. Advanced electronic ballasts may allow dimming via pulse-width modulation or via changing the frequency to a higher value and remote control and monitoring via networks such asLonWorks, DALI, DMX-512, DSI or simple analog control using a 0-10V DC brightness control signal. Recently also systems remotely controlling the dim level via a wireless mesh network have been introduced."
Dante
There are about six or so lighting methods conducive to layout operation. As a model railroader and an electrician, I am familiar with all of them and know a bit about them from a practical sense.
Getting rid of flourescent fixtures is wasteful; especially when there are daybright" lamps out there that will intechange with what we have. One thing not mentioned here is that flourescent lamps will not produce shadows; or will, at least minimally. My thought is to employ rope lighting, both natural and blue. there is the dimming capability in which you can produce many daylight effects, by virtue of mixing; such as sunny, overcast, and night scenes (sans the natural). To my mind, a set of flourescents employed/ (installed just behind the valence) along with rope systems strategically placed, will give you pretty good lighting. You will probably never get close to the natural "north light" effects produced by nature, but this will get fairly close.
Has anyone tried flat panel LED lighting?
I have one LED and am not really satisifed with the look of the light. It is rather harsh looking for my tastes.
I was not looking for a concensus on what lighting to use for my layout. I found an interesting (old) article that had some techniques that I had never employed before so I wanted to try them out to see how they would fit my demands. Fortunately it worked out well...for a change. It was good that not one single lighting technique works for every one. It does appear though that a combination of lighting, whether it be fluorescent, incandescent, halogen etc is the way to go. Strking a balance between color, shadows, brightness of light and even heat generated is the best scenario option.
We spend countless hours creating the perfect color green for our forests, and the right brown and rust colors for the bridges and rails. My rolling stock is not all box car red; it is a myriad of colors from every point of the color spectrum. So why wouldn't we want to make sure that our layout lighting recreates those colors accurately?
Some of us have been modeling a long time and others are relatively new at this, and anything we can do to help improve our layouts or help others find a better way to do things is important to maintain a bright future for model railroading. Sorry, couldn't help it, pardon the pun.