help- Small N Scale Layout

[jamesbaker]

Ok I have been asked to build a small N scale christmas layout for a friends office. I will be paid in advance for supplies once I finsh the list.

Here is the list of requirements from him. 
1. Has to be N-scale
2. 1 or 2 main Lines 
3. Needs to have one or two Bridges
4. DC layout
5. Must fit in space provided (can be a Bit larger IF need be)!
6. Must be done by November 14th.

Here is a diagram of the space with lengths.

http://www.photolocker.net/images/BakersLayout/tablesize2.jpg

Any Help or Ideas and I will be much greatful!!
Baker

[Vail and Southwestern RR]

Is it meant to run 'unsupervised'?  Sidings, etc,. for show, not operation?  Just thinking a bit....

Any particular requirements on what runs on it?

 

[GraniteRailroader]

Perhaps something like a loop with 14" radius (28" diameter) turns on the outside with a dog-bone with 12" radius on the inside?

What about the use of one of Bachman's auto-reversers for traction / trolly layouts? You could run a Budd RDC or even a small locomotive like an RS-3 and a coach or two back and forth between to "Drop in" station models.  You could have a loop of track for something to go round and round on keeping it always moving, and the point-to-point bit would add "interest" with the "How'd you do that???" factor...

[Gandy Dancer]

I will be paid in advance for supplies once I finsh the list.

Is track plan design consulting one of the supplies on the list?

requirements
2. 1 or 2 main Lines 

That is not a good requirement.  What does he mean by main lines.  Loops of track for a continuously orbiting trains?

3. Needs to have one or two Bridges

Does it matter what the bridges go over?  They could cross another track, a pretend road, swamp, stream, or a river   Does it matter what the size and type of the bridge is?  The possibilities are almost endless.  There are simple culverts, deck bridges, truss, tressle, girder, lift or draw bridges.  The difference in looks are dramatic.

Is this layout supposed to be advertising or representing something significant.  Is "Christmas" the most important element of this.  Or is it just sort of a conversation piece?

Which side or sides is it to be viewed from any by whom?  Clients, customers, or only himself?

It seems to me a simple up-and-over twice around might be the ticket.  If a really tricky operations is desired perhaps a twice around with a hidden (in a tunnel) slip switch randomly thrown rather than a crossing would keep people guessing which track the train would emerge from next.

[jamesbaker]

Hello once again.

Yes the train or trains will be continuously Running durning office hours.  It will be watched over for derailments so any problems will be resolved asap.

 The bridge can go over another track or road. As for what type of bridge it is mainly for eye candy. It will be mainly a small Santa Land all covered in snow. So a creek or swamp would most likely be out of the question.  It will also have alot of snow covered Pines around the town.  We were talking today and we though maybe a tunnel would be nice twards the back with part of the town a little bit above the rest. Maybe 3" or so higher.

 Christmas is the most important element of this, It will also be a conversation piece! The layout is for Clients, kids, his wife and him.

As for the Engine and cars. I have already bought all of the rolling stock but no engines yet.  I am still trying to find a Road Name/ engine that ran through my town (Tamms IL) between 1985-1990 about when the line shut down.

Thanks
Baker

P.S. I am pretty well doing all the design work and the laybor for free.  He is just buying me lunch.  Unless he gives me some thing else that I don't know of. I don't exspect much his is a long time friend.

[jamesbaker]

Here is a link that shows what will be seen.  The RED lines are windows!  But will will be seen more from the Main Viewing area.

 http://www.photolocker.net/images/BakersLayout/tablesize2_1.jpg

Thanks
Baker

[stebbycentral]

It seems to me a simple up-and-over twice around might be the ticket.  If a really tricky operations is desired perhaps a twice around with a hidden (in a tunnel) slip switch randomly thrown rather than a crossing would keep people guessing which track the train would emerge from next.

If I interpret this properly, then it is very similar to the design I developed for a 4 x 8 N scale layout that I built several years back.  I call it a "folded figure-8" in that it's the classic over- and-under figure-8 but with one loop inside of the other.  Properly senicked it looks for the most part like a double track main line, except where the one line elevates to cross over the other.  The train makes two trips around the layout for every one circuit of the track. 

I also included a set of crossovers within the context of a small rail yard.  When set properly they isolated the bottom loop from the top.  That allowed me to run two trains by "parking" one train on the upper loop.  Later on when more space became available to me, I cut the layout in two and extended the center section by an additional 4 feet.  But it's still basically the same design.  If I were to rebuild it again, I would probably use the same concept, but I'd make it larger so I could employ large radius curves.

 

[Joe Hohmann]

For me, Kato snap-together track w/roadbed would be a "given". Just have the bridges cross over "icy streams". 2 loops, no sidings or fancy track plans. Since most viewers will be "non-train people", scenics will be the highlight of the layout for them. I paint on the "snow" with white latex, and sprinkle on craft store "Twinklets" Diamond Dust while wet. Joe

[jamesbaker]

Do you have any pictures of what your method looks like?

I was not sure if I wanted to use flex track pr Kato Snap.  I want it to look as real as possibe!

Baker

[jamesbaker]

Here is a track plan that I was looking at. What do you guys think about this?

http://www.photolocker.net/images/BakersLayout/done.jpg

All comments are welcome
Baker

[jamesbaker]

Does any body have anything to offer?

[bearman]

Given your goals, I think the track plan will work.  Athough you could extend the outerloop into the SW portion and come around to the east with a straight section to the crossover.  I don't know however, if the radius will be totight.

[bearman]

I could be wrong, but I think he is getting lunch in the deal for his time.  Supplies will be paid for, otherwise I would tend to be on your side.

[Gandy Dancer]

Here is one I came up with.  Basically I envision vintage type trains on the lower loop.  4-4-0 type locomotives and turn of the 20th century rolling stock.  The double track in the back is hidden from view so one train can be stored while the other is orbiting.  The bad part of this arrangement is that the turnouts (most likely place to derail) are hidden. I recommend Peco as I believe they are the least trouble prone. 

Anyway the yellow is the hill helping to hid the tracks behind and under it.  The brown is the Christmas village roads. 

The funny bulge in the center front of the layout is a place where the railroad is jogging around a frozen lake so you could get some ice-skaters in there.   The curve up the left side would be in a cut below the city street and trolly tracks.  Front street is right behind the station and the circle on the end of the street is where the city Christmas tree would be.  The city is on a slope so each layer of buildings are easier to see.  That is the buildings between the station tracks and the front tracks are lower.  Note how the city street goes to down to the left down and then splits going under the trolly tracks and over the normal rail tracks.  This will be a step grade but horses are strong. 

As someone else suggested I see the upper track as a back and forth operation for a trolly car.  The upper part is hidden in a tunnel so the trolly can go in and remain there for an indetermined amount of time.  This of course will require a special circuit. The second track by the station is just a place to spot another passenger or express car for scenic purposes. 

As usual click the image to enlarge

If you got really clever with the electronics one could make the two trains on the loop automatically alternate in appearance.   Also a second hidden track on the trolly line could be added and make two trollies alternate their appearance.

Looking at the finished plan I've probably gotten way too far into the angle cut on the left side of the space. 

[Gandy Dancer]

A twice around with a twist (the only way I could figure to get the bridges in).   The red road was an alternate I saw after I had drawn the brown road across the bottom (which would once again have to have a very steep grade).  In this one the village to the right is more or less flat while the buildings to the left are elevated.

[Gandy Dancer]

And finally one with lots of movement.  A double track main line lets a passenger and freight continually run in opposite directions.  The "y" shape back-and-forth trolly track only needs one extra little circut to change the turnout on so the trolly goes down different branches at different times.

 

[jamesbaker]

Thank you.

     I was not exspecting any one to go biuld me a layout deisgn. Although it was very thoughtful of you.  You have deffently opened up my mind.  I am putting them all on the peg board for talking over with my friend this weekend.

Thanks Again
          Baker

[bearman]

I think Gandy's second one is the one.  I suspect that for a project of the type you are looking for, a layout which provides for continuous running without the need for constant hands on operation, this one wins out.