What is the difference between: H0n2, H0n3 & H0n30, appearently you have narrowgauge, narrowgauge and narrowgauge!
What should I choose if I were to make a layout in narrowgauge?
Hi Gerard,
HOn2 represents 2 ft. gauge - like the narrow gauge lines in Maine. In HO scale, the gauge is about 7mm, but you could get by with Z scale track, which has a gauge of 6.5mm.
HOn3 represents 3ft. gauge - like the lines ín Colorado and New Mexico. 3 ft. gauge seems to be the "standard" narrow gauge in the US. In HO scale, the gauge is 10.5mm
HOn30 or HOn2 1/2 represents 2 1/2 ft. gauge, which is rather uncommon in North America, but widely popular in Europe.
There is no commercially made HOn2 stock I know of, so this is truly a scratch builders gauge. HOn3 is a different story. Blackstone Models has a nice selection of D&RGW and RGS engines and rolling stock, but the beautifully detailed models come at a price. There is also plenty of brass around.
HOn30 locos and rolling stock following US prototype practice are available from Minitrains, but are either rather generic or based on the cartoon series "Fiddletown & Copperopolis". Of course, if you like European railways, there is plenty of stuff available, all the way from affordable to requires robbing a bank.
So, if you really want to build a narrow gauge layout, I´d recommend to go down the HOn3 route.
RD-Hobby in Germany stocks Blackstone products.
Back in 1974, I bought my one and only HOn3 engine - a Westside Model Co. (brass) D&RGW T-12 Tenwheeler, which I painted, (incorrectly) lettered and weathered. I still have it, but i never made it to seeing it run a layout, only on a short piece of test track.
Edit: Years ago, I made a plan for a small shel-type layout in our spare bedroom (part of it), but for whatever reason, I never got started on it.
Narrow gauge layouts can be held quite simple, as the prototype were usually short on cash and tried to economize wherever possible.
Happy times!
Ulrich (aka The Tin Man)
"You´re never too old for a happy childhood!"
Just to add a couple of details to Ulrich's answer, HOn30 is actually HO scale trains running on N scale track, or track that has the same rail spacing as N scale. As Ulrich says it is not a common North American gauge, but that doesn't mean that you can't have a lot of fun with it.
The critter in my avatar is HOn30. It is scratchbuilt using the motor and drive system from an N scale Bachmann 4-4-0 steamer. The motor is in the gondola which was the original steam tender with a few changes.
Normal N scale track doesn't really work all that well with HOn30 because the ties are out of scale, i.e. too small and too many. However, Peco makes HOn30 track with the proper scale tie spacing and the ties are actually a bit uneven in keeping with the way that a lot of small narrow gauge track would have been laid.
If you want RTR then HOn30 doesn't offer many items, especially for North America. You would be better off to go with HOn3.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
In the 1980's HOn30 became popular as an less expensive alternative to HOn3 and also as an alternative to HOn2 for which little was available. It is still a good alternative today.
A source of HOn30 from Canada
http://www.central-hobbies.com/products/minitrains.html
Shapeways has lots of parts for HOn30
https://www.shapeways.com/marketplace/miniatures/trains/?tag=hon30
PECO HOn30 track from Walthers
https://www.walthers.com/products/layout/track-and-accessories/scale/hon30-scale/show/20?match=AND
HOn30 also available on EBAY
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
DSchmitt - the OP lives in the Nretherlands, so he has a much easier access to Peco track and Minitrains products.
Tinplate ToddlerHOn30 locos and rolling stock following US prototype practice are available from Minitrains, but are either rather generic or based on the cartoon series "Fiddletown & Copperopolis".
If the current Minitrains offerings use the tooling from the line offered by AHM in the 1960s, then the Plymouth diesel and the 0-4-0T steamer are accurate models of actual prototypes. Moreover the freight cars offered by AHM/Minitrains were the small two axle types that would actually have been seen on genuine 30" gauge prototypes -- usually contractor's railroads, or light mining/quarry/industrial railroads. AHM also had some "fantasy" engines available that were Americanized (sort of) from European prototypes similar to those sold by the pioneering Eggerbahn and perhaps others in the 1960s. I recall a small end cab switcher with a pantagraph on a roof, and a rather goofy "Wild West" 0-4-0 that Model Railroader said reminded them of the cartoon steam locomotive in Disney's Dumbo cartoon.
Here is an odd bit of trivia - if you bought an AHM Minitrains freight car it came with a "free" piece of N gauge sectional straight track.
AHM cataloged but never offered some offerings in HOn 2 1/2 that were based on Maine 2 foot gauge prototypes. They lost interest in the Minitrains offerings and all but gave away the remaining Minitrains train sets - got mine for $4.99. Steam 0-4-0T, some tiny freight cars, and an oval of track.
HOn30 (I do prefer HOn 2 1/2 because N gauge track is not exactly 30 inches in HO, but it is close, and saying "two and a half" captures that element of imprecision to my mind) in that sense was more prototypical than what we see in most Bachmann On30 (or again, On 2 1/2) because most of that is re-gauged from 3 foot narrow gauge prototypes with only a relatively few being the Porter/Plymouth/Whitcomb sort of small gauge contractor type engines - and even fewer freight cars of the sort that would be used on genuine 30" gauge American railroads of which there were some.
I have seen the revived Minitrains line for sale and while I understand the engines have better motors now - they could hardly be worse than the originals -- the absurd flanges and toy train couplers make me regard them as horridly over-priced. On the positive side the track Peco makes is way better than using track meant for N scale trains.
If our OP wants to model American I'd suggest he look into the availability of actual, genuine HOn3.
Dave Nelson
dknelsonIf the current Minitrains offerings use the tooling from the line offered by AHM in the 1960s, then the Plymouth diesel and the 0-4-0T steamer are accurate models of actual prototypes. Moreover the freight cars offered by AHM/Minitrains were the small two axle types that would actually have been seen on genuine 30" gauge prototypes -- usually contractor's railroads, or light mining/quarry/industrial railroads. AHM also had some "fantasy" engines available that were Americanized (sort of) from European prototypes similar to those sold by the pioneering Eggerbahn and perhaps others in the 1960s. I recall a small end cab switcher with a pantagraph on a roof, and a rather goofy "Wild West" 0-4-0 that Model Railroader said reminded them of the cartoon steam locomotive in Disney's Dumbo cartoon.
The current Minitrains range of products has nothing in common with the old AHM/Minitrains stuff. Minitrains has resurrected some of the old Egger Bahn products, but also developed a number of new models, mostly of European prototype, but also a 0-6-0 Porter and a 0-4-4 Forney.
Minitrains
dknelsonI have seen the revived Minitrains line for sale and while I understand the engines have better motors now - they could hardly be worse than the originals -- the absurd flanges and toy train couplers make me regard them as horridly over-priced.
I don´t know what you have seen, but the flanges are according to NEM, not NMRA RP25, and yes, they are a littlem, but not horribly oversized. The coupler is a European standard coupler, because this is where Minitrains sell most of their products.
I am quite sure, however, that the OP´s interest is not in Minitrains, but modelling a Colorado 3 ft. NG line.
Ulrich, the revived Minitrains I was talking about from BCH International were exact copies of the AHM line's packaging and American prototype locomotives and cars, including the simple loop and hook coupler, only with better motors and higher prices. I was not aware of the other Minitrains offerings.
http://mrr.trains.com/news-reviews/staff-reviews/2010/10/bch-international-hon2-12-minitrains-set
There is always Sn3.5.
S scale equipment running on HO track.
There is lots available in S Scale or can be converted from other sources.
http://trainweb.org/crocon/sscale.html
Vist my Sn3.5 in the 1870's site at:
http://www.chainsawjunction.com/sn3_5/
Thank you if you visit
Harold
I recently posted several pictures of an HOn30 micro layout I built in the MR galleries . I had been given an old Minitrains Plymouth set some years ago, but, as was noted above, the originals were poor runners. I was able to buy a couple of new Minitrains Plymouths on eBay, as well as a German prototype Gmeander locomotive. The Gmeander has a flywheel and runs particularly well. The Plymouths are decent runners, though, lacking flywheels, they’re not quite as good. I’ve had a blast with HOn30.
HOn30 was popularized by Bob Hayden and Dave Frary back in the early 70's with articles in RMC on modeling Maine 2 ft railroads using N scale track, trucks, and locomotive mechanisms. It was and is a relatively low cost and easy way to model 2 ft in HO.
If you want a slightly larger scale for 2 foot models and closer to the 2 ft gauge you can model Sn2 using HOn3 track, trucks, and locomotive mechanisms. Some brass forneys were imported a few years ago in this scale. If you can find them, MDC made HOn3 locomotive kits which could be converted.
Paul
IRONROOSTERIf you want a slightly larger scale for 2 foot models and closer to the 2 ft gauge you can model Sn2 using HOn3 track, trucks, and locomotive mechanisms. Some brass forneys were imported a few years ago in this scale. If you can find them, MDC made HOn3 locomotive kits which could be converted. Paul
Unless there is readily available motive power a scale will languish.
Sn2 on HOn3 track is a great idea but MDC HOn3 is scarce as hen's teeth.
All about locos, the same problem with HOn30. The new Minitrains stuff is great but doesn't go with the available rolling stock.
Having tried HOn30 conversions of the newer N-Scale steam, taking the N-Scale locos apart and putting them back together always seems to lose the good running characteristics.
Congrats, Ulrich, I think that is a pretty neat layout plan.
Bear "It's all about having fun."
A lot of good information here... From an operations' perspective, HOn3 is probably better than HOn30. Kadee offers products in that gauge (couplers, etc.) and you can get dual gauge track (HO/HOn3). My current layout, under construction, will have both gauges.
Simon
snjroyKadee offers products in that gauge (couplers, etc.)
The only thing thats different between HOn3 and HOn30 is the track is 6" narrower with n30. The couplers should be the same. That having been said, Im using Sergent Sharon Couplers on all my HOn3.
BMMECNYC snjroy Kadee offers products in that gauge (couplers, etc.) The only thing thats different between HOn3 and HOn30 is the track is 6" narrower with n30. The couplers should be the same. That having been said, Im using Sergent Sharon Couplers on all my HOn3.
snjroy Kadee offers products in that gauge (couplers, etc.)
The couplers are not the same. There is not much HOn30 stock other than Minitrains around and all of it, including the European stuff, are not equipped with a Kadee-like knuckle couple.
Tinplate Toddler BMMECNYC snjroy Kadee offers products in that gauge (couplers, etc.) The only thing thats different between HOn3 and HOn30 is the track is 6" narrower with n30. The couplers should be the same. That having been said, Im using Sergent Sharon Couplers on all my HOn3. The couplers are not the same. There is not much HOn30 stock other than Minitrains around and all of it, including the European stuff, are not equipped with a Kadee-like knuckle couple.
The point I was trying to make (poorly worded) is that Kadee sells HOn3 couplers, which should work just fine for HOn30, because they are both HO scale. Trip pins might have to be removed if the cars sit lower? Since n30 is mostly a scratchbuilders scale, I wouldnt want someone thinking there are no couplers out there on the market...
You might want to consider using n scale couplers (e.g., micro-trains). To my knowledge, none of the HON30 (or European narrow gauge) manufacturers have been using these, so you would need to adapt them to your rolling stock.
Here is a thread on that topic:
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/t/252285.aspx
Fitting Kadee couplers to those tiny engines and cars might prove to require some major surgical work, for which I frankly don´t see the benefit, as most of the available RTR stuff of US prototype is set in the link-and-pin era.
But that´s one´s own choice.
D&RGW and C&S are surely the narrow gage railroads with the most rolling stock available off-the-shelf. But there are others.
There were quite a few 3' gage logging railroads. If that's your pleasure.
There were also a number of "general purpose" 3' railroads.
My favorite is the Nevada County Narrow Gauge Railroad (yes, that's its real name). It ran from Nevada City CA to Colfax CA to connect with the transcontinental Central Pacific at Colfax CA. It was completed in 1876 and ran until 1942. You can easily get a feel for the countryside using satellite view. There was at least one spectacular bridge, across Bear River:
early days (when built, highest railroad bridge in California):
later days:
Curiously, for a good while there was an electric trolley line that paralleled the railroad between Nevada City and Grass Valley. And it was standard gage, it appears.
Oh, yes. There is one (1) model available in brass of its #9, a very attractive 2-8-0.
Ed
PS: I forgot to mention the gold mines.
Tinplate Toddler Fitting Kadee couplers to those tiny engines and cars might prove to require some major surgical work, for which I frankly don´t see the benefit, as most of the available RTR stuff of US prototype is set in the link-and-pin era. But that´s one´s own choice.