I'm designing an HO around the wall layout with a 26" minimum main line radius and a 1955-era theme. Since it's a really odd-shaped room with many walls, I am having a really difficult time trying to get a spur into one corner and have to resort to 15" curves to do it. All of the trackwork is Micro Engineering code 70 flex track. The industry will be a meat cold storage warehouse served with 37' reefers using an 0-8-0 swither or a 2-8-0 consolidation.
I've never had any experience with curves that sharp and I was wondering if 40' cars of that era would have problems there. All cars have body mounted Kadee couplers. I think the switcher would make the curves OK due to a long drawbar, but not so sure of the 2-8-0. Both are 1960-era brass models. Anyone have any advice?
No better advice than just trying it! Build a test rack with a 15" radius curve and a couple feet of straight track at each end and run your trains over it, carefully observing how they behave.
I think that the best advice is to redesign the track plan if you can and increase the radius to at least 18" radius curves.
Or, consider N scale.
Running HO scale trains on 15" radius curves is a real challenge. Look for alternatives.
Rich
Alton Junction
Can't go to N scale. I have 156 freight cars, 78 passenger cars, and 12 locos, all HO. I cannot increase the radius because of uhm, like a concrete wall gets in the way. It's not an ordinary room -- it's a combined kitchen-dining room and has 17 walls, ya, 17 walls. It's a spare kitchen so I'm doing an around the wall layout, but has to be high enough for the track to climb over the refrigerator. I've been working on the plan using Cadrail for about 2 years, and this is the last puzzle to solve. I want to start building this month. And for what it's worth, I live in Italy and every wall is either brick or concrete, and the wall giving me problems is a convex corner that's about a foot thick. Anyone have any experience with blasting?
Just so that no one goes ape over the refrigerator thing, the unit stands 56" high so I crest over the top at 60" -- about eye level. Grade EB is 2.0% with the WB grade is 1.7% so it's all doable. Mainline bottoms out at 57", but there's a helix going down for 2 staging yards, one at 38" and the other at 50". BTW, you can still cook dinner in the kitchen.
GN_Fan,
If it's a true 15'' radius the 40's will be fine..the 2-8-0 iffy, should have center blind drivers, the pilot wheels will probably want to go the way of the drivers, so they must have no restriction in the swing....0-8-0 should make it slowly also, also should have blind center drivers. I had done it in the 50's with Mantua steamer's, but on code 100 brass track.
No need to change scales, or rip up track for one industry....Prototypes, do the same thing on some older sidings, some engines could not even be on the industry siding. Too heavy.
Do a little test and see what You think.
BTW: The Mantua's were dicast and heavy, so that did make a difference in tracking.
Take Care!
Frank
ahh, I see your dilemma, too much HO stuff and concrete walls in the way.
Well, one consolation for you is that 40' freight cars can handle 15" radius curves with the proper couplers. But, locos will be a whole other issue. The shorter the wheel base, the better. Diesel switchers should work. A 2-6-0 Mogul is a good steam engine candidate to traverse tight curves.
assuming 40' cars can negotiate the curve, there's no need to put an engine on the spur since additional cars can be placed between the engine and the cars being spotted.
greg - Philadelphia & Reading / Reading
gregc assuming 40' cars can negotiate the curve, there's no need to put an engine on the spur since additional cars can be placed between the engine and the cars being spotted.
I was just going to add this and Gregc did it already.....siding restricted to idler car use when spotting.
GN_FanIdler cars are a lot cheaper than buying a new loco.
Huh? Who passes up an opportunity for a new loco? Since it's 1955, get yourself an RS1 or a GP7. They'll handle the curve.
I have the right to remain silent. By posting here I have given up that right and accept that anything I say can and will be used as evidence to critique me.
Back in the day, Atlas made 15 inch radius curved track. I had some of it. My cars and engines took it pretty well at low speed.
But, the idea of putting down some test track and trying it sound like the way to go.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
I think 40 foot or less freight cars would be ok. For locomotives use reach cars, old or surplus cars between the engine and cars to be switched.
Ron High
Hi GN fan
At 15" radius you should be able to get up to 50' cars round it at slow speed
Your track work will need to be spot on test it thoroughly before ballasting or any thing else that will stick it perminently.
You can use a small 0-4-0 0-6-0 switcher or an idler flat.
For the flat paint it bright yellow or some thing simlar so you can find it when you need it I would also sugest a couple of simulated large concrete blocks on it one over each truck, and some hand rails for the switching crew.
regards John
You've received some good advice already, so this is not in answer to your question, but I would love to see the layout/room plan for this. It sounds like you've got a very challenging layout space, and if you've really solved all other obstacles you've encountered besides this 15"R industrial spur, there might be some valuable solutions and ideas in there to get our wheels turning. Best of luck.
P
I've got a yard that has a couple 15R curves in it. 40 foot to 60 foot cars work OK. My switcher is an RS-3 and does just fine. My GP9 and SW1200 also work.
Atlas still makes 15R sectional track. I used it to make sure the yard curve was not less than 15R.
Elmer.
The above is my opinion, from an active and experienced Model Railroader in N scale and HO since 1961.
(Modeling Freelance, Eastern US, HO scale, in 1962, with NCE DCC for locomotive control and a stand alone LocoNet for block detection and signals.) http://waynes-trains.com/ at home, and N scale at the Club.
Just as a comment, generally in the old city centre industrial areas the railroads would use 0-6-0 switchers. The short rigid wheelbase was more compatible with the tight curves (almost corners) that could be found there. Once diesels arrived, it was the Alco S-series or the EMD SW family that replaced them. Longer road units, even the RS-1, could have trouble in the sharpest curves. The 0-8-0 switchers tended to be assigned heavier duties, especially marshalling cars in a yard, or at a mine, where the extra power was needed.
In model form, of course, we often use what is actually available. Others suggest it should work for you, so give it a try. But this also gives you an excuse to buy another, smaller, locomotive.
John
For an isolated industrial spur or two, no problem, plenty of good advice already. If any specific loco has problems with it, the try another. The key is sideplay in the drivers with steam, some models have more than others even in the same wheel arrangements.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
carl425 GN_Fan Idler cars are a lot cheaper than buying a new loco. Huh? Who passes up an opportunity for a new loco? Since it's 1955, get yourself an RS1 or a GP7. They'll handle the curve.
GN_Fan Idler cars are a lot cheaper than buying a new loco.
LOL. Maybe that would be true...if He lived here in the US...but seeing as how He is from Trieste, Italy it probably cost a lot more $$$ for Him.
A lot of good suggestions here. The idea of setting up a test circle is a good one, as you can make it with your flex track. You may also find when you are actualy laying the track that you can sneak an extra 1/2" or 1" to your radius by using flex instead of sectional track.
Good luck,
Richard
zstripe carl425 GN_Fan Idler cars are a lot cheaper than buying a new loco. Huh? Who passes up an opportunity for a new loco? Since it's 1955, get yourself an RS1 or a GP7. They'll handle the curve. LOL. Maybe that would be true...if He lived here in the US...but seeing as how He is from Trieste, Italy it probably cost a lot more $$$ for Him. Take Care! Frank
Frank -- ya, you're absolutely correct. Just last month I ordered $107 worth of stuff from Caboose Hobbies in Denver, and by the time I paid the freight of $52 and the customs duty of 28 €, the total price came to about $195 delivered -- just about double the original cost. The best thing to do is to buy stuff on-line and have it shipped to my son in San Carlos, CA. Then when I go see him in 9 or 10 months, I can bring it back for free. Like they say in the movies, there's no free lunch. And just forget about trying to buy Goo, spray paint, or even half ounce bottles of enamel -- no one will ship it ouverseas.
Hello All,
Since you're running steam have you considered an 0-6-0 Saddle Tank, Porter Side Tank or S-100 Class tender-less switcher?
These will have no problems negotiating 15-inch curves.
On my diesel layout I have a USRA 0-6-0 with a Vanderbuilt tender to pull the Olde Tyme excursion train. It has no problems negotiating the 15-inch spiral loop with the 47’ passenger cars.
You might also consider a 60-ton AGEIR "Box Cab" diesel that were used for switching duties beginning in 1907.
Hope this helps.
"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"
Stimulated by a discussion in a different thread on this board, I noticed that the Trix/Marklin Big Boy actually needs a minimum curve radius of less than 15 inches (14 and 3/16, precisely). Thus, this could be a suitable switching engine for your layout... :-)
Joachim