What exactly is.......

[andregg1]

Hi to all
I have a question.
What dose "F" means.
Wikipedia say the "F" for EMD "F" model is "freight" and someone, in this forum told me is "Fifteen" from 1500 HP.
What do you know about?
thank in advance
Andre.

[lionelsoni]

It's "fifteen". The "F" locomotives were used for both freight and passengers and were equipped with steam generators for the latter service. GM locomotives of that era generally used letters that were the initials of their approximate horsepower ratings, as multiples of 300 horsepower.

[andregg1]

Thank!!!
Andre.

[Bob Keller]

Personally, I'd incline toward "F" for freight, but thats just me.

[Odd-d]

The ICC used to have a rule that diesel engines had to have a front and back and so the front was marked with an F.

[lionelsoni]

Right, but that's not the "F" we're talking about, which is the "F" in "F3", for example.

Bob, then what did "S", "N", "T", and "E" stand for?

[Bob Keller]

Beats me, but F units came in 1,350, 1,500, 1,750, and 1,800 horsepower versions horsepower versions, so using the "Fifteen" logic, wouldn't those have been T (thirteen hundred), S (seventeen hundred), and E (eighteen hundred) units?

Oh, and I admit I can't find the answer (I looked), so you may well be right. But if you are, the "F" for fifteen and the 300 horsepower thing doesn't make much sense to me.

So I'll still use F for freight. [:D]

[andregg1]

Hi
Alco use the same "F" for freight and "P" for passenger?
Andre.

[csxt30]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Odd-d

The ICC used to have a rule that diesel engines had to have a front and back and so the front was marked with an F.

The F is still in use today to desiganate that end of an engine. Rail cars have a B-end and an A-end !
Thanks,

[Dr. John]

On the old EMD F units, F stood for freight, regardless of the horsepower. FP indicated a cab unit that was stretched to include an on-board steam generator for passenger service. GP was for general purpose and SD was for special duty, etc.

Obviously these distinctions blurred as all these units could be found in either passenger or freight service.

[lionelsoni]

Bob Keller posted, "Beats me, but F units came in 1,350, 1,500, 1,750, and 1,800 horsepower versions horsepower versions [sic], so using the "Fifteen" logic, wouldn't those have been T (thirteen hundred), S (seventeen hundred), and E (eighteen hundred) units?"

The TA was a 1200-horsepower A unit. The FT had 1350 horsepower, halfway between 1500 and 1200. The F2 was intended to be 1500 but wound up being 1350 instead, after the designation had already been made. The F3 was 1500 horsepower. The subsequent F-type locomotives experienced a gradual inflation of their power ratings, but kept the "F" letter. The same inflation can be seen to have happened to all of the other letter classes; but the letter comes from an early ancestor in the same family.

F-type B units in passenger service used what would have been the cab area for the steam generator. The FP modification was a response to a demand for A units that didn't need a B unit to be able to haul a passenger train. But regular F-type A units, with neither the "P" nor the steam generator, were normally used with steam-generator-equipped B units to pull passenger trains.

[Bob Keller]

Well, like I said, it isn't going to change how I refer to it, but I did find several secondary sources, such as "The diesel that did it" from Trains magazine, that stated the F stood for freight.

Oh, I believe the "T" in TA stood for transfer unit.

But as I said, you're probably right.

[fwright]

If the F in F3,7,9 was for 1500 instead of "freight" how did the E units get their designation? As I understand, they were strictly for passenger service as built.

Fred Wright

[lionelsoni]

If I get your point, Fred, it is that, if "F" meant "freight", it would have been more consistent to label the E types with "P" rather than "E", which does in fact match the 1800 horsepower of the E1 and E2.

[prewardude]

E = Express? [%-)]

[Anonymous]

Why not go to the source?

From EMD's own web site:

"1944 -- EMD manufacturers over 500 freight locomotives for the nation¹s railroads and begins designs for a new F3 freight and E model passenger locomotive."

[Bob Keller]

Huh.
Shoulda Googled that baby!

[DSchmitt]

Maybe its because "F" is the letter after "E". "E" passenger locomotives were a already in service when the "F" was developed.

[cnw1995]

John, does A and B designated ends of the boxcars have to do with where the brake wheel is located?

[csxt30]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cnw1995

John, does A and B designated ends of the boxcars have to do with where the brake wheel is located?

Doug : Yes, but today, only about 90% of the cars. It used to be that the piston on the brakes, that sets them up, would always face the brk. wheel, except cabooses, with a brk. wheel at each end. Todays articulated container cars & a lot of other cars, multi levels, have multiple pistons & brk. wheels, and I even run across a lot of tank cars with the break valves on the opposite end of the break wheel, & piston not facing brk. wheel. When I inspect cars for a train, is when I notice them the most & of course when we repair them.
Thanks,

[lionelsoni]

Here is a summary of the first members of the 600-, 900-, 1200-, 1350-, 1500-, and 1800-horsepower series of EMD locomotives, mostly from Marre's book:

600 horsepower: SC (1935-1939); SW('36-39)
900 horsepower: NC (37-38); NC1 (37); NC2 (37); NW (37-38); NW1 (37-38); NW1A (38); NW4 (38)
1200 horsepower: TA (37)
1350 horsepower: FTA, FTB (39-45); F2A, F2B (46)
1500 horsepower: F3A, F3B (45-49); F7A, F7B (49-53); FP7 (49-53)
1800 horsepower: EA, EB (37-38); E1A, E1B (37-38); E2A, E2B (37)

I see a pattern.

[Bob Keller]

Marre also cited:
1750 hp F9, FP9
1800 hp FL9
But if EMDs website says F means freight, I'm not gonna correct'em.

Have a great weekend!

[Anonymous]

F did stand for freight ,the f on the car body indicated the front end of diesel locomotives.The FP-7 was stretched for greater water and fuel capacity, A units only,B units had room for larger tanks. Alco cabs wereFA for freight and PA for passenger service. S stood for six hundred horse power,N for nine hundred horsepower & T was for transfer engines. The TA was a four axle passenger diesel. W as in SW-1500 meant welded frame. Hope this helps.