I’ve come to the end-of-the-line with a great looking un-catalogued small boxcar, the True Value 9046 that was part of the 1698 True Value Rock Island Line set produced in ’76. It’s as big a hit with its 4 color graphics and the 16205 Mopar Express was a miss.
This is a great small boxcar to end this series inspired by Mike Connor’s second article on “cheap classics” that appeared in the November ’94 issue of CTT. Again, many thanks to Mike for his original article. I’ve had fun collecting his list of small cheap classic box cars and a few that weren’t on his list.
Part of the fun associated with this hobby is the willingness to share. I enjoy reading other posts on this forum. So hopefully this is a small repayment.
Fortunately, Mike wrote a series of 4 articles, so starting soon I will pay tribute to his third cheap classic article that covered 2 bay hoppers and gondolas.
Have fun collecting cheap classics………………………
Papa D
The 7908 Tappan small boxcar was part of the un-catalogued 1265 Tappan Special Set from ’82. Rather simple but aesthetically effective white graphics on a deep red body. Somewhat hard to find at the cheap classic upper price range limit of about $25. Certainly a bargain compared to the post-war 6014 Wix Filters small boxcar.
While my last post featuring the un-cataloged JC Penny 9054 small boxcar was an unexpected “hit” on my appeal scale, the opposite is true for the 16205 Mopar Express. With its three color graphics, this small boxcar should be a “hit”, however I find it rather drab looking thus scoring low on my appeal scale. It bears the body number 1987 which matches its Blt by Lionel date. A difference between the stock and body numbers always adds confusion when search for an item on auction sites such as eBay. On the other hand this confusion sometimes leads to being able to buy an item at below market value. I bought mine in the cheap classic price range of under $20. It was only sold as part of the un-cataloged 11757 Mopar Express Set in ’87 & ‘88.
In the 60’s Lionel produced several un-catalogued sets that included Chung King, WIx Filters, RCA Whirlpool and Libby Tomato Juice small boxcars. This was repeated during the MPC/LTI eras with un-cataloged sets that included small boxcars bearing the names Toys-R-US, Kay Bee Toys, Town House TV and Appliances, Sears, Tappan, Ace Hardware, Mopar, Shoprite, Hawthorne, Macy’s and JC Penny. There may have been a few more I’ve missed. Unlike their Post-War brethren, the MPC/LTI era un-cataloged small box cars can generally be found in the “cheap classic” price range. I have a few in my “cheap classic” small boxcar collection. My favorite is the JC Penny 9054 that was part of the 1796 PC Penny Cargo Master set produced in ’77. I find the deep yellow color very appealing.
The 7901 Lionel Lines ('82 & ’83), 16614 Reading (’89), and 16624 New Haven (’90 & ’91) almost qualify as cheap class boxcars. All were cataloged as separate sale items that sold during the time period covered by Mike Connor’s list. As seen in the photos below, the Reading with the 2 tone body and the New Haven (my favorite RR) with the 2 color graphics are particularly appealing.
So, why weren’t they part of the list? Unfortunately all three are Cop & Hobo boxcars that just happen to be in the traditional 027 size. The attachment feature for the platform can be seen on the roof catwalk.
However, when displayed on a shelf above eye level, they fit right in with all the “regular” cheap classic boxcars. Most important is I enjoy them as part of my cheap classic small boxcar collection.
The 9376 Soo line and 16226 Union Pacific small boxcars might have been marginally eligible to make Mike Connor’s original list. Both were included in Rolling Stock Assortments, although not shown or specifically mentioned in a catalog.
The Soo Line was produced in ’81 and in addition to being included in some RSA’s it was also in the un-cataloged 1157 Wabash Cannonball Set. It has a white body with black graphics. It’s relatively scarce, generally selling at a premium price. There has been one for sale off-and-on on eBay for $88.69 including shipping. It comes with an original box which means it’s from a RSA. Unfortunately I’ve not been able to find one at a cheap classic price, so I’ve no photo to share.
The Union Pacific was produced in ’90 and ’91. In addition to being included in some RSA’s it was also included in the un-cataloged 11785 Cosco Union Pacific Set and the 11796 Union Pacific Set. As seen in the below photo it carries the number 6226. It is easier to find under this number at a cheap classic price of about $15.
Really enjoying this thread!
The 16250 Santa Fe completes Mike Connor’s cheap classic small boxcar list that appeared in the November ’94 issue of CTT. Produced in ’93 & ’94 as a separate sale item, it is easy to find priced around $10. Except for graphics and body colors, it is exactly the same as the 16227 Santa Fe produced two years earlier. It has the distinction of being the last cataloged small boxcar produced by LTI. Almost 20 years would pass before another small boxcar would be produced by Lionel. There are no reported variations.
During the MPC/LTI eras, there was only one small boxcar that holds the distinction of being cataloged but not produced, the 9377 Missouri Pacific that was going to be part of the 1051 Texas & Pacific Diesel set. Since it appeared in a ’80 catalog photo, a prototype once and may still exist. If anyone is lucky enough to have this prototype it would great if they could share a photo.
While Mike’s cheap classic boxcar list is complete, there are a couple of small boxcars that maybe should have been on the list. So this thread will continue a while longer.
The 16222 Great Northern small boxcar was released in ’90 and ’91 as a separate sale item, one of the few that wasn’t included in a set or Rolling Stock Assortment. It must have been a good selling separate sale item because it is easy to find at a cheap classic price around $10. It complements the green 9339 Great Northern released several years earlier. The graphics are identical between the 2 boxcars. The 16222 has the improved quality trucks of the LTI era vs the MPC era. There are no reported variations
Have fun collecting cheap classics……………………… Papa D
The 16201 Wabash small boxcar was released from ’88-‘91 in the 11703 Wabash Iron Horse set. Even though it was never a separate sale or Rolling Stock Assortment item, it is relatively easy to find, and best of all at a cheap classic price of around $10. There are no reported variations. It ranks somewhere in the middle of my small boxcar appeal rating.
Re-look at the 7902 Santa Fe Small Boxcar
The 7902 Santa Fe small boxcar was in an earlier post where I compared it to its sibling, the 16227. At that time, none of the price guides listed any variations for the 7902. Recently on eBay two 7902’s were up for sale with a variation noted on the location of the Blt by Lionel date location. Upon checking my 7902 I saw that I already had the less common variation shown in photo below on the left. This prompted me to buy the more common variation shown in the photo below on the right. Note that the Blt by Lionel date is also different. The trucks on the two cars are also different. The rarer variation has metal wheels and operating couplers at both ends while the more common variation has plastic wheels and an operating coupler at only one end. Since the 7902 was in production from ’82 to ’85, I wonder if there are additional Blt by Lionel date variations. Discoveries like this make collecting fun. And the cheap prices for these small boxcars make it possible to collect them.
The 16200 Rock Island small boxcar was released from ’87-‘88 as part of Rolling Stock Assortments and in the 11701 Rail Blazer set. Given this relatively short production run, it is a little more difficult to find but still cheap classic priced at around $10 to $12. Since it was produced in the LTI era, it has trucks with couplers at both ends and metal wheels. Overall a good looking small boxcar with nice graphics.
There is no reported variation, although I’ve seen claims of two different shades of red. My first inclination is to think sun fade.
9042 Ford Autolite Update: In my original post on this small boxcar, I noted that there were 3 variations, 2 of which I’d never come across. While, a lot of small boxcars recently sold on eBay that contained the all black text variation. This variation in effect is a factory error where the orange graphics shown in the below photo was inadvertently not applied. Still would like to see the variation with gold text.
The 9001 Conrail small boxcar was released un-cataloged in ’86 & ‘87 and cataloged from ’88 to ‘90 as part of Rolling Stock Assortments (shown in the ’88 catalog RSA photo) as well as the 1620 Freight Flyer (’88 to ‘90) and 1687 Freight Flyer (’87 to ‘90) sets. These sets were lowest end entry level offerings. Given this long production run, it’s easy to find at a cheap classic price of around $10. The 9001 is another small boxcar with simple graphics but an appealing body/graphic color combination.
While there is no “collector” variation, similar to the 7926 Nickel Plate small box car it spans 2 changes in trucks. So you might find one with either Symington or ASF trucks and/or an operating coupler at either one or both ends.
Incidentally ’88 was a very good year for cataloged small box cars with 5 different ones shown:
9001 Conrail
7926 Nickel Plate
16201 Wabash
7926 Erie Lackawanna
16200 Rock Island
I should have mentioned when I wrote about the 7926 Erie Lackawanna, that the ’88 catalog showed both the Gray and Orange body variations. Also since I wrote about the 7926, a lot of small boxcars for sale on eBay contained a7926 with a third variation: a tan body. I’m a little suspicious of this “tan” body variation. I have a 16400 Pennsylvania 2 bay hopper that started out as gray but it appears to have turned tan due to sun light exposure (aka UV). The photo below shows the contrast between the gray and tan on this car.
Does anyone else have a tan body 7926? If so, is the underside the same color?
The 7926 Nickel Plate small boxcar was released from ‘86 through ‘92 as either a separate sale item as well as in the 1602 Nickel Plate special (’86 – ’91) and 11803 Nickel Plate special Mall Promotion (U ’92) sets. Given the long production run, it is easy to find at a cheap classic price of around $10. Graphics are somewhat simple but overall not a bad looking car.
While there is no “collector” variation, it should be noted that LTI introduced a couple of truck changes during the 7926 production run. Starting in ’87 LTI improved quality by eliminating non-operating couplers. Then in ’89 it replaced the Symington trucks with the more attractive ASF Ride Control Trucks. These new trucks were also advertised as having couplers with more precise opening and closing and improved pulling power. My car has the ASF trucks, metal wheels, and operating couplers at both ends indicating it came from the ’89 to ’92 time frame. It didn’t come with a box, so it’s probably from a set break-up. This photo shows the difference between the Symington and ASF trucks.
Papa
Mike C. from Indiana: I actually got mine in a lot with 7 other small boxcars and hoppers. I had been looking for a while and couldn’t believe my luck that the 7909 was included. Even more fortunate is I only paid $80 for the lot. A couple of the cars were junk, but it still came out to under $15 per car.
Thanks Brutus. I hope you are enjoying them as much as I’m enjoying writing them each week. I can't say it enough times, thanks to Mike C. from Indiana for writing the original series of articles on Cheap Classics in CTT.
The first small boxcar produced by LTI was the 7925 Erie Lackawanna which came in the 1615 Cannonball Express set cataloged from ’86 to ’90. It’s almost a twin to the 9043 released by MPC in ’73 to ‘75. The only difference is the graphics are a slightly different shade of maroon. It has much improved trucks with metal wheels and operating couplers at both ends. Given its somewhat lengthy production run, it is an easily found small boxcar with a “cheap classic” price right around $12.
There is one variation. After taking over Lionel production from MPC, LTI took inventory of warehoused stock and came across the orange car bodies used for the 9040 Wheaties small boxcar for ’70 to ’73. Someone at LTI decided to use these orange bodies up during the 7925 production run, or at least this is the folklore I’ve heard. One thing for sure, the two cars do have the same exact orange bodies. The color of the graphics was changed from maroon to white. The results are a far more appealing small boxcar. I was fortunately enough to be able to buy one for $65. While not a traditional “cheap classic” price, it’s a cheap price for this classic variation.
Here’s a comparison of the original 9043 and the 2 variations of the 7925.
Great thread - love these!
RIP Chewy - best dog I ever had.
Papa D,
Very impressive rendition of the 7909 that you have there. Much better than mine. When you started posting about this series, I kind of wondered if you had one as these are not the easiest to find. Again, I am glad you are keeping the spirit of these cars alive. In the latest Christmas catalog, they have a version of the 6050 savings car, which was a 6014 with a slot for coins. May have to get one of those. I hope everyone has a good day.
Keep on training,
Mike C. from Indiana
The 7909 L&N small boxcar has the distinction of being the last small boxcar release by MPC in ’83 and again in ’84 as part of the 1352 Rocky Mountain Freight set. This was a beginner set that used a DC transformer/steam engine. This kept the cost down at the expense of creating a dead end building block relative to continuation in the model train hobby. I can look back to my first train set in 1954 with fond memories, and still run it on my layout along with numerous other post-war and later engines. I wonder if the same can be said by anyone that received the Rocky Mountain Freight as their first set?
The 7909 L&N was not offered as either a separate sale item or in a Rolling Stock Assortment. With relatively limited production it is the hardest of the “cheap classic” 9040 series to find. Price guides list it at $35 to $50 in excellent condition. I’m not sure of the actual market price for this car since I’ve rarely seen it for sale. As a benchmark, I’ve not seen it for sale on eBay this year.
It’s a nice but not great looking small boxcar. It came with plastic wheels and fixed couplers at both ends. My 7909 L&N shows normal playwear with some scuff marks. I’ve replaced the cheap trucks with ones that have operating couplers and metal wheels to improve its on track performance. This was relatively easy since they are attached by a simple plastic snap fastener. Someday when I get ambitious I’ll replace these cheap plastic snap fasteners with eyelet rivets to take some of the “rock” out between the trucks and the boxcar body.
Many of the small boxcars of the MPC/LTI era have a corresponding 10-½“ big brother. The 7909 L&N is no exception. Its big brother is the 9752 released much earlier in ’75 & ’76. It's very common and can be bought for between $10 and $15.
The 9705 small boxcar was released as part of the Black Cave Flyer set. It appeared MPC had high hopes for this set; they devoted 2 full pages to it in the ’82 catalog. It is obviously a starter set but with a lot of enhanced play value. In addition to the “Black Cave” diorama, the budding young engineer also got to place glow-in-the-dark stickers on the tender and rolling stock. Since it was only a catalogue item for one year, I doubt the sales volume met the expectation.
I had no real driving motivation to get this car and not coincidentally it was the last one I added to complete my small boxcars collection based on Mike Connor’s “cheap classics” article that appeared in the November ’94 issue of CTT. My disregard for the 9705 is two-fold. First there is no number on the car. What’s with no number? The only markings are the add-on glow-in the dark stickers, which is reason two. I don’t particularly like anything with stickers. They tend to peel-up around the edges and/or get damaged.
When I first started this thread, my plan was to mention this small boxcar as MIA in my collection. I had almost bought a complete set last fall at a Greenberg Train Show but let it slip away. A dealer had this set on his table in a somewhat beat-up box for $25. I thought what the heck, for $25 I might as well get it. Instead of buying it right then and asking the dealer to hold it for me, I decided to go to the men’s room first. When I went back a couple minutes later it was gone. I was only half disappointed and half mad at myself for making a “rookie” train show mistake. Again, I was ambivalent about adding this particular small boxcar to my collection.
Then about a month ago I happened to see just the boxcar for sale on eBay with a buy-it-now price + shipping around $10, so I made the plunge. One side of my car has OK stickers with the inevitable peeling around the edges.
On the other side the “bomb” sticker has the inevitable damage.
The 9705 is most often found as part of the Black Cave flyer set vs separate sale. The set price varies wildly from $30 to $200 or so. There’s been a set on eBay for quite some time now in good condition for $180 including shipping with no takers.
A dilemma on which small boxcar to do next; in number sequence it’s the 7903 Rock Island, while in catalogue release year it is the 7905 Black Cave Flyer. Since I have an aversion to the 7905 Black Cave Flyer, I’ll leave it to my next post and go with the 7903 Rock Island this post.
I find the 7903 RI one of the nicer looking small boxcars in the MPC/LTI series. It’s production history is a bit unusual in that it was only released in ’83, and then only as a separate sale item. It is one of only three with two color graphics. The graphic themselves are like the yin & the yang; simple yet appealing. There are no reported variations. It must have been a very good selling separate sale item because every with just a single year of production it is relatively easy to find at a price around $10.
Three years passed before MPC released the next small boxcar, the 7902 Santa Fe. It was a separate sale item in ’82, in the 1353 Southern Streak set from ’83 to ’85, and shown in the ’83 catalog Rolling Stock Assortment photo. It may have well been in the ’84 Rolling Stock Assortment, however there is not photo in that year’s catalog, just a small one sentence note at the bottom of a page mentioning the Rolling Stock Assortment. Availability of a Rolling Stock Assortment in not mentioned at all in ’85, the last year of Lionel production under MPC. There are no reported variations.
With its multi-year production history, it is an easy car to come across, and the very definition of “cheap classic”. It can be bought for under $10. One in excellent condition with box (I assume this came from a Rolling Stock Assortment) just sold last week on eBay for $6 + shipping.
I find the 7902 a rather plain boxcar with minimal graphics. LTI did a much better job with the 16227 Santa Fe released in only one year (’91) in the 11720 Santa Fe Special set. With this limited production run, the 16227 is much harder to find and costs a bit more than the 7902, in range of $15 or so. You do get more for your money. In addition to the better graphics, the wheels are metal vs plastic, there are operating couplers at both ends, and AFS Ride Control vs Symington-Wayne trucks.
Next up is the 9339 Great Northern small boxcar released in 79-83 & ’86, and uncataloged in ’85. In ’79 & ’80 it was part of the 1960 Midnight Flyer starter set. It was moved up to the 1252 Heavy Iron mid-range set in ’82 & ’83. It is shown in the ’86 catalog Rolling Stock Assortment photo. Like most of the MPC era small box cars it has the low cost (aka cheap) plastic wheels with one fixed and one operating coupler. There are no reported variations. The only other thing of note is the undecorated dark green body was also used in the 7905 Black Cave Flyer set released in ’82.
I bought my 9339 without a box. It has play wear & scuff marks. My guess is it most likely came from a Midnight Flyer set break-up. All-in-all it’s a nice looking car that mixes well with other small boxcars pulled by a traditional sized engine.
The 9037 Conrail small boxcar was released un-cataloged in ‘78, and cataloged in ’80 in the 1052 Chesapeake Flyer set. It was also included in the infamous Rolling Stock Assortments of that time period. It’s a good looking car with a molded Brown (Tuscan?) body and white graphics. Its body color is the same as the 9711 Southern released in ’74-’75. It has one fixed and one operating coupler with the dreaded (at least by me) plastic wheels.
Unlike its sibling, the 9035 blue Conrail small boxcar, there’s not more of a story to tell about it. It is more common than its limited production run would suggest, with a market price of around $10 to $15.
This is an example of a small boxcar being somewhat common because it was included in a Rolling Stock Assortment. It is further suggestive evidence the somewhat rare 9044 Rio Grande was not included in any Rolling Stock Assortment. Thanks nickaix for sharing some information on this.
Papa_D The 9044 Rio Grande (D&RGW) small boxcar was released in ‘75 in the 1582 Yard Chief Set which was also cataloged in ’76. In addition in was in the uncataloged 1697 Sears Steam Freight Set in ’76. The TM price guide states that this car was also available as part of a Rolling Stock Assortment. This seems a little strange since the first mention of scout size car Rolling Stock Assortment is in the ’78 catalog. The TM price guide lists 2 variations: a more common orange body, and a less common burnt orange body.
The 9044 Rio Grande (D&RGW) small boxcar was released in ‘75 in the 1582 Yard Chief Set which was also cataloged in ’76. In addition in was in the uncataloged 1697 Sears Steam Freight Set in ’76. The TM price guide states that this car was also available as part of a Rolling Stock Assortment. This seems a little strange since the first mention of scout size car Rolling Stock Assortment is in the ’78 catalog. The TM price guide lists 2 variations: a more common orange body, and a less common burnt orange body.
The guide I have (Greenberg's, 1991) does not mention any variations, and does not include the 9044 in its listing of rolling stock assortments. I suppose it is possible that the car was reproduced later in the LTI era, but that is a long hiatus. For what it's worth...
I note that there is a small boxcar in one of the new remote control sets offered in the new Ready-to-Run catalog this year -- the Christmas set.
The 6th small boxcar (in a series of 20) is the 9035 Conrail released as a separate sale item, in Rolling Stock Assortments, and 9 sets from ‘78 to ‘82 and again in ’87. As you might expect it is commonly found and can be bought in excellent condition for around $10. Amazingly, even with this long production run there is no noted variation.
With its attractive blue body color and nice white graphics there would be no further backstory for this small boxcar except for the ’87 release. It’s shown in that year’s catalog in the 91687 Freight Flyer starter set and as one of the boxcars in the Rolling Stork Assortment photo. There are several puzzling things about this re-release of the 9035 after a 5 year hiatus. First, the 9001 Conrail small boxcar had already been released un-cataloged in ’86 & ’87, then cataloged from ’88 to ’90. While the 9035 was pictured in the ’87 catalog Rolling Stock Assortment, the 9001 took its place in ’89 and ’89. Why bring back the 9035 in just ’87? The second piece of the puzzle is the trucks. All the small boxcars produced prior to ’86 have plastic wheels (except those with the AAR trucks which have metal wheels that appear to be brass: conductive but non-magnetic) and a single operating coupler. Whereas all the small boxcars produced in ’86 and thereafter (LTI era) have metal wheels (their magnetic) and operating couplers at both ends. The third and final piece of the puzzle is the MPC logo. Small boxcars produced before ’86 have the MPC logo below the word “LIONEL” on the herald at one of the body ends while those produced in ’86 and after don’t have the MPC logo, just the word “LIONEL”.
My 9035 has metal wheels and operating couplers at both ends. This leads me to believe it came for the ’87 release. It also has the MPC logo, which further leads me to believe that after LTI bought the rights to produce Lionel trains from MPC, it found a fairly large number of 9035 bodies that were subsequently used in the ’87 release.
Generally this is considered a minor variation with no difference in price because it is too easy to swap frames out to create this variation. We’ll come to a different situation where using up left over bodies from the MPC did create a rare variation for the 7925 Erie Lackawanna small box car. Finally, below is a comparison of steel, brass, and plastic wheels. The problem with the plastic wheels is they are too light making the rolling stock somewhat top heavy.
Keep it fun!
The 9044 Rio Grande (D&RGW) small boxcar was released in ‘75 in the 1582 Yard Chief Set which was also cataloged in ’76. In addition in was in the uncataloged 1697 Sears Steam Freight Set in ’76. The TM price guide states that this car was also available as part of a Rolling Stock Assortment. This seems a little strange since the first mention of scout size car Rolling Stock Assortment is in the ’78 catalog. The TM price guide lists 2 variations: a more common orange body, and a less common burnt orange body. I believe the photo below shows the more common orange body variation.
This orange is different from the 9040 Wheaties orange. It is the same color as the 9705 D&RGW boxcar released in ’72. I believe the re-release of the 6315 Gulf tank car (19611 ’98) is what is meant by burnt orange. I’ve tried to show a comparison of these 3 cars below but haven’t captured the colors accurately.
Unlike the first 4 small boxcars in this series, this one is much harder to find. I’ve most often seen it as part of the Yard Chief Set, and only rarely as a separate sale item. Fortunately its price doesn’t reflect its rarity, and when found can be bought for under $30.
Questions I have about this boxcar are:
1) Is there really a burnt orange variation?
2) Can anyone confirm that it was included in a Rolling Stock Assortment in the late 70’s?
3) A general question about Rolling Stock Assortment: What type of packaging did it come in?
Thanks Mike. As I've previously stated, I think your four articles on cheap classics are "classics". They've provided me a lot of enjoyment. My research and hunting skills have gotten much better as a result.
I'm currently working on your list of cheap classic hoppers from the third article in the series. Scratching my head on the gondolas, not sure I'm a gondola guy. Looking forward to the cabooses. This is the only category I'll be starting from scratch.
Having fun with trains........
Good evening all,
Papa_D, thank you for continuing the interest in these special cars which are so dear to me. This thread brings back memories of the time spent collecting the cars, writing the articles, and traveling to have the pictures made for the articles. I am glad Lionel decided to make new cars a couple of years back, but also disappointed no more have been added since. Perhaps this new remote control system will encourage more to be made.
Thanks fifedog, I'm having fun doing this.
dave92camaro: i'm going in the order released. I'll get to the 7903 Rock Island which was released in '83. There are 5 boxcars to still go to get there. The second Rock Island, the 16200, is even further down the list, coming in at number sixteen.
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