General 4-4-0 Locomotives

[palallin]

TTT

[Anonymous]

Too bad about the marx verdict as it would be nice to have a variety of lower priced 19 th century power. From the research I have done on that time period the locos had no real standard "look" to them even among those on the same line. It is kind of too bad MTH didn't chose a different protype like the "Jupiter" or "William Mason" and leave the 50's lionel repro stuff to Williams. Then there would be four cheaper 19th cent steamers to chose from if you consider the Target one.

[Dave Farquhar]

Emmandy, the Marx locomotive is very difficult to find without broken parts. The problem with all of the plastic Marx locomotives that used that motor was their very high speed. If they weren't pulling a lot of cars--and frequently the number of cars that came in the set wasn't really enough--to slow them down, they could race on a straight stretch, and then when they hit an O27 curve, go tumbling.

[Dr.Fu-Manchu]

The Doctor Is In !!! Yes, Marx did make a "General" type locomotive. It was not the best, and it went downhill as Marx did. I saw one sell on E-Bay last year. It was being parted out(it was a set) As to owning Generals,, I will stick to my Lionel models. I have three now, one is a Redwood Valley (due for a elect.e-unit) and two post-war ones, one due for restoring. I bought it at the Hayward, Ca. show. Some one dismanted it and lost the rear axle bushings. I may post photos after all three are up to snuff. Till My Next Missive, I Remain The Humble, Yet Strangly Evil Doctor !!![}:)]

[palallin]

Steve26 wrote:

"However, I prefer the MTH, even wit the terrible boiler shape, vs. the Lionel, with it's rediculous-looking "bay window" cab front, primitive detailing, and solid drivers and pilot."

It may be "ridiculous-looking," but it's quite prototypical: I have 4-4-0 pics with cabs yet more elaborate. Look for instance in the History chapter of Joe Collias' "Frisco Power."

[Anonymous]

From what I've read and seen both models seem closer to the Texas if you wanted to model the Civil war era. It has the right # of domes but doesn't have the curve in the running boards that the Texas had/has. (It is still around right?) Both models seem to be of the post rebuild in the 1880's engine.

On a similar topic Target is selling plastic battery powered trainsets in "O" one of them is a 19th century 2-4-0. It is in the genaric toy asile in the blue boxes. There are two sets they have what looks like late Marx plastic cars with dummy couplers.Only one set has this engine.The lead truck is molded on but you could cut it off and replace it with something that looks better. It looks pretty OK for a set costing $10. It would look great with a little work as a repainted engine or yard scene for variety.

Speaking of Marx didn't they make a 19th century engine too? I have never seen one was it any good?

[Anonymous]

Hey Spanky,

Was that General in your first pictures the one that MPC made in the 70's. I'd like that one too.

Bert and Mary Poppins aka Nick

[lionelsoni]

It was easier than I thought. I pried out the rivet, drilled the lever out to match a fiber shoulder washer, tapped the hole in the frame for a 4-40 screw, soldered a wire to the lever, and put it together (without the original spring washer). The only tricky part was using a hardened screw as a tap, because of the lack of space between the frame and the coil.

[ben10ben]

For those of you with a big budget who really like 19th century equipment, you might want to take a look here:
http://ogaugerr.infopop.cc/eve/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=63160042&f=57660482&m=6791082731

[lionelsoni]

Now I'm thinking about how to preserve the function of the 3-position e-unit's on-off switch. My control scheme involves a bridge rectifier, which means that the e-unit coil must be isolated from the locomotive frame. However, the L-shaped lever of the on-off switch is riveted to the e-unit's frame. In the past, I have isolated the entire e-unit frame, or bypassed the built-in switch by a separate one, or simply done without the switch. My plans for this locomotive however involve working both with and without the e-unit; and I would like to have the lever working in its normal place if I can.

It doesn't seem likely that I can insulate the e-unit's frame, given the tight fit. This leads me to insulating the lever itself. Perhaps a screw with a plastic sleeve and plastic washer under the head. Has anyone else out there ever tried this? Any ideas?

[lionelsoni]

I was looking at the insides of my 8701 last night and got the idea to replace the 2-position e-unit with a 3-position. With a little filing down of the base of the idler gear shaft that is peened inside the frame, it seems to fit, although the mounting-screw holes are a little low. I am also thinking of putting the two field windings in series, to slow down the locomotive, rather than wiring in just one winding as Lionel suggests.

[Dr.Fu-Manchu]

The [}:)] Doctor is in !!! I just bought my second General (first one is MPC DC motor type)
This one is Post War #1862 which had its boiler repainted. I think some one did some
reworking because it seems to have magna-traction. It also has the boiler weight in the
#1872 's location. (further back as on the smoke unit model) It also came with flag poles on the cow catcher.(no flags) Now, I did some checking and as far as I know, flag poles did not come with the generals. Have I got something different here? If anyone else has seen flag poles on the cowcatchers of Lionel generals, let me know. Till My Next Missive, I Remain The Humble, Yet Strangly [}:)] Doctor !!!

[Anonymous]

"I just saw in one of my old classic toy trains issues (I hit the jackpot of old CTT at this yard sale) and it showed that Lionel produced not only the Great Train Roberry, The General, and the Halloween General, but they made them in B&O roadnames and many others."
--------------------------

Yes, Lionel has offered their 4-4-0s in a variety of liveries--particularly in more recent times. Civil War Union and Confederate models, a Union Pacific model made for JC Penny, a circus version, and a good number of others. I try to collect most all of them, but am still missing one or two. I had all of the MTH versions made up until a year or so ago, but sold them all simply because I didn't want to get too heavily involved with two different lines; because I personally like the overall proportions of the Lionel models better; and because I didn't want to be fussing with changing batteries every couple of years or so. As with everything else in this hobby, there are trade-offs that can only be evaluated based on individual preferences.

[Anonymous]

Hey Ya'll

Wow, that 4-4-0 is impressive. I would like to purchase the MTH 4-4-0 "General" with matching passenger cars. I saw them on display at my local hobby shop.They are very attractive peices. He might try a a circle of track in the front window of his store instead of just running them back and forth on a peice of straight track. By the way, I just saw in one of my old classic toy trains issues (I hit the jackpot of old CTT at this yard sale) and it showed that Lionel produced not only the Great Train Roberry, The General, and the Halloween General, but they made them in B&O roadnames and many others. It was impressive.

Nick

[Anonymous]

How cool is it to have a stock cert. from a obscure RR, and then have a model of one of the locomotives from the same RR! Awesome.

[Anonymous]

Tom,

If I can squeeze DCS into it, the Halloween General will be equipped with it when it arrives. It will probably get TMCC due to size constraints. There is also the issue of where to mount a speed censor in a locomotive with no flywheel.

[spankybird]

BTW I do have this on order

Cleveland, Columbus, & Cincinnati RR

http://www.mth-railking.com/detail.asp?item=30-1341-1

And matching passenger cars

I even have a stock cert from this rail line



tom

[spankybird]

Does it have DCS or TMCC[?][(-D]

[Anonymous]

Tom,

Thank you very much! Great Picture of the prototype! So Red and Black vs. Orange and Black!

By the way, did you order the Halloween set?

[spankybird]

BTW Steve, be sure to check this weeks Sunday Photo Fun, I think you will like my pics. I am still working on them.

tom

[Anonymous]

Ah, but Tom, I'm not modeling the 1920s or 1930s! While I cherish my Lionel F-3's, Berk and GG-1, and while they do see occasional service on my line, the truth is that I model STRICTLY the 19th century in hi-rail! To date, MTH is the only player in the game where scale locomotives and rolling stock is concerened. If Lionel or Atlas ever decided to offer a few pieces, I'd certainly have to add them to my collection, but for now, I just don't see that happening.

[spankybird]

That pic came off the Historical Site.

I know Steve. Let see, if you got the money, Atlas refers, and now the K-line refers, when ever they get here. And oh yeh, MTH.

I have pic up some old kits that was 2 rail and converted them to 3 rail and they work well.

The last Miller car is one of them

tom

[Anonymous]

The "original" General, however, was far more colorful, with blues, reds and greens accented by the requisite brass.

Tom, your collection looks a bit like mine! MTH heavy, but who else makes 19th century rolling stock?

[spankybird]

IT looks basicly like red and black to me

[Anonymous]

Can anyone comment on the color of the real General? I am color-blind. I look at the website for the Kennesaw Museum and, in looking at the photographs of the real General, it looks more like the colors of the "Halloween" General than those of the 1862 and 1882 Generals. Again, my color vision is lousy.

Can anyone comment?

[spankybird]

AS you can see Steve, I only have a few pieces myself and only a mild intrest in it., so I tell my wife[:D][:P][(-D][(-D]

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the welcome, Tom. I'm better known over on the OGR board as smd4, but that name was taken here.

I've got the MTH engine on order--it's the first scale 19th century engine modeled in 3-rail scale by any of the big manufacturers to date.

On a side note, it is entirely possible to mount a decent sized motor in a small 19th century engine. It is being done as we speak.

And yes, I model only the 19th century, so the recent developments really have me excited!

[spankybird]

John, its in the 2004 vol 2 cat. Its also 3 rail or 2 rail, 3 different road names. Who knows when it will really be at the dealers, but it seams that they have gotten better on the high end price stuff with delievers.

I have been hoping to see something new in there next catalog witch is due out in a couple of weeks.
tom

[3railguy]

Wow Tom, MTH is doing that? I haven't gotten my new MTH catalog yet. Will be interesting to see.