Hey guys, you think $1000.00 is ok for a brand new PRR T1 4-4-4-4 Duplex with TMCC?
What's the Lionel stock number?
No! The "Lionrel" is obviously a cheap imitation. Stick with genuine "Lionel"....;-)
Bob Nelson
Sorry, it was a typo. It is from Lionel 6-28063.
It's Lionel 6-28063. thanks
original mrsp was over $1200
Life's hard, even harder if your stupid John Wayne
http://rtssite.shutterfly.com/
Do you think this is a good deal. It's brand new but from year 2000?
I would be hesitant to buy the engine - unfortunately.
Even though the engine is 'NEW', Lionel will NOT service the engine under warranty since it is 12 years old - at least that is my understanding.Have you seen it run? Will the seller 'warrant' the engine incase when you get it home and it doesn't run they will refund your money?
Well, they said they can do a test run and then if something goes wrong when I get it, they can always fix it as they are an Lionel service center.
Correction....as they are a Lionel service center
You may want to ask the dealer if it's his locomotive or whether it's on consignment. It it's the dealers, well, he know's what he's into it for and what he has to get out of it. If it's on consignment the actual owner may be "fishing" with his $1,000 price, in other words he's trying to see if he'll actually get it. On a consignment piece the owner may be willing to drop the price if he knows he's got a serious buyer, so ask your dealer. Or, you could always play the waiting game. If it's still on the shelf six months to a year from now the owner, whether dealer or consigner, may be a bit more flexible on the price. Let me tell you from my years of gun and antique collecting the most formidable weapon in your arsenal besides knowledge is PATIENCE.
I would not pay $1000 for that locomotive, even if it's NIB. As stated, it's 12 years old, regardless of whether it's been out of the box or not.
First Timer,
This is my opinion and how I look at things.
1. Evidently YOU like the engine.
2. The value of the engine in the Greenberg 2010 editition is Mint: $910.
3. This one is New in the Box.
4. Lionel warranty as a Local Dealer and Service Center told me that eventhough it was bought "new" 6 months ago, if Lionel did not produce that piece in a year or so they do not honor the warranty. But your dealer said that he would take care of any problem.
5. If YOU want it + You like it + You trust the dealer + You feel the price is fair = You Buy It and Enjoy it.
just a little more advise. I work for NIckolas Smith Trains in Broomall Pa. lionel has told the owner they DO NOT support any product outside of a 2 yr window. also the electronics have changed so much in the years since it was made that if they go bad due to a voltage spike etc, the new Boards will not work with the rested of the wiring. AND THEY MAY NOT EVEN FIT INTO THE LOCO OR TENDER. they do not have any boards in stock for anything more then 3 yrs old. any left-over parts are shipped to NORTH COAST TRAINS IN LIMA OHIO.
MTH did the same thing years ago when they went from PROTO 1 to PROTO 2 boards. so many owners rasied so much hell Mike had SANDA-KAN design a retro fit P2 board. for a up grade as the PROTO 1 boards had a high failure rate.
SO if you do buy this loco, have it test run in front of you to see if all functions are working and the TMCC boards are good.
Mike Salvatore
Mr. Salvatore, since you work for Nicholas Smith Trains, who I would assume has the "ears" of the manufacturers, let me pass on a suggestion:
Since no-one knows just how long the circuit boards in modern toy trains will last, and trust me, I work with the things in copiers, they could last 20 years or blow tomorrow, could the manufacturers be persuaded to come up with (for lack of a better term) an override or board replacement assembly that would convert the locomotives to conventional operation similar to a post-war model? The pre- and post-war trains were as long-lived as they were due to their simplicity. Will any of the modern locos be running, 50, 60, 70, or even 100 years from now? No-one knows.
Certainly all the "gee-whiz" features would be lost, but a loco that runs is a heck of a lot better than one that can't!
both Lionel and MTH has made it clear that all medium to high end will have all the *** electronics.take out all that stuff and you can cut the cost by half on most of the engines. they think that everyone whats to be a real engineer and all that stuff. hell even the cheap e-unit boards they put in the starter sets are no longer a sure thing.
Look at MTH, they just bought out S-HELPER SERVICE. they are allready talking about putting electro couplers on the engines and thier dcs system. the majority of the Flyer guys i have talked to don't care for that stuff. what is wrong with simple mecanical couplers and a basic sound system? because there are some "scale nuts " that have convinced them that is what everyone wants. LOOK what they given us today,can motors that when they die ,toss them in the can, boards that can blow just from the static charge in your hand if if you touch a board in a engine that is apart, the Neew SMDS are very sensitivea and you should have a ground strap to bleed off and electicity in you body.
if you want simple reliable electronics,thank god that BACHMAN's Williams line still used the simple and rugged design that they have had for years for their e-units and tru-blast horns and whistles. the problem is so bad that it is a joke. and just trying to get parts from LIONEL or MTH is tough. if you haven't spent the 3 grand for Mikes service station kit and have a laptop or desk top to plug into and the proper cords to plug into the boards for Diagnoiss, then you have to send it back to MTH. Lionel is just as bad.if you have taken their course, and bought their cheesy test board, and you get nowhere. and Lionel will not re-imbuse you the cost of the new board until they also confirm the old board is bad.
It has actually gotten to the point that it is less headache to replace the whole engine if 1 is advailable and send the defective unit back to the manufactor.and as for the new Flyer engines. any problems thay usually get sent back since between the boards and the new motor design makes it almost unfixable.
My suggestion is if AND when the boards die,and you can't afford the 250 motherboard and power supply, or the 300+ sound boards or the pickup sensors crap out due to voltage spikes in your 450 to 2000 dollar engines, give the boys a call at OSI or DALLEE. at least the engine will run.. may not have sound, may not have variable output smoke, crewtalk or all the other bells and whistles that come with the engines today but the engines will run.. (Also don't forget the motor/fan driven smoke units, what a nightmare to repair.)
one more thing. Latley i have noticed a lost of new lionel and MTH engines for sale cheap on ebay in the 1991-current section- look under parts. there are stores and dealers stripping good engines too the bone because of lack of parts advailablity. tht days of simple mechcanile e-uits are about done. and that goes for simple sound systems. I'm 55 and have been fixing trains since i was 16 yrs old, the old network is dying off and there is no ones to replace a liftime of skills and knowledge that will be lost in the next 5-10 yrs.
you can deciide about my rantings if they are true or not. it's you call .AND as a HInt, DALLEE does have the smallest and the most durable replacenet board on the market today than can fir almost anywhere.
Mike
Oh, I don't mind the rant, I understand perfectly. I'm a copier repairman by trade, and the stuff they have copiers do now quite frankly makes me nervous. In addition to copying now they fax, print (from computers), and scan to e-mail. What makes me nervous is customers putting all their eggs in one basket like that. If the machine crashes you're out of luck, you lose everything. Thank God it doesn't happen all that often, but still...
By the way, I won't say "you must have the best job in the world" working at Nicholas Smith, even if you do! I worked for a gun company back in the 80's and my customers used to say that to me all the time. Well, yes and no...
for the record so I'm not misunderstood, i should have said i do repairs at Nicholas Smith, American Flyer and a lot of the basket cases ( pre & post war) that come in that the other guys won't touch. i have 35 yrs working at Amtrak as a system power director controlling the old PRR electricfied lines from Philly to Wash DC.
I have spent a lot of time with the older guys helping them when the boards and other do-dads go south. there are 2 very good guys there, one does all the MTH and the other does lionel and MPC and LTI stuff. we have found that for what Lionel re-imburses the stores owner for repairs and parts on new trains and accessories, it is better to send anything major back to the MFG's. that way the owner of the trains have a much better chance of it being repaired right the 1st time and the MFG's warranty is not comparmised. and forget any transformer made since 2000. when they go, then right back to makers they go. even the ZW-2's and the Z4000 are not worth the time and trouble to repair.
have a good weekend.
You know. sending the bad stuff back to the manufacturers may not be such a bad thing. Having dead stuff pile up in the recieving dock is a pretty good wake up call that you're doing something wrong, or not as right as it could be!
And have a good weekend yourself!
Thanks Mike, I have decided not to buy the loco. The seller was honest enough to tell me that it is used. And from your advices, I wouldn't buy the engine even if it was sealed. Now, just wondering if Lionel or MTH would come out again with a scale size (31 1/2 inches) in the future. I believe they sued each other or something over this.
Thanks guys
Glen
I was going to post last night but thought it went to another topic but saw on on ebay for buyit now I think for $800
Well that show you that 1) it was over true market value and 2) that something might be remiss with the electronics inside.
interesting devolopement.
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