How Big Is "Small"? (Mild Rant)

[fifedog]

CTT is going to print what is submitted to it.  Jon Brooks' layout is small.  Heck, their recent project layout is small.  Under Carl, Bob,and Roger, things have been way more balanced in the past year.

If you guys want to see more small layouts in our beloved mag, then pick up this gauntlet and get writing.  If you need a writer/photographer to help you out (and live relatively close) call me.

[DennisB-1]

sir james I

In this post CTT has been strangely quiet. Nothing. As a kid anything over 5 by 9 would have seemed big. I like CTT but it's direction does seem to have gone toward big and fancy. When I reach the part about I had my layout built, I stop reading, look at the pictures and keep going.My choice.  The latest mag is still sitting here, I thumbed it, have not read it. I do like the Lionel display articles, now thats classic toy trains. So does compact mean small or just stuffed?

 

Sir James , 

Please be more specific and explain what you mean by big and fancy. What size layout do you consider "big". What exactly do you mean by fancy? Do you mean realistic?

And I fail to understand the problem you and others have with someone having a layout built for them. As someone else stated--some people don't have the time or are not interested in the building process but they still like trains. Obviously, they can afford it so I don't see the problem. It's not what I would do but I enjoy exercising my creativity. I enjoy wiring. I enjoy doing scenery and building structures. Nevertheless, who am I to say what aspect of this diverse hobby one should embrace. Who am I to say that one who simply likes to run trains on a layout that he didn't actually build is any less into trains than I am.

In a similar vein, how many people enjoy collecting and have no layouts? And is one any less of a collector if one buys someone elses collection through an auction house rather than search for individual pieces on his own?

Regardless, we can learn from any layout--big or small. And it doesn't make any difference who did the work. Did you ever stop to consider that layout builders are hobbiests like us? They just happen to be good at it and found a way to earn money doing what they love. 

And just because a layout is large, it is still composed of small scenes, any one of which could be the inspiration for something on your small layout. So please enlighten me--where is the downside?

Dennis Brennan 

[Texas Pete]

fifedog

CTT is going to print what is submitted to it.  Jon Brooks' layout is small.  Heck, their recent project layout is small.  Under Carl, Bob,and Roger, things have been way more balanced in the past year.

If you guys want to see more small layouts in our beloved mag, then pick up this gauntlet and get writing.  If you need a writer/photographer to help you out (and live relatively close) call me.

 

HAY !  -  No fair makin' sense.

Pete

 

 

[arkady]

"Compact" is a bit of a loaded term because it's so subjective. A layout that's "compact" for someone with a big, open basement is likely to prove unmanageably huge for a hobbyist in a small house -- or worse, an apartment.

The often-unspoken dark side of the 3-rail hobby is that if you're an operator and not solely a collector, it's going to take a lot of room. O scale is even worse, since scale modeling generally requires wider curves. All the same, any but the smallest 3-rail layout still takes plenty of space.

[lionelsoni]

Wikipedia:  "...the term 'compact' was coined by George W. Romney as a euphemism for small cars with a wheelbase of 110 inches (2,794 mm) or less. The U.S. automobile industry soon adopted the term."

I guess if you're young enough, that's the only way you've heard the word used; so you consider it to be a synonym, rather than a automotive-industry euphemism, for "small".  If you're sufficiently well-read or, like me, old enough, you know that it meant and can still mean something else.  If Peoplefinders doesn't deceive me, the author, Carl Olson, is about 71 and must have been familiar with the word well before Romney started messing with it.

[sir james I]

Dennis B-1

You have a well thought out thread. I don't do word battles so mine stands as written.

[hrin]

 Good thread here.

 Carl's layout is really very nice.

From the pictures I would not think of it as compact nor dense. Pages 60-61 certainly do not look dense to me. But it does look great. Page 61 sidebar 1 states, "small but highly detailed O gauge layout." So obviously someone thinks that it is small. Carl stated  that "we decided to set aside space for a small layout."  When Carl and his wife planned the layout they commented that, the layout takes up the space of what would have been 2 bedrooms.

Probably Carl thinks of his layout as small because it does not take up the space of many of the basement RR empires commonly found in many magazines. The editor probably looking for a synonym for small should have chosen another descriptive term for the sub-title when he realized that it wasn't an under the bed layout. LOL. Duh.

Otherwise, it is a mighty fine layout and the story is great too.

 

[Brewman1973]

I have enjoyed reading the comments from everyone.  I have been reading CTT since issue # 1.  I wish I still had the issue with the attic floor layout. It was an American Flyer and covered the whole floor. I am not sure if this was a big or huge layout,  but the trackplan  had lots of switches and crossovers and there was always the possibility of a crash! No professional made that layout!  I also enjoyed the professionally build layout that was in a high rise condo (I think the owner had passed away).  It was beautiful layout and a showpiece. There were also articles on Frank Sinatra's custom built layout complete with its own building that looked like a depot and the golf pro that built a garage with his layout room and collection on the second floor. I am glad that the hobby can support the craftsmen that build these custom layouts and structures that appear from time to time in CTT.  Over the years, CTT has published many layout construction articles on how to build a layout from start to finish.  Most, if not all of those layouts would fit into a small bedroom. I would say that over the years, the articles have continually taken the the landscaping techniques to a higher level,  which frankly I like.  It took me over 40 years before I attempted to build my first mountain (my first train book was "An HO Railroad that Grows").  While I should have done it sooner, I am glad that I was able to built it with some of the more recent techniques.  

Lastly,  I am not sure how the articles in  the March CTT like building detail structures on page 38, or the terrific articles on the D-132 display or the improved track plan for the D-132 cater to the rich folks. I am a HUGE fan of Roger Carp and his articles and book on the Lionel Display layouts, which are in the 4x6 to 8x8 range.   Carl Olsen's compact layout looks really nice as well.

Now that my oldest son has moved out of the house, I am able to convert his room (which, when he was a little kid, had a roll a way layout under his bed) to a train room complete with shelves. Come to think of it,  I seem to remember a few articles on building under the bed layouts as well.

All the best, to everyone.  

  Dave from Tacoma

 

  

[initagain]

Let's all step back and put things into perspective.  I'll bet most, if not all contributors to this forum, well remember when they were kids, starting out with a basic oval, or figure eight, with a siding or two for accessories.  We could literally get HOURS of enjoyment from that simple concept.  As we all grew older, and maybe accumulated more of the wherewithal to build bigger and better layouts, including the passion to do so, many of us tried to bring our childhood dreams to reality.  A big part of that reality is having the funds to buy all the equipment needed, and another part is having the time and patience to put it all together. 

As with most projects, simpler versions are more than enough to satisfy the wants and needs of the vast majority of, in this case, model railroaders.  There are always those who dream BIG and are able to achieve those dreams. whether on their own or by having someone do it for them.

My point is, as long as the person who built a layout is happy with what he or she has accomplished, that should be their personal reward.  There is always a bigger and better layout somewhere, but it is unrealistic for most people to even try to duplicate them.  In the case of model railroading, "size DOESN'T matter."

 

[Wes Whitmore]

As a relative newcomer to model trains, compact to me means anything that fits in a spare bedroom on 4 to 6 legs...and approaching portable/removable/hidable/temporary.  Anything bigger is a small layout.

Wes