Still looking & gathering information to buy my first 0 gauge train set. Probably a Lionel track, controls etc
Can any 0 gauge/ brand of trains run on a Lionel setup? Or do you have to buy everything brand specific?
I see many brands of engines etc, are the interchangable? Thanks
Yes, in general, everything works together fairly well.
Track, of course, isn't directly compatible, however most brands can be readily adapted at least to match up with standard Lionel O-gauge tubular track.
Some MTH engines don't like the basic Lionel transformer that comes with starter sets.
If you plan on getting into command control, MTH is off by themselves and uncompatable. Others use the Lionel system.
Some Williams engines don't like certain Lionel switches in tubular track, mainly the 6-23010, you may see why if you encounter problems!! Certain engines by MTH need the MTH transformer to work correctly, the Lionel CW-80 is not always MTH compatible.
Most track systems should handle anything made recently. The issues are combining track systems, example Atlas track & Lionel's Fastrac. When combining track systems track height is another factor to take into consideration.
Lee F.
I have various train cars by different manufacturers .... mostly diecast/all metal . The first most important item in my opinion is a good powerful transformer ... don't waste money on a smaller unit . Then next the engine ... then track . It's a whole world of fun building your car collection and I'd advise against pre-boxed train sets . 99% of the time you'll get very underpowered transformers and low grade cars .
Roger Bielen If you plan on getting into command control, MTH is off by themselves and uncompatable. Others use the Lionel system.
I think this statement is a bit misleading especially for newbies to the hobby. You can run Lionel's TMCC, Legacy and MTH's DCS all on the same layout at the same time. You can run any engine with TMCC using the DCS system. You cannot run MTH engines with the TMCC or Legacy system.
Spummerr, as someone who operates what some would call "low-end" and got his re-entry in the hobby from starter sets, I hope I can help.
I will differ from Ole Timer's take in that I think the quality of today's Lionel's starter sets is better than it has been in a long time. Yes, most starter train sets come with a smaller transformer, but you can upgrade later, or even use several small transformers to meet your power needs. And the cars that come with starter sets tend to (but not always) to have plastic trucks and more plastic construction, but that's not always the drawback some might think. I actually like the cars that come in current Lionel sets: lighter cars are more easily pulled by a locomotive and don 't make as much noise running on the track... a consideration for those living in apartments or duplex housing with DOWNSTAIRS neighbors.
I'm just guessing, but since you are starting, I'm gonna take a guess that you won't be jumping off into expensive high end trains to start. Any of the basic Lionel train sets will get you off to a good start. The big issues with compatibility between brands have to do with two factors: electronics in the locomotives and scale fidelity of the train cars. I'm no expert in digital control, so I'll leave that one. Most (not all, but most) starter train sets come with what are termed "traditionally sized" train cars. This meaning the usual types of train cars that people have run for the 90 years of this hobby before true scale fidelity and proportion became popular. You can run those cars together, but a true-to-scale 40 foot box car will look a little odd next to a box car that comes with the typical Lionel starter set.
As far as compatibility, I run the typical Lionel 4-4-2 starter set steam locos along with other sorts of similar locos that have DC can motors: Lionel GP's, Lionel Alco FA's, postwar Lionel (Lionel made before 1969), MPC-era Lionel (Lionel made during 1970-1986), K-Line S-2's, MP-15's and Alco FA diesels, RMT Budd cars and Williams. Most of these locos have Mabuchi DC can motors with a rectifier in the reverse unit circuit board that allows them to run from AC current off a transformer. I don't run anything that has any kind of digital control or fancy electronics. The only problem you would have running a Williams loco with Lionel is that you would need a larger transformer to properly run them since Williams uses a 6amp reverse unit board in their locos.
On that thought, you can eventually buy a used Lionel 1033 transformer for under $50, which is a very versatile and practical transformer for any small to mid-size layout. I think for the money and it'sversatility, it's the best transformer ever made by Lionel period.
A somewhat similar situation is with some postwar Lionel locos. Most Lionel locos up to the 1980's came with what is called an open frame AC motor. These motors usually need a transformer that is a little bigger and more powerful to run them. This would be so with the larger Lionel locos like the Hudson, the FM Trainmaster and the venerable F-3. BUT during the MPC years, Lionel made a good many starter locos that came with a little lower quality AC open frame motors and plastic gears and many of these will run fine with a normal Lionel transfromer that comes with a starter set.
Many knock MPC Lionel for using the plastic gears, but if they are well maintained and cared for, are fine. I have Lionel MPC locos that are over 35 years old and still run and see regular running on my layout.
Over the years, K-Line (before they went bankrupt and came under Lionel's banner) made some resepctable starter sets which can still be found. The cars in some of these sets came with somewhat smaller cars that were based on the old MARX trains dies. These cars are a little more sparce in detail and a little smaller than the typical cars in a Lionel Steam Flyer Set, but won't look out of place running with those cars.
I know this is a lot of info. The hobby has changed over the years and we have more options and variety today than ever. But that also makes it a little more confusing to someone just startings. Give it time, ask questions and you'll learn as you go along.
brianel, Agent 027
"Praise the Lord. I may not have everything I desire, but the Lord has come through for what I need."
Pappy Roger Bielen If you plan on getting into command control, MTH is off by themselves and uncompatable. Others use the Lionel system. I think this statement is a bit misleading especially for newbies to the hobby. You can run Lionel's TMCC, Legacy and MTH's DCS all on the same layout at the same time. You can run any engine with TMCC using the DCS system. You cannot run MTH engines with the TMCC or Legacy system.
Yes you can but in conventional mode. You can run TMCC and Legacy with DCS but you lose a lot of the features. If you are going to buy Atlas, Weaver 3rd Rail and Lionel, TMCC and Legacy is the way to go. If you plan on buying MTH, DCS is it. If you plan on buying them all, get them all. I have both systems and they run together great.
God bless TCA 05-58541 Benefactor Member of the NRA, Member of the American Legion, Retired Boss Hog of Roseyville , KC&D Qualified
I haven't even looked into power controls etc yet. Looks like a new can of worms to be dealt with, lol
I long for the simple days & joys of childhood, plug it in a play with it, lol
Thanks all.
I use good old fashion Lionel tubular track and a ZW transformer. I have Lionel, MTH, Williams, Marx, and many other brands of trains and don't have many problems running them together. Sometimes the prewar American Flyers do a little hop while going over a switch cause the flanges bottom out but they don't derail. I run TMCC without a problem. I like the tubular because it's cheap and you can cut it with a hacksaw for custom pieces and solder right onto it. It's all on what your preference is.
One thing to watch if you go used, vintage, antique store or auction. During the MPC era of Lionel some trains run on DC only. They use the same 3 rail track but if you run one of the locos on anything other than a DC transformer (read evry other Lionel or any other 3 rail "O") you will damage the loco. They can be converted but that might be more than you want to get into now.
Take my statement for what it's worth but ... who wants 3-10 transformers ? And if you goto a local shop or show you'll see the cars in most starter sets are usually without windows... without lighting ... plastic trucks are on them ... and very little of any detail of realism . And most engines are on the complete bottom end of the lines . I was just saying if you want to get into it without a room full of items that will end up in boxes ... take your time and get more advanced train hardware .... just my opinion ... but a few great items are worth more than a room full of much lesser components . And Chief is completely correct .... in my opinion for what it's worth ... I wish I had gotten the MTH - DCS control system and added only the tmcc components needed ... instead of going totally tmcc ... you get the best of both worlds of all the engines and addons out there . Then you can run ALL of the lionel based and ALL of the MTH configured items from one advanced system . I was just trying to save you from wasting money as I did and not being able to buy and completely run everything made . Take your time and do it right ... it's alot of fun building your own customized outfit !
The last couple of Lionel starter sets I've bought have been great. One of them, for example, had three cars and a caboose, all of them with diecast trucks/couplers. One of the cars is an operating boxcar, and it has interior illumination and a stamped metal frame-it's very much the same quality as its postwar counterpart, just with much better trucks. This same set also has an illuminated caboose.
I also have the Harry Potter set, which, while it does have plastic trucks, has lights in all of the cars. The engine in thiis set is a real little gem, too.
So, I think that accusing starter sets of being low quality is an unfair criticism-I don't think that any Lionel sets these days come with an unlighted caboose or no windows. If there are any, they're the very bottom of the line sets.
I'm only into "O" for a short time and was into the 'one manufacturer' mindset when I started. These guys have some very good thoughts. After reading past posts, I took a chance and purchased some MTH, K-line and Williams rolling stock. They worked well. The difference that I found was in the detail. There is a lot of plastic stuff on the shelves but not all necessarily bad. I might suggest that you take your time and take into consideration how you intend to use the stock. (Active usage or mainly for 'show') Also, I would kind-of decide if I were going to go with the Standard "O" or the "O27" as the sizes, although they work well together, their proportions might not "gel".
As far as mixing brands: One of my layout favorites is a RMT New York Central Beep pulling a consist of NYC passenger cars from a Lionel Expansion set.
I am an O27 tubular guy with an old ZW and a newer CW80. Most of my stock is Postwar but I have run consists which included modern era cars with no problems.
Good luck and keep us posted.
All of the advice that has been metioned is all well and good. But, you must consider other determining factors. If there's a hobbyshop near you, what brand does that establishment primarily stock. The second is, on site availability of spare parts, and thirdly on site repairs.
ACF1001 All of the advice that has been metioned is all well and good. But, you must consider other determining factors. If there's a hobbyshop near you, what brand does that establishment primarily stock. The second is, on site availability of spare parts, and thirdly on site repairs.
What about warrenty repairs? Does the company that sells the product acknowledge a defect with their product or make the consumer eat the product after the sale?
Lee, Thank you for pointing that out to me. In addtion, what is the policy between the retailer and the manufacturer in regard to defects, parts, etc. Retailers are customers too.
I would probably suggest:
When most people think of O--they think of Lionel. Start with the king and see what happens. I started With MTH and MTH track and got a hard time by some of the Lionel *** when I started. also, if you leave the hobby, Lionel is the name everybody knows--just sayin'.
Lionel Fastrack and tubular are also the most common and most easy to get and expand and sell.
All I really want is a choochoo that puffs smoke and blows a whistle.
As for me, I have tubular, fastrack and a little MTH. I run Lionel, MTH Atlas, Weaver, Ready-Made Toys, and a little extra I can't remember. I want to get a Williams loco, but it's on hold for now.
Do what your heart tells you. It's a great hobby and don't let the choices intimidate you. Also, youll eventually be able to pull it all together. How about buying a few Ready to run sets and try each?
Buy a MTH and a Lionel for starters. Use each's transformer and track. Explore each. Sell the loser or keep it and run each loop independently. There's a great market for the stuff you decide you don't want.
Welcome to the hobby. Best wishes,
Dan
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