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2321 changes directions when crossing 022 switches??

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2321 changes directions when crossing 022 switches??
Posted by lionel2 on Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:20 PM

I have a maroon top 2321 FM diesel and when it goes over 022 switches it changes directions.  It completely goes from forward to reverse, no neutral.  Is this because the pickups are at far ends of the engine??  and not on just 1 power truck??  thanks.

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Posted by lionelsoni on Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:45 PM

It's because the pickups are being interrupted twice, wherever the gaps in the middle rail happen to be.  Check whether both trucks' pickups are connected.  There's a good chance that one of them has come open, leaving your locomotive dependent on only one pickup roller and vulnerable to every gap in the turnout.

Bob Nelson

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Posted by lionel2 on Sunday, July 27, 2008 10:11 PM

So basically the E-Unit and motors are getting power from one pickup??  So, how should i check which one is the bad one??  Try to see if it moves with one set of truck on track and then try the other truck, whichever one does not make motors move is the bad one, correct??

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Posted by dougdagrump on Sunday, July 27, 2008 10:59 PM
A simple test is to put a small strip of electrical tape on the center rail and slowly approach the tape, if the loco stops when it encounters the tape only one p/u roller is functional.

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Posted by lionelsoni on Monday, July 28, 2008 4:52 PM

What Doug suggests should work; but, with the shell off, you might easily see a broken wire.

(When you put the shell back on, consider putting a washer between the shell and the metal tab that each screw goes into.  The shells are usually too long; so tightening the screw can crack the shell.)

Bob Nelson

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Posted by lionel2 on Monday, July 28, 2008 5:18 PM
My shell is not cracked on both ends, but i read years ago to keep those screw loose or even out of the holes, cause that shell tends to crack.  I am careful.  They look good, I tried the tape on the track, appears the loco is okay..both pickups are getting power to motors and e-unit...seems like it trips at low speed too.  High speed across the switches is not a problem.
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Posted by lionelsoni on Monday, July 28, 2008 5:28 PM

So it's not so simple a problem.  Can you tell whether the locomotive's circuit is coming open or shorted?  If it's an open circuit, other lights powered by the same track circuit will stay lit as you cross the turnout.  If it's a short circuit, those other lights will wink.

The reason I'm inquiring about the possibility of a short circuit is that that locomotive's pickup design is a bit flawed.  They located the pickup rollers between the blind drivers, which are at the end of the truck that moves the farthest sideways on curves.  On Lionel O27 turnouts they reliably touch the turnout points; but I would have thought they would be okay with 022s.  If this turns out to be the problem, an easy fix is to rotate the pickup assemblies 180 degrees, putting the rollers between flanged wheels.

By the way, does the problem happen on both straight and curved paths through the turnouts?

Bob Nelson

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Posted by lionel2 on Monday, July 28, 2008 8:34 PM

Yes, it happens on both straight and curve turnouts.  I have 21 locos and this is the only one that bugs me.  Cause i like to run slow with my trains and everytime i go over a switch it switches directions.  Will i be able to turn the pickups 180 degrees??  thanks.

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Posted by dougdagrump on Monday, July 28, 2008 9:33 PM

Does it bounce a lot going thru the switch regardless of turnout or straight ?

Do all the connections, solder or wire nut, appear to be secure ?

If it bounces thru the switch could the p/u roller or it's frame be shorting to the motor truck ?

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Posted by lionel2 on Tuesday, July 29, 2008 6:09 AM
All wiring looks good.  It does not bounce when going through the switches.  The e-unit must be very sensitive or something.  Not sure what to do now!! 
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Posted by lionelsoni on Tuesday, July 29, 2008 5:34 PM

Turning the pickups around is very easy; but I expect that it will not solve the problem, since it occurs on the straight path as well as the curved.  For anyone who does want to reverse the pickups, just loosen the screw that holds the pickup assembly on, rotate the assembly, including the insulator, 180 degrees, and retighten the screw.  The insulator will no longer be locked in place by the bosses on the truck casting; but it will stay put if the screw is reasonable tight.

Have you done the experiment to determine whether the problem is an open circuit or a short circuit?

After I wrote the above, it occurred to me that rotating the pickups will put them about 2 1/4 inches closer together.  If the problem does turn out to involve an unfortunate spacing of gaps on the turnout, changing the spacing might solve it.  You can alse achieve an intermediate change of 1 1/8 inches by rotating only one pickup.

Bob Nelson

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