Semaphore Wiring Help

[Anonymous]

Hi, I am looking for some help with a Lionel 82N Automatic Semaphore.  I have rewired the accessory and am now trying to figure out how I should wire it to function correctly.  When putting the wires to power on the  transformer, two of them light the bulb, and two of them raise the flag.  The signal color changes from red to green when the flag raises, so I am assuming that a track based switch is used to trigger the flag, what is used to trigger the light, or should I just power the light anytime the train is running?  Thanks for your help.

[envfocus]

First, welcome to the forum.  I have placed a scanned copy of the instructions for the 82N on the link below.  The instructions are in .pdf format, so you'll need Adobe Reader to view it.  If you have troubles, post again.  Hopefully, this will help.

http://tinplaterr.homestead.com/temp.html

[lionelsoni]

Here is my educated guess of how it is supposed to work:

The lamp is wired between 82N terminals 1 and 2, which are connected to the track outside of the insulated block with 1 connected to the center rail and 2 to the outside rails, so the lamp stays on as long as there is voltage on the track.

A heater inside the 82N is wired between 82N terminals 1 and 3.  Terminal 3 is connected to the outside rails through the contactor (or could be connected to an insulated outside control rail).  When the train approaches the semaphore, the heater begins to heat up and, after an adjustable delay, moves a bimetallic strip to close a contact inside the 82N.

The contact connects 82N terminals 1 and 4 together.  Terminal 4 is connected to the insulated center rail.  So, after the delay, the train, which has stopped facing the semaphore, starts up again.

The solenoid inside the 82N is wired between terminals 2 and 4.  So, when the contact closes to put voltage on the insulated center rail, it also operates the solenoid, raising the blade and changing the light from red to green.  (It is supposed to appear that the train's starting up was in response to that blade's motion; but it is actually the other way around, that the startup changes the signal.)

After the train has passed, the bimetallic strip cools down, the contact opens, and the semaphore blade returns to the stop aspect.

[RS3hostler]

I have a different model semaphore, so I'm not sure if this reply will be of any use. Also, I'm using an old type CW80 (built in 12-05). I also have a Lionel PowerMax Plus (date code G0208), which is basically a 40 watt version of the CW80 without any accessory terminals.

The semaphore I'm using is a Lionel Mainline Operating Semaphore (model 6-22944). When wired up to the 153C contactor that comes with it, the unit operates normally. It also functions normally when hooked up to the PowerMax and the throttle is set to 50% or higher. You can download the manual with wiring diagrams from the Lionel web site.

http://www.lionel.com/media/servicedocuments/72-2944-250.pdf

The problem occurs when you attempt to use a FasTrack activator section (Model 6-12029). When wired according to the manual's diagram, the lamp works but the semaphore blade fails to activate. Knowing the problem with early models of the CW-80, I tried reversing the terminals. In one configuration, I got the semaphore working after a fashion, but the lamp went out whenever the blade was activated.

The correct wiring is to hook up the RED semaphore wire to the RED accessory terminal on the CW-80 (labeled Terminal A), and the BLACK wire to the BLACK accessory post (Terminal U). The WHITE semaphore should be connected to the insulated rail that comes with the Accessory Activator Pack. The common rail should then be connected to the Black accessory post (Terminal U). Make sure this connection is outside the breaks in the isolated section.

I have tested this set up and it appears to work. The lamp stays lit and the semaphore blade is pulled down when a car enters the insulated track section. At 12 Volts the blade hovers between the red and yellow aspects, so you may wish to reprogram the accessory terminals to 14 or 16 volts.

I've only tried this set-up with an old model CW-80, so I don't know if the issue is with the transformer or with the manual diagrams. Based on the way the 153C is hooked up, I suspect the problem is with page 7 in manual itself. The terminals in the diagram (page 4) aren't labeled but that set-up works. Therefore the red and black wires must be the power leads to the semaphore lamp, while the white wire--when grounded--activates the solenoid and triggers the semaphore blade.

Has anyone else had similar issues with the CW-80 or the Mainline Semaphore?

Henry

[RS3hostler]

This is a follow-up to my post above. I've tested Lionel's Mainline Semaphore with the PowerMax Plus. This unit was manufactured in Feb 2008, so I assume Lionel has fixed whatever problems existed with the CW80 series.

When hooked up as I outlined above, the semaphore functions normally with a FasTrack activator track. When the red and white leads are reversed (white to post A, red to rail detector, black still at common ground) the semaphore will activate, but the lamp will go out. Since the

If my theory is correct, then the diagram for the 153IR infrared controller may also be wrong. The diagram on page 6 (Lionel 72-2944-250 10/03) shows Black going to ACC GND, Red to NO and White to NC. According to my theory, the correct hook-up should be Black to ACC GND, Red to ACC PWR and White to NO. I haven't had a chance to test this out though. If anyone has any experience with CW-80s, Lionel Semaphores and FasTrack, I would greatly appreciated their comments.

If I'm able, I will post a corrected diagram on this forum.

Henry

[Dana]

Can you please show me a diagram of how the semaphore is wired to  fastrack.  Thanks, Dana

[Plate Rail]

My inability to post a picture means you'll need to click on the link

?tn=1581407506

From the 1940 Lionel Assembly and Operation manual:

"The 82N automatic Semaphore and the 99N Color Signal are Automatic Train Controls.  Instead of being connected to transformer, they require two lockons on track and the no.41 Contactor, as shown in Figure 31.  You can make the necessary insulated block of track by using the fibre pins furnished with the accessory.  At the place in the track layout where the accessory is desired, remove three (3) sections of track.  Insert the two fibre pins at the extreme ends of the center rails of the three joined sections.  Replace the three sections of track in your layout, and you have made an insulated block.  Follow Figure 31 closely for the location of lockons with relation to the Contactor, and insulated block.  Note that one Lockon is inside the insulated block; the other outside.  It is very important that the numbered terminals on the accessory should be connected to the proper terminals on the Lockon as shown in the illustration.  The wiring is the same for both 82N and 99N."

Once wired, you'll need to do adjustments to the No.41 Contactor and the lever on  the Semaphore to fine tune the train block operation.

Please excuse the manual if it sounds somewhat condescending.  Remember, it was printed so that children could understand