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Siemens vs. Alstom - the US market

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Siemens vs. Alstom - the US market
Posted by Gramp on Wednesday, September 6, 2023 1:32 AM
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Posted by CMStPnP on Wednesday, September 6, 2023 11:24 AM

Gramp
Do the Japanese want in?

The Japanese are very risk averse and this is precisely why I don't think the trainset provider or design of Texas Central will stay Japanese for long.    Alstom has been in the Texas market before with the long ago Texas Triangle proposal and they indicated when Texas Central announced Japan that they wanted back in.   My guess is that if Texas Central ever advances beyond just a dream it will end up as either an Alstom or Siemens project at some point.   Japanese wanted Texas Central as a kind of break into the American market type project but they are far too timid as far as risk is concerned and want a "sure thing" type project unless you have deep pockets already.    So my view is Japan is on borrowed time with the Texas project if it ever gets off the ground.    Also, I do not see Amtrak going with Japanese Shinkensen trainsets when they have selected Alstom in the Northeast.

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Posted by oltmannd on Wednesday, September 6, 2023 11:35 AM

CMStPnP

 

 
Gramp
Do the Japanese want in?

 

The Japanese are very risk averse and this is precisely why I don't think the trainset provider or design of Texas Central will stay Japanese for long.    Alstom has been in the Texas market before with the long ago Texas Triangle proposal and they indicated when Texas Central announced Japan that they wanted back in.   My guess is that if Texas Central ever advances beyond just a dream it will end up as either an Alstom or Siemens project at some point.   Japanese wanted Texas Central as a kind of break into the American market type project but they are far too timid as far as risk is concerned and want a "sure thing" type project unless you have deep pockets already.    So my view is Japan is on borrowed time with the Texas project if it ever gets off the ground.    Also, I do not see Amtrak going with Japanese Shinkensen trainsets when they have selected Alstom in the Northeast.

 

There are quite a few Alstom-haters in the advocate community because of the mess with Amtrak's new Acela trains - years in the making and not good to go, yet.  Apparently not really "off the shelf" stuff.

Although the problem may be Amtrak. If you compare the relative ease that Brighline got their Siemen's stuff going vs. Amtrak - for nearly identical equipment...some STILL isn't in service.  

So, If I'm doing HSR in TX, I'd be inclined to get clones of DB ICE 3 trainsets.  Tried and true...and has been making stuff in the US for a while.  (Stadler would be good, too, but not for HSR.)

So, what's going on at Amtrak?  Is mechanical dept too strong, too siloed, too weak, writing bad specs, not doing good QC at manufacturer, too distracted, too interested in control to let go?  I have no idea, although I have seen some of these things at CR and NS play out well and poorly over the years...

-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/

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Posted by CMStPnP on Wednesday, September 6, 2023 5:06 PM

oltmannd
So, what's going on at Amtrak?  Is mechanical dept too strong, too siloed, too weak, writing bad specs, not doing good QC at manufacturer, too distracted, too interested in control to let go?  I have no idea, although I have seen some of these things at CR and NS play out well and poorly over the years...

Thats the question.   If you talk to Amtrak, Beach Grove is the seventh wonder of the world for getting things fixed.    If you talk to private passenger car owners about Beach Grove and they usually say something like: "they won't ever touch my car".    Also read the term "hatchet job" at one point in discussions of their work there.   I have no idea whats true and whats not but I don't think Amtrak has a good reputation at much..........outside of Amtrak.

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Posted by JC UPTON on Thursday, September 7, 2023 8:22 AM

the spelling is seimEns

from the Far East of the Sunset Route

(In the shadow of the Huey P Long bridge)

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Posted by Overmod on Thursday, September 7, 2023 9:02 AM

JC UPTON
the spelling is seimEns

No, it isn't.  It's Siemens.

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Posted by ATSFGuy on Thursday, September 7, 2023 11:20 AM

I wonder how the new "Airo" sets will play out.....

Siemans is based in Munich, Germany.

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Posted by CMStPnP on Thursday, September 7, 2023 1:21 PM

ATSFGuy
Siemans is based in Munich, Germany.

Their trainsets are built in the United States with locally sourced parts.   They have been making Central Office phone switches in the United States since at least the early 1990's and their switches make up a chunk of the US PSTN.    So it's only been like three decades so far, even if folks don't know how to spell the firms name.

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Posted by JC UPTON on Sunday, September 10, 2023 9:04 AM

Yes, sorry...

 

But my point was that thers in no "A" in the name

from the Far East of the Sunset Route

(In the shadow of the Huey P Long bridge)

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