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Door on front of cab car

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  • Member since
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Posted by mudchicken on Wednesday, January 19, 2022 9:52 PM

Collision Posts are a constantly evolving science in cars with cabs and locomotives. TTC in Pueblo has been crashing different versions into obstacles for years. Some of the video is dramatic.

Crash Energy Management Coupling Test between a Coach Car and a Passenger Locomotive | FRA (dot.gov)

Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, January 18, 2022 2:29 PM

cv_acr

The newer cab cars they build now have full locomotive style cabs, and no doors/can't really be used mid-train (at least not if you want to allow passengers to travel between cars) like the old cars. On operators that have the new cars some of the older cab cars that have the end diaphragms and doors end are still used as cabs, but also just get bumped down to being used as "regular" cars as they get replaced by the new cab cars.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127041560@N03/43734919662

 

You are lucky in Canada to have the Bombardier cars.

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, January 18, 2022 12:06 PM

As we get further into providing S.580 level of protection to cab cars, the likelihood of having a 'safe module' with full CEM in the usual places older cab cars provided their 'cabs' gets smaller and smaller, with the module still being at risk in many types of collision or derailment.  It is not surprising that what winds up implemented is a new center cab with full heavy post construction, etc.

It is also not surprising that these cabs don't feature center doors and diaphragms a la Metroliner, with the required doors or other interior partitions that would be needed to lock off access to train controls.  The situation is less difficult if the cab is 'on the upper level' but then you have the problems with emergency egress for the engineer While maintaining room for the top of the passage connection on the 'main deck'.

We recently observed a situation in which even emergency nose access couldn't be easily provided in Genesis-carbodied units.

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Posted by cv_acr on Tuesday, January 18, 2022 10:29 AM

The newer cab cars they build now have full locomotive style cabs, and no doors/can't really be used mid-train (at least not if you want to allow passengers to travel between cars) like the old cars. On operators that have the new cars some of the older cab cars that have the end diaphragms and doors end are still used as cabs, but also just get bumped down to being used as "regular" cars as they get replaced by the new cab cars.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127041560@N03/43734919662

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, January 18, 2022 10:06 AM

As a longtime rider on Metra's Southwest Service, I have observed cab cars placed midtrain on a regular basis.  I've also noticed the practice on other lines.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, January 18, 2022 10:03 AM

daveklepper

1.  Multile-unit electric trains have had  the lack of protection exhibited  by cab-cars since the very first elevated railroad electrifications with MUs in 1902 and 1903 in Chicago and New York, the Long Island Railroad in 1905, and the New York Central suburban MUs of 1906.

2.  Most commuter railroads discourage passage from-car-to-car, which is why few commuter cars employ duaphtagms. 

3.  But crew-members usually need this ability.

4.  A cab-car may be used in the middle of a train on occasion.  An example might be a commuter railroad that runs eight-car trains duribg rush hours and 4-car trasins at all other times.

 

1. Metra in Chicago area operates many gallery cab cars with diesel power on other end in push-pull service and have for years. I am unaware of higher danger to the engineer or passengers.

2. On Metra, all cars are diaphragm equipped. Passengers often move to other cars after boarding to find s seat during rush hour.

4. Cab cars are often in the middle of train. These days most consists are usually fixed in length.

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Posted by 7j43k on Tuesday, January 18, 2022 9:53 AM

daveklepper

1.  Multile-unit electric trains have had  the lack of protection exhibited  by cab-cars since the very first elevated railroad electrifications with MUs in 1902 and 1903 in Chicago and New York, the Long Island Railroad in 1905, and the New York Central suburban MUs of 1906.

Yes, and the same holds for RDC's.  But we're not talking about MU cars.

2.  Most commuter railroads discourage passage from-car-to-car, which is why few commuter cars employ duaphtagms. 

3.  But crew-members usually need this ability.

I'm not arguing for using diaphragms.

4.  A cab-car may be used in the middle of a train on occasion.  An example might be a commuter railroad that runs eight-car trains duribg rush hours and 4-car trasins at all other times.

I don't doubt that they CAN.  I am wondering when and how often they ARE.  And if they're never used on a particular route, why have them?  

When and how often are cab cars run in the interior of the California Capitol Corridor trains?  I don't recall seeing such a thing, yet the cab cars have end doors.  And go through grade crossings.

 

Maybe there should be a thick steel plate over the door opening, mounted on a hinge.  If the car is running mid-train, the plate can be swung out of the way.  

 

Of course, there's still the windows.  I AM pleased to note that run-ins between cab cars and gasoline tank trucks are not something that appears to happen frequently.

 

Ed

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 18, 2022 4:12 AM

1.  Multile-unit electric trains have had  the lack of protection exhibited  by cab-cars since the very first elevated railroad electrifications with MUs in 1902 and 1903 in Chicago and New York, the Long Island Railroad in 1905, and the New York Central suburban MUs of 1906.

2.  Most commuter railroads discourage passage from-car-to-car, which is why few commuter cars employ duaphtagms. 

3.  But crew-members usually need this ability.

4.  A cab-car may be used in the middle of a train on occasion.  An example might be a commuter railroad that runs eight-car trains duribg rush hours and 4-car trasins at all other times.

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Posted by 7j43k on Monday, January 17, 2022 6:02 PM

Seems like a swell way to allow a lot of flammable liquid to enter the train on crash impact.

I'd sure like to hear how this possible risk is overridden by the utility of cab-cars inside a train consist.  When and how often are these placed thusly?

 

Ed

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Posted by Lithonia Operator on Monday, January 17, 2022 3:23 PM

Thanks, Balt.

Still in training.


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Posted by BaltACD on Monday, January 17, 2022 2:58 PM

Cab cars MAY be used within a train and sometimes may not be in the lead.  I don't know how much passengers are moving within the train - if they do move from car to car they need doors to pass through.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Door on front of cab car
Posted by Lithonia Operator on Monday, January 17, 2022 2:35 PM

Why do cab cars, like the California and Surfliner ones, have a door in the front? Is this just an additional exit for use in emergencies? I can't think of any reason to have pass-thru capability on a cab car in normal usage. Are all passenger-carrying cars required to have a door on each end? At first I was thinking that round-end observation cars don't, but on further refelection I guess actually they do.

Somewhat off-topic: isn't the engineer in a cab car much more vulnerable to injury in a collision than in a locomotive?

Still in training.


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