Wow, how did they get to adding two additional trains each way between Chicago and St. Paul........it used to be just one additional Frequency I thought.
https://www.wpr.org/plans-increase-amtrak-service-between-twin-cities-chicago-move-forward
My reading of the article was adding a second train to the existing Empire Builder. The fact that they are only doing "pre-environmental tasks" before doing phase 2 of the environmental study shows they have a long way to go with no clear picture of success. But at least they are still moving forward.
CMStPnP Wow, how did they get to adding two additional trains each way between Chicago and St. Paul........it used to be just one additional Frequency I thought. https://www.wpr.org/plans-increase-amtrak-service-between-twin-cities-chicago-move-forward It's ONE round trip--with a departure from each endpoint mid- to late-morning, essentially extending a Chicago-MKE Hiawatha corridor train. This will require two trainsets, of course. It's a silly plan, because, among other things, it's not clear whether these trains would connect to or from anything at Chicago, the Minnesota end of the line will be St. Paul, not Minneapolis, and it may use Horizon cars. We know what kind of traffic uses the train in this corridor when it only runs Chicago-St. Paul--whenever the Builder is annulled west of St. Paul and Amtrak runs a "Baby Builder," #707/807--it draws maybe 75 passengers per run. Two buses worth. This is happening because the states are allowing themselves to be led by Amtrak rather than soliciting proposals from interested private sector operators, like Herzog, Bombardier, Veolia, or Virgin Trains.
ANDREW C SELDENThis is happening because the states are allowing themselves to be led by Amtrak rather than soliciting proposals from interested private sector operators, like Herzog, Bombardier, Veolia, or Virgin Trains.
Not sure I would agree. Exchanged Emails with the Wisconsin guy in charge of Amtrak / State services. He seems to be fairly smart. Though I did not ask him a lot of questions, he shared some of Amtraks positions on things and I think his opinion was spot on. It's how I found out Amtrak only markets to one specific market segment overall and thats why their sleeper and dining car services are priced the way they are (what Amtrak was charging for snack car services was a sore point with Wisconsin and they finally threw in the towel on the Hiawatha service).
Also found out that Amtrak does not like to schedule trains to depart after 10 to 11 p.m. from any end point. In fact, the late night Hiawatha service from Chicago on Friday was a DOT idea, Amtrak never would have tried that schedule on it's own and would have viewed it as too risky (so much for overnight sleeper trains).......and the Friday late night slot, turned out to be more successful revenue wise than the very early morning departure......which they later dumped.
So to me at least, it appears there is some independent thinking on behalf of the states and they are asking Amtrak common sense questions on schedules as well as pricing approach.
When Amtrak does not have enough marketing persons how can it possibley predict when out of standard time departures will work ? The WI trial ( that WI paid for ) is an example of what needs to be studied . The lack of equiment is also a big constraint !
For instance night trips between locations. During the 1980s Eastern Air lines initiated a Night coach hub that connected at CHI Ohare and later Houston. The airplanes carried large cargo loads but sold passenger seats as well but no checked bags. Result ? Cargo and passenger sold out almost every night. Why didn't it continue ? Airplane parts could not be provided fast enough to continue running planes 20+ hours a day . Too many parts were flying time limited . Builder was not Boeing.
Mpw is there enough demand for night train service in 2017 -,2022 ? Who knows ? Then we get into the maintenance and cleaning problems.
blue streak 1 When Amtrak does not have enough marketing persons how can it possibley predict when out of standard time departures will work ? The WI trial ( that WI paid for ) is an example of what needs to be studied . The lack of equiment is also a big constraint ! For instance night trips between locations. During the 1980s Eastern Air lines initiated a Night coach hub that connected at CHI Ohare and later Houston. The airplanes carried large cargo loads but sold passenger seats as well but no checked bags. Result ? Cargo and passenger sold out almost every night. Why didn't it continue ? Airplane parts could not be provided fast enough to continue running planes 20+ hours a day . Too many parts were flying time limited . Builder was not Boeing. Mpw is there enough demand for night train service in 2017 -,2022 ? Who knows ? Then we get into the maintenance and cleaning problems.
It would be a large mountain to climb because you have to educate the business traveler as well as employer on the costs saved via overnight travel in order to get them to at least cover the sleeper. Overnight service between Dallas and KC would need to come in under approx $400 each way in order for me to get my employer to reimburse all of it. Spoke to my employer about it and their proposal for Amtrak LD was pay only the coach fare and only if it was comparable to the airfare.......they completely ommitted the fact that flying by air resulted in the following extra costs Amtrak was picking up or by arriving downtown KC mitigated:
$165 for a hotel night
$65 per diem (meals on train are free if on sleeper)
$40 Airport Shuttle (hotel connected to KC Union Station by skywalk, hotel also has shuttle that would pick me up.....if I was really lazy)
So I would have to negotiate more with them if such a train ever becomes reality because they would come out ahead $270 each trip and that is not accounted for in just paying for coach vs airfare.
I don't think Amtrak would price Sleeper plus Rail Fare under $400 between Dallas and KC. So typically Southwest would beat Amtrak each time in the comparison.
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