Have changed title as will become apparent.
Arrived Orlando today and all media reports showed all trains SRO jammed, Did not observe trains yet but even this first 2 days of free rides in the downpours that occurred here have not stopped riders from flocking to trains.
All trains shown were just 2 cars ( cc & coach ) + loco.. Trains ended up being late due to ? Could be unfamiliarity of riding trains causing longer than planned dwell times ? Additionally due to high demand Sun Rail continued 1/2 hr schedule at mid day which left no time for schedule recovery. Schedule only requires 3 train sets ? Will try to find out why no longer trains unless equipment not yet available ?,
With Sun Rail starting tomorrow already there are dreams of extending it to Daytona Beach. For those not aware of history. The Volusia county leaders in the 1960 - 70s turned down a request for support of a tourist theme park as a pipe dream. Volusia actually had more land available. So it went to Kissimmee. instead.
http://www.news-journalonline.com/article/20140428/news/140429441?p=1&tc=pg
The three Texas operations that I referenced don't offer Sunday service. However, in the case of Trinity Railway Express, one can reach most of the stations served by the train on a bus. It is much slower going than by the TRE, but it can be done.
The lack of weekend service at the outset should not be a major issue. Considering that SunRail is starting from scratch, it would make a certain amount of sense to see how consistent weekday ridership pans out before weekend service is added.
The Capital Metro Red Line in Austin, which runs approximately 32 miles from Leander, TX to downtown Austin, TX is a commuter rail service. It runs on the Austin and Western, which is a freight hauler owned by Capital Metro. The Red Line uses Stadler rail cars. It serves nine stations, including the end points in Leander and Austin.
The Denton County Transit Authority, which operates what it calls a commuter train between Denton, TX and Lewisville, TX, also uses Stadler rail cars. The route is 21 miles long and serves five stations in Denton and Lewisville. It provides connections with DART's Green Line, which is a light rail line.
The Trinity Rail Express, which runs between Dallas and Fort Worth, is a commuter operation. It uses diesel electric locomotives and Bombardier commuter coaches in a push/pull configuration. It operates over approximately 30 miles and serves 10 stations, including the end points of the T&P Station in Fort Worth and Union Station in Dallas.
Phoebe Vet Commuter rail and light rail are really two different animals. Commuter rail, which is usually a locomotive pulling cars, usually is diesel powered and covers longer routes. The stations are usually much farther apart than light rail. Light rail is usually electric and local oriented. The electric power is more appropriate for the frequent starts and stops. Light rail usually runs more frequent headways.
Commuter rail and light rail are really two different animals. Commuter rail, which is usually a locomotive pulling cars, usually is diesel powered and covers longer routes. The stations are usually much farther apart than light rail. Light rail is usually electric and local oriented. The electric power is more appropriate for the frequent starts and stops. Light rail usually runs more frequent headways.
Phoebe Vet blue streak 1 Orlando newspaper has a comparison of CLT's LYNX to what is the potential of Sun Rail. The longer distances between stops in Orlando may be a factor ? First ridership figures may be revealing ? Biggest problem for Sun Rail is the line not going to Kissimmee yet ? http://www.mynews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2014/4/22/sunrail_comparison_2.html Commuter rail and light rail are really two different animals. Commuter rail, which is usually a locomotive pulling cars, usually is diesel powered and covers longer routes. The stations are usually much farther apart than light rail. Light rail is usually electric and local oriented. The electric power is more appropriate for the frequent starts and stops. Light rail usually runs more frequent headways.
blue streak 1 Orlando newspaper has a comparison of CLT's LYNX to what is the potential of Sun Rail. The longer distances between stops in Orlando may be a factor ? First ridership figures may be revealing ? Biggest problem for Sun Rail is the line not going to Kissimmee yet ? http://www.mynews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2014/4/22/sunrail_comparison_2.html
Orlando newspaper has a comparison of CLT's LYNX to what is the potential of Sun Rail. The longer distances between stops in Orlando may be a factor ?
First ridership figures may be revealing ? Biggest problem for Sun Rail is the line not going to Kissimmee yet ?
http://www.mynews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2014/4/22/sunrail_comparison_2.html
Commuter rail may be a majority diesel-powered in the US, but not elsewhere. Push-pull service is also long standing, as are electric multiple units on the east coast and to the south and southeast from Chicago.
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
CATS does have plans to add a commuter line to the Lynx system, but it is, so far, just a plan. Right now they are extending the Blue Line another 9 miles and building the Gold Line, Trolley.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
For the locals, there will be display trains this weekend at the DeBary on Saturday and at Sand Lake Road on Sunday. http://sunrail.com/
Editor Emeritus, This Week at Amtrak
SunRail will have a 'soft' start in April with the official start in May.
Orlando's startup of SunRail is scheduled for May 1st. It was visited the weekend of St. Patrick's day. Picked Sunday as Orlando traffic is horrific week days and Saturday but was still bad Sunday. Have a bunch of observations about the system.
It appears to be that SunRail spent its money fairly wisely and got the most bang for the buck. will try to cover some of these items. The south end of the phase 1 portion for May 1 is about 3 miles south of downtown Orlando to north of Sanford at DeBary.
SunRail is planning free orientation trips but no schedule is yet published. Trips will be every 30 minutes 5:30 -7:30 & 3:30-6:00 PM during rush and every 2 hours non rush south bound. North 6:15 -9:15 & 4:15 - 9:15 PM. Service time 56 minutes & 56 Sanford - Sand Lake. ( Note: see below about possible delays at draw bridge.
No weekend service but after observing crowds downtown Orlando and Winter Park maybe will be added.
1. Stations. ---
a. Access to the stations were severely limited due to ongoing Sunday construction and parking lots not completely paved. All the station designs are mostly a cookie cutter approach. The station's platforms are almost identical, fairly Spartan, and appear to be vandal resistant. there are no expensive overpasses or underpasses with the incumbent maintenance that would be required.
b. Platforms are all located on the outside of tracks with no center platform except at Sand Lake and Orlando Amtrak station. All access from the far track platform is by 3 - 5 pedestrian crosswalks across the tracks with fences between the crosswalks. Crosswalk Protection has not been completed but appears to be knee high grade crossing lights and future automatic gates -- nature unknown.
c. The temporary south end Sand Lake station has either 2 or 3 storage tracks with platforms on both sides of each track isolated from both main tracks but a future main track platform far side could not be determined.
d. The Orlando health/Amtrak station has three tracks from CPs somewhat distance from the station. Would estimate a 24 + car Amtrak could park there without fouling either CP. With platforms on each side of all three tracks for the first time an opposite Amtrak could park on track 2 while first Amtrak loads on track 1. SunRail is set to load at north end of station so passengers can go around Amtrak when Amtrak is in station. Note: when no Amtrak passengers can cross track 1 or SunRail can load on track 1. ( TVMs on that platform )
e. Down town stations do not have parking but are well laid out. Old Main Street station ( ex SAL ) was preserved. Downtown was well populated probably due to St. Pats day ?
f. The Winter Park station certainly presented design problems that were well handled. The tracks at that station are NE - SW alignment so there are many streets that cross at an angle. The single track was doubled with Amtrak length platforms on outside of both tracks. The platforms were raised at each street with ADA compliant ramps from street to platforms.
g. Sanford station although 2 - 1/2 (?) miles from downtown Sanford city had a very large parking lot on state route 46 ( 2 - 3 lane each way divided highway) . This station is located about 3/4 miles north of the Sanford Auto Train depot. The Sun Rail station at Sanford appears to be a location of a new Sanford Amtrak station.
2. Tracks ----- Structure is well maintained to what appears class-4 standards.
a. Many crossovers from tracks 1 and 2 are present throughout system.
b. Freight turnouts are well maintained
c. All double track except the single track single leaf bascule bridge over the St. johns river. The bridge has extensively remolded approach decks but the draw span may be a future problem. Draw span does need a good coat of paint. Sunday river traffic was very heavy at 1600. The clearance was only 7 feet even though river was down and a high water mark might only be 3 feet clearance. When bridge lowered for auto train it took three tries to get it to lock. Granted wind was blowing about 15 MPH. Bridge opening every 15 minutes during rush hour may break something + 6 Amtrak and freight ?
There is only presently one station north of the river but when Deland phase=2 is built then a definite passenger load may occur. Maintenance facility south of bridge
Suspect that draw bridge is going to be an intermittent problem for southbound timekeeping. When funds are finally obtained a double track flyover much like TriRail's bridge over the New river at Ft. Lauderdale will be constructed. With freight staying on the draw. The CPs double track to single track on each side of bridge appear to provide for that eventuality. If bridge fails up maintenance facility may be able to provide standby train ?
3. Signals. -- A real surprise there. The system appears to be very state of the art.
a. As mentioned earlier all pedestrian crossings at stations have miniature grade crossing signals. How the final set up will be was not observed.
b. Every station has leaving signals for engineer to go track speed on both tracks both directions.
c, All sidings have a leaving signal usually a miniature pot signal with mostly power switches and main track signals guarding the siding. North of Auto Train station had 4 track overhead signals.
d. There was a CSX empty coal train heading north at the Amtrak Orlando station. CSX was on track 2 with a diverging clear to track 1 at CP north of station. Once past CP Track 2 quickly changed to a north bound clear . Then track 1 signal progressed to north bound clear. Was unable to determine if an advanced approach signal was given but could have as signal was two full 3 light heads that could have given Y over Y.
e. Then the surprise. The south bound side of the CP also showed clear on both tracks. It was as if the system operated as an ABS system except when dispatcher placed a track occupancy ????
f. No other trains were available to check this hypothesis.
4. Maintenance facility -- Time prevented from checking but it is located very close to Auto Train maintenance building which may enable cross parts and / or employees usage ?
5. Did not observe any rolling stock.
6. Expansion Phase - 2. This may be more expensive south of downtown as there are many siding serving various businesses + 2 short line RRs & a small intermodal terminal. Do not know how much if any double track is present. Understand will soon close intermodal terminal,
a. From Sand Lake station south to final destination to S. Poinciana no official work is being done. The Phase-2 is supposed to start later this summer but SunRail is already doing some projects. Several culverts have been rebuilt all to 2 track whether double track in place or not.
b. Signals have been placed in some places with some mostly lower heads turned aside.
c. Some line side signal wires are removed.
d. Where it could be observed a major crosstie replacement on the single track is now occurring. Even on the Sunday a tie gang from G.W. Peoples was waiting for southbound Meteor to clear at Kissimmee to replace ties. Equipment included a spiker, tie removal and inserter, a high dollar surfacing machine and ballast regulator.. The number of Ties set out indicated average of every third tie to be replaced. Around Kissimmee the old track location of ACL removed second track has been cleared for re double tracking. This may allow double tracking to proceed faster if present main is class-4 ? All grade crossings had hardwood ties ready for every tie replacement.
e, The Amtrak Kissimmee station if used for SunRail will need some upgrading much like Winter Park and probably quite a few bus bays. The parking area pavement is very poor.
f. The two other intermediate station locations already have a lot of pre SunRail development occurring.
g. The south end station at Poinciana has a large amount of space for a terminating station NW of tracks CSX track now begins about 300 feet beyond road with a CP for a southbound siding.. There is also a Home Depot across tracks from the possible future station location. This is at a location of 2 - 4 lane divided highways.
h. No report on Phase-2 to Deland.
I. There may be a future route to the NW from the Main street station over the old SAL route.
j. A very unlikely shuttle route addition would be from the Sanford station past Auto Train, to south of downtown Sanford over old CSX tracks . Then new ROW continuing to the Sanford airport..
k. Another possibility would be follow the power plant track and divert to Orlando airport. That would connect to AAF
Edit MAY 3 2014
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