In the January issue, there is a brief comment and picture about the former Grand Luxe full length domes of GN heritage. It was mentioned that Amtrak may be interested and wishes they had kept them before.
Were these cars rebuilt? What's the expected service life? I would think that Amtrak would be uninterested in such old equipment or might not even be able to legally run it. Am I missing something?
They're currently trying to get rid of the former ATSF pacific Parlor cars on the Coast Starlight. Why would they bring in other old equipment?
I know the Grandluxe equipment is particularly opulent, so perhaps that's the reason.
Anyone, Anyone? Beuller?
Interesting questions YoHo1975. Wish I had some concrete answers. Amtrak acquired all 6 of the full-domes Budd built for the Empire Builder in the mid-1950s. 3 were retained and refurbished for Auto-Train service in the mid 1980s (including HEP). 2 of those 3 ultimately wound up in the American Orient Express/Grand Luxe fleet. Those are the cars Amtrak's mentioned wanting back if the price is right.
It doesn't seem to make a lot of sense on the surface to bring a 60-year-old car back into the fleet. But if these cars are in decent mechanical shape and don't need significant interior refurbishment maybe this could indeed be a cost-effective way to upgrade the Cardinal. Based on reports here and on other websites the Cardinal seemingly needs all the help it can get in terms of onboard service.
All the info you ever wanted to know about Dome cars from the streamliner era
http://www.trainweb.org/web_lurker/WebLurkersDOMEmain/
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
I kind of never understood the rationale behind a full-length dome.
The original Vista Dome idea, I had read, was that some railroad executive had been thrilled by a cab ride and thought that passengers could share some part of that experience. In the short-length Vista Dome, not only do you have panoramic windows to look out the sides, you also have windows to look out the front and see where the train is headed. That effect is better if you sit towards the front in a Vista Dome.
In a full-length dome, most of the view is the panoramic one out the sides and only a small percentage of the seats allow you to see out the front. Then you have the Hi-level and Superliner lounge cars, which don't allow you to see out the front at all.
I guess there is a whole range of appreciating the scenery experiences from the rifle-slit fortress windows on an Amcoach all the way up to Vista Dome, with the best being the TurboTrain front Power Dome Car, which from the front rows up against the plexi partition was pretty much a cab ride, including watching the driver operate the controls.
If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?
I rode the Cardinal from Chicago to New York City on November 12-13, 2010. The service from the on board staff was impeccable! The time-keeping was up to snuff. We arrived at NYP one half hour early. The only complaint I had was the salmon entree in the diner-dry and lacking in flavor.
Mel Hazen; Jax, FL Ride Amtrak. It's the only way to fly!!!
Paul Milenkovic I kind of never understood the rationale behind a full-length dome. The original Vista Dome idea, I had read, was that some railroad executive had been thrilled by a cab ride and thought that passengers could share some part of that experience. In the short-length Vista Dome, not only do you have panoramic windows to look out the sides, you also have windows to look out the front and see where the train is headed. That effect is better if you sit towards the front in a Vista Dome.
You are correct here, in that the idea was inspired by the panoramic windows of an F-unit cab. Although I believe the thought was not to simulate a cab ride for passengers, but rather to simply offer a broader view of the scenery.
Paul Milenkovic I kind of never understood the rationale behind a full-length dome. ...[snip]... In a full-length dome, most of the view is the panoramic one out the sides and only a small percentage of the seats allow you to see out the front. Then you have the Hi-level and Superliner lounge cars, which don't allow you to see out the front at all.
...[snip]...
The real rationale, I believe, is to allow more people to enjoy the experience. That's the thing about your typical vista dome car....there are only so many seats. I frequently ride VIA Rail's "The Ocean" train, from Truro NS to Montreal QC, which during the winter still runs one consist of Budd equipment (when one of the Renaissance consists is out for servicing), and so have been able to enjoy the Skyline dome cars on VIA. The view is spectacular, but the one problem is it's always full. You often have to come back several times to try to find a spot when someone leaves. The Skyline dome seats 24, which I think is fairly typical of Vista dome cars (from Budd at least).
By this logic, a full dome, while offering little forward viewing, offers the broader panoramic view to more passengers at once. For that reason, it's a neat idea. I still do like being able to see out the front (one of my favourite elements of the dome), but I think for many people (especially non-railfan travellers...who, based on my experience, make up more actual ridership than us railfans do), the real benefit of the dome is to be able to more fully see the scenery, and feel more exposed to the countryside as you pass through.
-Tim
Seems to me that GN and MILW had some trouble with their full-length dome cars structurally?? They apparently weren't as stable as conventional vista-dome cars. Their sides and ends could "rack" and move more than a vista-dome I guess.
My wife and I recently rode from Spencer, NC to Charlottesville, VA in a privately owned full length dome car. It was a great experience and I can't imagine why they are no longer made. It was truly "first class" travel. The seating was all facing seats with tables, the view was magnificent, and there was a bar in the middle of the car. I would pay premium to ride like that on every trip.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
In the early summer of 1970 I had the wonderful privilege of transferring in Salt Lake City from what would become the Rio Grande Zephyr and was the California Zephyr but was then just "California Service" as far as Ogden, to the City of Los Angeles. I enjoyed a good night's sleep in one of the refurbished 10 & 6's that the UP had used on its stockholders' - shippers' special, and then awaikened to enjoy a good breakfast. I had forgotten about the UP's use of full-length dome diners, and was very pleasently surprised. One of the very best railroad passenger experiences, a meal in a full-length dome diner. The food and service were great also. (Not that I could possibly complain about what I got on the D&RGW!)
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