Hi all ;
A curious as I am, I was browsing thru Amtrak schedules, when for instance i decided to check the Chicago to St. Louis corridor. One of the trains running - Lincoln Service 301 - sucked my attention. It's the only Limited, so to speak, service, and for the 284 miles of point to point run has a respectable average speed of 65,54 Mph. I know this was one of the routes where Amtrak, toghether with owner UP, wanted to test a PTC signalling system. Is it already in service, or this line is still a 79 mph ?
Other thing that stuck my atteintion, was the fact that by means of Google Earth, I got to see that St. Louis Union station still has somr traks. Since it seems to be in the heart of the city, wouldn't it be just the ideal spot for Amtrak to have it's trains starting or ending ther ? I know the station is now a mall, but that could be an added advantage for train users. And since I'm european, we here are used to have our principal stations in downtown, wich seems not to be the case with some Amtrak in certain cases
I agree on the 284 mile distance, but my (dated) timetable has a running time of 5 hours 20 minutes. That is an average speed in the low-50's.
I agree that Union Station would be a better location. From Virtual Earth it appears there are three passenger loading tracks there. The only obvious downside is a backup move for a couple of blocks for trains arriving from/departing to the west.
Upps, I've just shaved off an hour from the schedule. That's what happens when I forget my glasses and do a bunch of stuff at the same time. By the schedule time the average speed is 53,25 Mph. And it is strange to see that some travel times just became much more extended. For instance Chicago to Joliet in 57 minutes, when it used to be just 40 in GM&O times. If all those extra 17 minutes were possible to be 'shaved off' from he schedule, plus less 3 minutes retreated from the Alton to St. Louis section, it would be just 5 hours, with an average of 56 something mph. However, there´s a strange thing in american schedules. It seems that padding is only added at he end of the trip. Over here in Europe, normally padding is added every 62 miles,and depending of the kind of priority. On 'normal' circumstances, it's 4 to 5 minutes every 62 mile section. If a train gets to be a real hotshot, it's only 3 minutes, wich means a lot of fast running, and of course 'tie scorching'.
About the backup moove, does that happens because one of the sides of the old triangle wich existed long ago has been removed ? Even though if some cab cars can be used, and an extra engineer for the moove, it can be overcome.
I see those tracks too, and it seems that theyre big enough for small trains., like the Lincolns or the Mules, but if for instance he Eagle gets to be a little bigger than usual ?
It looks like the west leg of the wye track could be added without too much difficulty but the expense may not justify it. Amtrak got ride of the Amtrailer station not too long ago and opened a dedicated station building just east of 18th Street(between the rail yard & Highway 64).I would imagine, that if Amtrak returned to Union Station, the rental price for space would be quite high. In addition, the 3 tracks available are at the west side of the old train shed and end at the back of the Hyatt Hotel, quite a distance from the original "Main" entrance to the station building. As for the track length, if memory serves, I believe that 2 of the tracks can handle 7 or 8 cars.
Regardless of where Amtrak stops, I am happy that they renovated the building. The interior of Union Station head house is simply magnificent!
John
When we lived in Illinois (stationed at Scott AFB), I recall some talk about Amtrak moving into Union Station and getting out of the "Amshack". The problem is that under the shed is all parking, with a large man-made pond, and a Landry's restaraunt (at least it was Landry's when we were there), and not much room for anything else anymore.
The tracks in question had some vintage rail equipment, like some wood cabooses, and wood reefers, and were also used for a dinner train that operated out of Union Station. I don't know if the dinner train still operates out of there, but I seem to recall somebody saying that it doesn't run anymore (I remember the equipment and power being all green).
I really enjoyed hanging out in Union Station, not because of the mall, but because of the history. The Grand Hall was a nice place to get a drink and listen to the piano man. They also had a kiosk set up in the mall with letters folks wrote in regards to their memories of Union Station. Right before we left, they also set up a museum geared towards rail history, and the history of the place. It amazes me that "they" were able to cram a hotel and mall into that place (along with a theater). Better than letting it fall down on itself I suppose.
That's interesting, the part about padding being added every 100 km. I think your assumption that in the U.S., the padding is built into the destination is true, but there are folks here who know better than I do. - a.s.
I have done some scheduling work in the past, and this method is still used. We also add some extra time in some specifical situtations, such as a train going to a siding in a single track line, wich means entering at restricted speed, wich adds some extra minute to minute and a half to the schedules. Operartionally speaking, it is useful if one gets an unexpected speed restriction or a restrictive signal. But that padding doesn´t mean trains won´t run fast. For instance in a train with a 3 minute per 100 km 'regularity margin' (that's what we call padding in tech terms) will moove at track speed in a great portion of the section. There is another technique wch is called itinerary speed. In this case, speeds will appear in the engineer's schedule, both the maximum track speeds and the ones of the 'itinerary', lower that track speed, and the recomended to keep trains on time. It was used by spaniards and italians some time ago. Of course in this cases, if a train passes wihth a delay of 30 seconds in a controlled point, normally a station or a junction, it's a late train.
Back to St Louis matter, I didn't know Amtrak had opened a new station. It's a pitty they have not considered Union Station. Maybe it wouldn't be perfect for sevice as it used to be in the past, it would also be costly, but nothing would beat the added value of having a 'downtown' service.
Mario_v Of course in this cases, if a train passes wihth a delay of 30 seconds in a controlled point, normally a station or a junction, it's a late train.
Of course in this cases, if a train passes wihth a delay of 30 seconds in a controlled point, normally a station or a junction, it's a late train.
You can have little idea how strange that sounds to American ears. Amtrak allows itself a 20 minute grace period when it compiles the data on its on-time performance.
For an example of a Midwestern train station still utilized for its intended service, try Googling Union Station in Kansas City.
Here in the west we have several trains that operate at track speeds of 90 mph. The San Diegans even with there numerous station stops still manage 90 mph speeds on all schedules in certain areas. And many of those areas have ground level crossings.
The same is true for the San Joaquins they manage 90 mph running in the Central Valley on the former Santa Fe now BNSF tracks which is equipped with ATS.
Most of the former Santa Fe tracks between Los Angeles and Chicago permit the Southwest Chief to operate at 90 mph as it to is equipped with ATS.
Al - in - Stockton
Well, the official practice over here is to consider that a train arrives on time if its total delay is less than 3 minutes. However, in cab parlance, if one passes 30 seconds behind schedule, the train is really late. And such small delays might have implications in other trains caming right behind. In a crowded suburban line, if it is a just simple double track with a regular ABs system, a block get tottaly free (ie : with the green light for the incoming train), signals take about 2 1/2 to 3 minutes to go back to that position. If it is in a restrictive position, the next train caming will move at a restrictive position, as all others coming, wich means more delays. That's why it is so important to keep trains right on the booked schedule.
Mario_v Well, the official practice over here is to consider that a train arrives on time if its total delay is less than 3 minutes. However, in cab parlance, if one passes 30 seconds behind schedule, the train is really late. And such small delays might have implications in other trains caming right behind. In a crowded suburban line, if it is a just simple double track with a regular ABs system, a block get tottaly free (ie : with the green light for the incoming train), signals take about 2 1/2 to 3 minutes to go back to that position. If it is in a restrictive position, the next train caming will move at a restrictive position, as all others coming, wich means more delays. That's why it is so important to keep trains right on the booked schedule.
Gone is the pride in ontime performance that was exibited by so many pre-Amtrak passenger services. Here in the west alone GN, NP, UP, AT&SF, IC, and CB&Q all operated faster schedules than Amtrak today many over the same routes. And all of the above mentioned roads prided themselves in on time performance.
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