A question of color (SantaFe)

[Cederstrand]

OK, aside from all those warbonnet red cabs w/ silver bodies, and the yellow cabs w/ blue bodies, does anyone know where I can view online a prototype photo of a F unit "Blue cab with silver body"? I understand they did exist but have been unsuccessful locating a photo of one.

Thank you for any info!  Rob

[SSW9389]

Rob: What you are referring to is the true Santa Fe "bluebonnet" ex-passenger F7As of which there were at least seven. There were also four B units painted with a blue sill stripe.

There is a photo of Bluebonnet 338L on Fallen Flags. 

 

 

[Cederstrand]

Found the photo...much appreciated. Bookmarked the site for future research, too. Thanks!

Rob

[edbenton]

The reason the Bluebonnet came about is those ex-passenger units were Stainless steel kind of hard to paint

[traintownofcowee]

The reason the Bluebonnet came about is those ex-passenger units were Stainless steel kind of hard to paint

Is that the whole reason why they had that paint scheme?

Everyone remembers the Red and Silver.

But why did they create a Blue and Yellow paint scheme?

[SSW9389]

I think edbenton is right that Santa Fe saw no reason to paint the stainless steel panels of the ex-passenger units. Several variations of Yellowbonnet were tried, besides the Bluebonnet paint scheme. The bottom line is that in any of these Bluebonnet or Yellowbonnet paint schemes is that the entire unit was not painted, just the front. The stainless steel sidepanels were left alone. That suggests that it was an economy move on the part of the railroad to just paint the front of the locomotives.

We have to look at the context as to what was going on with the Santa Fe passenger F units. A number of them were still leased to Amtrak in 1972-74 until enough SDP40Fs were delivered to end the lease. Other passenger Fs found either employment as freight units or went to Cleburne to be rebuilt as CF7s.  

 

[jktrains]

Add to this that stainless steel is difficult to paint hence the reason the CB&Q units such as E7s, E8s and E9s were not paint by the Q or repaint into Cascade green by the BN.  It was not really about cost as it was about being about get the paint to stick.

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

jktrains is right, paint will not adhere to stainless steel unless the stainless steel has been treated.  KCS went to that expense with the ex-NYC observation cars it purchased in the 1960's so the stainless steel could be painted in black with red and yellow trim to match the rest of the passenger fleet.

[Anonymous]

i sure wish i could help you out

[chefjavier]

I think the color back then was much better than present brite orange.

[Lyon_Wonder]

Add to this that stainless steel is difficult to paint hence the reason the CB&Q units such as E7s, E8s and E9s were not paint by the Q or repaint into Cascade green by the BN.  It was not really about cost as it was about being about get the paint to stick.

Some former Q E8/9s were later repainted into overall BN green with white passenger stripes and used by Chicago's Metra until the early 1990s.  These E units were rebuilt by MPI in Idaho sometime in the early 1970s.  Were the original stainless steel panels replaced too?  One of these engines was later repainted into cream and green as BN3 in the early 90s, and a couple of others ended up on IC's, now CN's roster after retirement from Metra.

 

 

 

[wjstix]

The reason the Bluebonnet came about is those ex-passenger units were Stainless steel kind of hard to paint

Is that the whole reason why they had that paint scheme?

Everyone remembers the Red and Silver.

But why did they create a Blue and Yellow paint scheme?

Santa Fe's first FT units c.1941 were blue and yellow, with red striping separating the colors. They used that scheme (unfortunately without the red striping) on most of their freight F units.

[Southwest Chief]

Santa Fe's first FT units c.1941 were blue and yellow, with red striping separating the colors. They used that scheme (unfortunately without the red striping) on most of their freight F units.

Not exactly what I'd call yellow and blue as most think of when thinking of Santa Fe freight colors.  The scheme you're referring to is more of a dark blue and cream.  Perfectly exemplified by one of Stewart's (Now Bowser) HO scale FT models:

 

The red striping you mentioned varied as well.  Note the Stewart model in the photo above has no stripes.  This was one paint variation.  The first factory painted FT's had full red striping, while later models had red striping up to the cab.  Stewart made both versions but I couldn't find any photos to show.  The best I could do for a quick response is black and white.  Here's one that shows full red striping:

And here's one with partial striping:

 

The scheme you're referring to as "most of their freight F units" did appear on FT's as well (of course in their latter days).  Going back to the Stewart model here is a photo:

And wouldn't you know it, the Santa Fe FT's wore even more paint varieties.  Some were converted to passenger service and these wore a rendition of the famous warbonnet...Stewart model again:

And the most unique scheme worn by a very few FT's was an experimental "all blue" paint scheme.  Tried as a way to simplify painting, it was quickly (and thankfully so) seen as a bad idea.  Stewart as an example yet again:

An excellent resource on Santa Fe FT's can be found here:

Santa Fe FT's

And going back to the original question about Bluebonnet photos.  Well here are a few links that might be helpful:

Bluebonnet 1

Bluebonnet 2

Bluebonnet 3 

 

[wjstix]

I'm aware that Santa Fe FT's wore other paint schemes (including passenger 'warbonnets'), I was just pointing out that (to me) the original one with the red striping was more attractive than the later yellow and blue schemes without the red.