I have noticed that commuter trains were pulled by anything that was lying around like the EL Commuter Train Cleveland Youngstown. How did they do head end power and heat?
passenger units had Steam generators for heat and cars had axle generators to charge batteries for lights and AC, in summer no steam was needed so any freight locomotive would be sufficient.
Dutchrailnut in summer no steam was needed so any freight locomotive would be sufficient.
in summer no steam was needed so any freight locomotive would be sufficient.
But in the classic era very few if any commuter coaches were air-condiitoned. The first were the NYCentral's 1000-series mu cars, and the similar LIRR "Zip", preceded onliy by ealier LIRR up and down doubl-deckers that were not gallery cars or "real"double-deckers, since there was an aisle on only one leve. More like a coach analogy of a sumbercoach. MU cars. The first air-conditioned loco-hauled commuter cars that were not downgraded long-distance cars were the early post-WWII Rock-Island single-deck cars with either center doors or quarter-point doors, but not the usual end vestibutes.
The other commuter cars, again exceptinig downgraded long-distance coaches, were not air-conditioned. Possibly the Sante Fe ran some commuter trains oiut of LA with air-conditioned coaches.
AFAIK, the Santa Fe never did run commuter trains out of LA, though I knew a couple of people who did ride the AT&SF San Diegans to get from home in San Diego and work in LA. This was particularly common prior to the opening of I-5.
The EL here in NJ acquired (thanks to NJDOT help) 32 GE U34CH locomotives specifically designed to provide head end power, along with complete trainsets of HEP coaches and cab-cars for commuter service. The Cleveland service had steam heated equipment. NJDOT picked locomotives (basically modified U36C) so that they could earn their money back in freight service on weekends when they were not needed for commuter trains. Unfortunately, after several runs where locomotives got stuck on the road in freight service and were unavailable for Monday morning rush hour, the practice of releasing them for freight service on weekends came to an end. The U34CH had 3,430 HP in commuter service (the remaining 170 HP was diverted to HEP) and with a turn of a knob developed the full 3,600 HP for freight service.
pajrrNJDOT picked locomotives (basically modified U36C) so that they could earn their money back in freight service on weekends when they were not needed for commuter trains. Unfortunately, after several runs where locomotives got stuck on the road in freight service and were unavailable for Monday morning rush hour, the practice of releasing them for freight service on weekends came to an end.
I thought the principal problem was that EL kept sending the locomotives back with near-empty fuel tanks..
Meanwhile -- what about the set of ex-ATSF stainless-steel coaches that ran behinds E8s? Was the AC on these cars workable (and might it have been steam-ejector?) I had thought these had individual axle generators and batteries for lighting, not any sort of HEP connection.
If I remember correctly, these locomotives were originally equipped with steam-heat boilers and only later converted for head-end hotel electric power. So the steam provided the ex-Sante Fe coaches the ability to provide air-conditioning. Fortunately, the air-conditioning was designed to cope with southwestern desert conditions, so the higher capacity of the coaches when reseated for commuter service did cause a serious problem.
That is what I recall.
never? What about "Train for Anneheim, ----?, and Kukamonga(sp?)?
erikem AFAIK, the Santa Fe never did run commuter trains out of LA, though I knew a couple of people who did ride the AT&SF San Diegans to get from home in San Diego and work in LA. This was particularly common prior to the opening of I-5.
Mel Blanc's classic station announcement on Jack Benny's radio show (Azusa, Cucamonga, etc.) was based on Pacific Electric's trains to San Bernardino.
EL/NJDOT U34CHs were never equipped with boilers, even though space for a boiler was part of the UxxC line from the beginning. Santa Fe's U28CG and U30CG (with a cowl, but still more or less a U30C under it) had large Vapor boilers in the space behind the cab, but were not particularly successful as passenger engines. The U34CHs were built for use with the Comet I coaches. The ex-ATSF cars ran behind EL E8s. The Cleveland service got an E8 right up to the end.
Welcome your correction. In retrospect, I saw nothing but E8s there.
Also, meant to say did NOT cause a serious problem. Now how did that error happen?
Wizlish I thought the principal problem was that EL kept sending the locomotives back with near-empty fuel tanks..
You give someone the keys to the locomotive for the weekend, and they return it without filling the tank. Sheesh!
If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?
pajrr The EL here in NJ acquired (thanks to NJDOT help) 32 GE U34CH locomotives specifically designed to provide head end power, along with complete trainsets of HEP coaches and cab-cars for commuter service. The Cleveland service had steam heated equipment. NJDOT picked locomotives (basically modified U36C) so that they could earn their money back in freight service on weekends when they were not needed for commuter trains. Unfortunately, after several runs where locomotives got stuck on the road in freight service and were unavailable for Monday morning rush hour, the practice of releasing them for freight service on weekends came to an end. The U34CH had 3,430 HP in commuter service (the remaining 170 HP was diverted to HEP) and with a turn of a knob developed the full 3,600 HP for freight service.
IIRC, this practice lasted into the early Conrail era and that carrier was even worse at sending units back running on empty and not getting them back in time for the Monday rush..
"I Often Dream of Trains"-From the Album of the Same Name by Robyn Hitchcock
My carrier tried a similar experiment with freight locomotives. Collecting all the locomotives from outlying local locations on Fridays, bringing them to a major terminal to operate a run from that major terminal with expectations of replacing the locomotives at the outlying locations by the start time of the locals on Monday.
More than one outlying local ended up not working for one or more days because they didn't have power.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
pajrrThe U34CH had 3,430 HP in commuter service (the remaining 170 HP was diverted to HEP)
I remember a picture somewhere of the EL Cleveland-Youngstown Train Passenger commuter cars hooked up the CUT Terminals in house steam system. Major stations had steam generator boillers where transfering pullmans were hooked up or got left off in the wee hours till the passengers sobered up in the late morning
trackrat888 I remember a picture somewhere of the EL Cleveland-Youngstown Train Passenger commuter cars hooked up the CUT Terminals in house steam system. Major stations had steam generator boillers where transfering pullmans were hooked up or got left off in the wee hours till the passengers sobered up in the late morning
Most set-out sleepers expected passengers to vacate the car by 8:00 AM, rarely later than that.
Amtrak F40s could be set to produce 500KW (about 667 HP) or 700 KW (935 HP) which was subtracted from the 3000-3200 HP they could develop with HEP off. On Amtrak 3 and 4 HEP was often shut off for a few minutes on the 3.5% grades of Raton and Glorieta Passes in New Mexico to give a little traction boost.
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