Dr.D,
My view is that while 2156 will not run today, tomorrow, or the day after, it will run, one day. It may not be soon, but it is coming. That is what I expressed in my earlier post but everything you say is undoubtably true. I know that so long is there is a willing group, anything is possible. But, like everything, it is a waiting game, waiting for the right time.
About the NYC #3329-
The museum is nearing the end of a (so far) 9 year long cosmetic restoration on her. and boy, have the guys in the shop can sure work miracles.
They know what they have there in the 2933, and thats why she's getting such good treatment.
(I'll upload a picture ASAP)
[quote user="Dr D"]
S Connor,
I believed that they were never going to run Big Boy UP 4023 - I believed it was just a matter of time in 1970 before Union Pacific quit its steam program - no one would be interested in utilitarian old railroad locomotives - no one in their right mind - no railroad could afford it - ask President Al Pearlman! cause New York Central was way ahead of the game.
And I believed they were never going to run N&W 611 - or 1214 - its why they only saved one!
And that they are never going to run NYC 3001 - Mayor of Elkhart be damned! - yah I believe that.
And I believed they were never going to the moon again too! - and surely, that they were never going to Mars - all that money was needed to solve domestic issues here in America - and of course we never would have a black president or woman either! - I believe that I really did!
And I believed they were never going to build an another new roundhouse in Amercia - or another turntable. And that when PM 1225 was on display at Michigan State University - I believed it would never run again! - the faculty told us so and students saw it as true - its why they cut it loose from the university - for insurance liability - they rolled their eyes - or was it a smile - they did - they really did. I believe that.
And I believed the British railfans could not build a brand new steam locomotive from scratch - certainly not a 4-6-2 Pacific - three cylinders? - your joking! - it was too difficult and would be easier for them to get it made in China - yah I really believed that!
Yes I believe that I really do - never again going to run a C&O 2-6-6-6. Never going to run C&O 1309 - Baldwins last domestic order - who would want to - did you see that wreck of a locomotive sitting outside in the rain for fifty years!
Medically, I believed patients could not get well from incurable diseases and those not seriously ill would always be well - I believed that I really did! And the paralized would never walk again or the blind see! I believed that I really did.
S. Connor - and you lost your favorite Y6a! Adopt a NYC Mohawk at the St. Louis museum - its an orphan child! - I only have about a million questions concerning it - you can't even find a good photo of the locomotive!
I know more about the Burlingtion Hudsons scattered across America than I do about that only remaining New York Central prize freight engine - come on - go photo shoot it from every angle! Good shots with details!
And ask them - what ever happened to the Young Valve Pilot Indicator missing from the side of that NYC engine? Its missing from the NYC Mohawk in Elkhart also! - Its why those Central engines ran so good - every engineer could get the valve "cut off" just right!
Go quiery those curators, to spill the beans, and ask them why? and while your at it ask them all they know about it - does it have a track pan scoop on the tender? but you have to find the right one to ask! and then not to query the dim lights for too long.
Yes - I believe I really do! - I believe.
Dr. D
Go query those curators, to spill the beans, and ask them why? and while your at it ask them all they know about it - does it have a track pan scoop on the tender? but you have to find the right one to ask! and then not to query the dim lights for too long.
2156 is going on loan to NS, to be displayed at the Roanoke museum. Not directly to the museum.
There are no plans to get her under steam, she is only for display in Roanoke alongside 611 (when in town) and 1218
To respond to the POst by S. Connor: I did some digging and found the following Post by 'Big Jim' @ http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/740/t/229994.aspx
"N&W 2156 " Posted by BigJim on Thurs. May 29, 2014 4:50am
May 28, 2014 St. Louis Museum of Transportation and Virginia Museum of Transportation to trade historic locomotives NORFOLK, VA. – The Museum of Transportation, St. Louis, and the Virginia Museum of Transportation are in discussions to bring Norfolk and Western Y6a steam engine #2156, currently in the St. Louis museum, back to its place of origin at Roanoke, Va., on a five-year loan for display at the Virginia museum, in a transaction facilitated by Norfolk Southern. In exchange, the Virginia museum will send to St. Louis a Southern Railway diesel General Motors EMD FTB unit to complement the St. Louis museum’s FTA demonstration unit. “This will reunite the last surviving Y-class locomotive, one of the hardest pulling steam locomotives ever built, with the J-611 and the A-1218 in Roanoke, where all three were designed and built by Norfolk and Western,” said Molly Butterworth, cultural site manager for the St. Louis Museum of Transportation. ”In return, our historic FTA, built in 1939 to demonstrate to the rail industry the efficiency of diesel power, will be reunited with its complimentary B unit.” “We are thrilled to welcome the Y6a home again,” said Bev Fitzpatrick, executive director of the Virginia Museum of Transportation. “We’re grateful to the St. Louis Museum of Transportation for this opportunity to reunite three powerful sisters of steam in their home town.” The Museum of Transportation, a St. Louis County Park in west St. Louis County, Mo., houses what has been recognized as one of the largest and best collections of transportation vehicles in the world. With over 70 locomotives, half of them "one-of-a-kind" or "sole survivors" of their type, the Museum has one of the most complete collections of American railroad motive power, and its collections of automobiles, buses, streetcars, aircraft, horse-drawn vehicles, and riverboat materials are constantly expanding to reflect the ever-changing nature of transportation. The Virginia Museum of Transportation, Virginia’s official transportation museum, is home to two of the most powerful steam locomotives in existence today: the N&W Class A 1218 and the N&W Class J 611. The Museum attracts visitors of all ages from across the U.S. and around the world. Through exhibits, artifacts, and an outstanding collection of rail equipment, cars, trucks, airplanes, and more, the Museum tells the story of Virginia’s rich transportation history. Norfolk Southern Corporation (NYSE: NSC) is one of the nation’s premier transportation companies. Its Norfolk Southern Railway Company subsidiary operates approximately 20,000 route miles in 22 states and the District of Columbia, serves every major container port in the eastern United States, and provides efficient connections to other rail carriers. Norfolk Southern operates the most extensive intermodal network in the East and is a major transporter of coal, automotive, and industrial products..."
Dr. D,
Which is why I am so sad to see 2156 leave.I don't travel much, so it will likely be 5-6 years before I see her again.
Unfortuantly around here, there would be more interest in restoring Frisco 1522 to operation, since we miss her, and she's in such good mechanicl condition.
I feel that trying the restore 2156, well perfectly possible, is unlikely to be done, even to run around the St. Louis area. This discusion, of course, is much more complicated than this. I am at the museum often as a volunteer, and I once had a man come from India just to see the 2156 alone. There is no doubt about passion for the locomotive, so while she may not run anytime soon, I would not doubt it happening... One day.
(My views expressed in this post represent the MoT in no way whatsoever.)
S. Connor,
The Y6a is truely a historic locomotive! And Norfolk and Western approached the concept of a "Mallet compound" engine in the 1950's as legitimate engineering idea and then transformed it into a workable locomotive design. Wow no such engines were produced new in America after 1935! This is truely as remarkable as the rest of the world basically abandon the Mallet compound as a modern locomotive. And that N&W had such engineering success here is astounding - this is an untold story.
Compounding of course is an economy idea in steam locomotive design. For example most marine steam engines of the last century were "compounded" to increase their efficiency. Basically the steam was used three times in a "high pressure cylinder" - then exhausted into a "medium pressure cylinder" - and finally used one last in a "low pressure cylinder." Efficiency! The pistons of each cylinder were of course all of different diameters in order to achieve a similar power stroke input from each of the three. This marine power design was called the Tripple Compound "A" Frame Steam Engine - and powered most ships through the 20th Century.
The steam engineering idea here was to extract ALL of the heat energy from the steam before giving it up to the atmosphere. "Compounding" was an idea from the past as it never proved practical on a railroad engine and so it quickly fell out of favor with the advent of the concept of "superheated steam" where so much more efficiency is available at much less cost.
Where "compound" steam engines were built - engine designs then became "simple." Simple locomotives" using high pressure steam only.
Almost all of the great articulated railroad locomotive power of the late steam era was "simple." The N&W A-series engines like the 2-6-6-4 steam were "simple" - all four cylinders were high pressure. So was the C&O Allegheny 2-6-6-6, the UP 4-6-6-4 and 4-8-8-4, SP, D&RGW etc.
So why did N&W alone in the 1950's develop both the articulated A-series and then continue to develop the articulated Y-series? One engine design "simple" and one engine design "compound?" And then surprisingly do such a great job at both designs - and with such great engineering effort. Truely for me the N&W - the Y-series is the most remarkable - because anyone could do the A but NO railroad could do the Y6a.
I realize the A could and was used in both high speed freight and passenger work running up to 70 mph and of course the Y was basically a "drag freight" engine running 50 mph but never a passenger engine - but still the operating efficiency of the Y-series was unique.
Both engines A and Y as well as the J - came in for some late and modern locomotive engineering of the exhaust and smoke stack design. Reducing the smoke stack diameter and the angle it was tilted forward. The shape of the petticoat at the bottom of the smoke stack. The shape and contour of the exhaust nozzle to "rosebud tip design." All these unique features gave all N&W steam power some of its unique power characteristics.
Watching the Y6a run in this modern day should be a real event! And those huge front end cylinders! You can bet I will be there to see something just as unique as a bullet nose roller bearing equiped northern - it will be an articulated compound Y6a running again! On a passenger train!?
And of course the Y6a has such a "redneck" look about it. It almost makes me want to become a "son of the south" and to "eat taters and wear no clothes!"
Last time I was there, she was still on the ready track, waiting for UP. At this point I doubt 2156 will be going anywhere until spring.
[NOTE: Earlier today I had posted this topic on the "Locomotive" Discusion Group area; I have reposted it here, at a pont that may be more appropriate for this Thread.]
Back around the first week in October 2014; the TRAINSNewswire carried some stories about the transfer of their exhibit locomotive&W#2156 from the Museum of Transportation to V.M.T. Roanoke, Va for cosmetic work and a temporary loan for display for five years. @ http://trn.trains.com/news/news-wire/2014/10/museums-railroads-prepare-to-move-nw-2-8-8-2-to-roanoke
It was set out for the pick-up to be transferred to Union Pacific and then Norfolk Southern for the transfer move. So far Nada?
Does anyone have any photos of the move they could link to on this Forum or any information if the N&W #2156 has gotten to Roanoke, or is it still in route?
Been watching the Virginia Museum of Transportation website, they have posted lots of information on the progress on #611,[Terrific stuff! ]
But so far Crickets on the status of 2156.
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