Maybe those little German 0-4-4-0T's aren't the biggest of articulateds, or the most famous, or the best looking, but considering their longevity they're probably the most successful of all articulateds.
"Blessed' be the meek, for they shall inherit the Earth!"
I know I love those little guys! Most successful? Yeah, I'd have to agree. There was one at the DB museum at Nuremberg in 2004 sitting on a short length of track. I visited the museum again two years later and found out it was taken away to be restored and run. There's quite a few of them running on the NG lines in eastern Germany; I've been to most of them and want to go back. They're the reason I want to sell my N scale stuff and build an HO NG layout, based on what I saw over there.
Since this consideration has now stepped outside of the United States, I would offer these articulateds for your consideration: EAR 59-class 4-8-2+2-8-4 and NSWGR 60-class 4-8-4+4-8-4 Garratts.
Garratts! I love 'em! I wish someone made one in model form but I've never sen one in any scale.
do to the way Garrets were build I would think it would not be impossible to kitbash one.
Back to the real thing. I would settle for a big articulated dummy engine,restored to roll but pushed by a Diesel. Not ideal,but better than nothing.
54light15 Garratts! I love 'em! I wish someone made one in model form but I've never sen one in any scale.
Dear God, there are many! (Perhaps not easy to find, but they were made!) There is a very good model now available of the AD60 in Australia. I remember a Model Railroader discussion of one of the African Garratt kits -- probably sometime in the early Seventies; that was, if I recall correctly, a white-metal kit.
Everything I remember seeing was HO, but I'll bet a hat there are others.
Garretts? I don't know, those machines leave me cold. Yes, I fully acknowledge their efficiency, adaptability, and ability, but they're so blamed ugly!
I didn't say they were beautiful, hey they're not the Dreyfus Hudsons of the NYC, but they have a certain charm all their own.
Well, I guess the Garretts are living proof the saying "If it looks good, it'll run good" isn't necessarily true all the time.
Firelock76 Garretts? I don't know, those machines leave me cold. Yes, I fully acknowledge their efficiency, adaptability, and ability, but they're so blamed ugly!
Are you claiming that this applies to the production Algerian Garratts or the design for the AC38?
Overmod, I'd have to say any Garrett I've seen in pictures I considered ugly. The AC38, you've got me there, I'm not familiar with what that is.
And for all you Garrett fans out there, don't take this personally. If you like the things, that's cool with me, I won't say you're wrong.
Model of the AC38 (with some poetic license in the striping) here:
Garratt 38 thread
If I could find my old drawings of the 4-8-8-8-8-4+4-8-8-8-8-4 Garratt, I bet you'd change your mind about them! ;-}
Overmod If I could find my old drawings of the 4-8-8-8-8-4+4-8-8-8-8-4 Garratt, I bet you'd change your mind about them! ;-}
Sounds like something that would appear on S. Berliners Apocrypha website, an extension of the Garret "Bigger Boy" and "Biggest Boy". Doug Self's "Loco Locomotives" website referred to the latter as Hexaplex Delurium.
- Erik
erikemSounds like something that would appear on S. Berliners Apocrypha website, an extension of the Garret "Bigger Boy" and "Biggest Boy". Doug Self's "Loco Locomotives" website referred to the latter as Hexaplex Delurium.
Strange you should mention that. Go to 'Guest Apocrypha' on that site...
(The class G -- that was real, for a while anyway... ;-} )
Well, I kinda like the color...
It's hard to go wrong for style..... though my personal favorites are the 2-10-10-2 of VGN and AT&SF. For those that have survived to the present day..... the Y6b would be most practical to restore for operation. Lighter on rail, more compact overall than the others, and well-suited to the occasional back-up more and tight-curvature track it might need to use on occasion. Big Boys were every bit as heavy (or close enough, or heavier) to the Allegheny.... Frankly, it'd be lovely to see all of them operate again.
For that matter..... not all articulateds were steam.... I'll bet someone can guess my favorite articulated diesel, my favorite electrics were the IT class C and D motors.
I have also found Garrets to be pretty homely, but what a brilliant concept in locomotive design! No tender to lug around, a suspended boiler with no constraints on the firebox and weight distributed over a long span so as not to strain lightly built roadbeds. Gotta wonder why it was never exploited in the US. As for those German 0-4-4-0T's, they are so ugly that they are cute! But give me those 2-10-2T's any day!
They were designed primarily for narrow-gauge operations. US railroads did look at the concept.... however Garretts lose tractive effort as they burn fuel, since they don't carry their fuel in a separate tender. Railroads here also didn't have the design and size constraints faced by railroads in many places--which allowed them to evolve into brute-force machines, much in the manner rivers require small craft of a couple thousand tons maximum and the open ocean allows 500,000 ton oil tankers and 120,000 ton aircraft carriers. (Million ton oil tankers have been designed and planned, but never built--such vehicles would be so large as to be directly affected by the Earth's rotation.) US articulateds kept more consistent tractive effort because their fuel was kept in a separate tender, allowing the locomotive proper to be much heavier and longer (in addition to wider owing to a wider gauge). Mexico had some narrow gauge 0-4-4-0s that were quite endearing creatures. The forward driver bogie was inside frame and the rear driver bogie was outside frame. They carried 2-axle tenders behind them.
I submit the VGN Class AE 2-10-10-2's These ten locomotives were built in 1918 by ALCO for the Virginian Railway. Overall width was 144 inches, so they were delivered without their cabs and the front, low pressure cylinders and were assembled after arrival. The 48-inch low pressure cylinders (on 90-inch centers) were the largest on any US locomotive; the cylinders had to be inclined a few degrees to provide clearance.[1] The boiler was also the largest diameter of any locomotive; Railway Mech Engnr says "the outside diameter of the largest course is 112 7/8 in." but the drawing shows 118-1/2 inches diameter at the rear tube sheet.
This class were compound Mallet locomotives: as well as being articulated between the forward, swinging engine unit and the rear fixed one, they were compound locomotives. The rear, high pressure cylinders exhausted their steam into the huge front cylinders. Like many compound locomotives, they could be operated in simple mode for starting; reduced-pressure steam could be sent straight from the boiler to the front cylinders at low speed, for maximum tractive effort.
Calculated in the usual way (assuming equal tractive effort from the two engines and mean effective pressure adding up to 0.85 times boiler pressure) the tractive effort was 135,200 lb in compound; in the US, compound Mallets were credited with 20% more tractive effort in simple mode, or 162,200 lb for the Virginian locomotives.
Unlike some other giant locomotives of the period, the immense boilers could generate enough steam to make them a success on the slow (8 mph or 13 km/h) coal trains for which they were built. They remained in service until the 1940s and could be called the ultimate drag era locomotive.[
How about an SP Cab Forward?
Highly Photogenic.
Designed for Oil Firing so no fuel problems wherever it goes. In addition fewer "environmental" problems related to sooty exhaust in urban areas.
Used in both freight and passenger service over Sierra Nevada as well as other parts of SP system.
Because they were designed for use over Sierra Nevada fewer clearance problems than with engines not originally designed for close clearances.
Nobody else has one.
I submitted them earlier... lol.... read my first post. I first came across references to them in Ed King's column in Trains years ago, which is well worth reading ...... Wholly remarkable engines. To my knowledge, the 48 inch low-pressure cylinders were the largest used on any railroad locomotive in the world. It was my understanding their horsepower curve peaked at 11 mph, Tractive effeort in simple mode was 176,000 lbs, and they lasted into the 50s, not quite the bitter end for VGN steam, but close. One thing is certain, they were succcessful and appealing..... Santa Fe's looked nice, too, but there were many questions about their performance and whether they fit in with Santa Fe's long-term desire to speed up the western end of their system.
Cab forwards aren't a bad choice at all......and a couple still exist for restoration, no less. I'd never object.
How could you have overlooked the efficient Northern Pacific Z-6's and Z-8's?
NdeM6400 Cab forwards aren't a bad choice at all......and a couple still exist for restoration, no less. I'd never object.
Sorry, only one back-up survived, SP AC-12 4294.
I didn't, not specifically--but my knowledge of NP power could be improved. Another locomotive which fascinates me, since you mention it, are the GN 2-6-8-0s.
A tradgedy, still, better than none surviving.
I must agree, those Virginian giants are impressive, but at 8mph I think the riding public would get bored pretty quick! The Y6b is a great locomotive, but I still cast my vote for that 2-6-6-2 C&O compound in Baltimore.
Overmod 54light15 Garratts! I love 'em! I wish someone made one in model form but I've never sen one in any scale. Dear God, there are many! (Perhaps not easy to find, but they were made!) There is a very good model now available of the AD60 in Australia. I remember a Model Railroader discussion of one of the African Garratt kits -- probably sometime in the early Seventies; that was, if I recall correctly, a white-metal kit. Everything I remember seeing was HO, but I'll bet a hat there are others.
While thrashing about: I FOUND A LINK THAT MIGHT INTEREST YOU FELLOWS!
http://users.powernet.co.uk/hamilton/source.html
The Garratt Locomotive
A Complete list of Garratt Locomotives
1651 were built & 1638 assembled
How about a photo of a SAR Beyer- Garratt/ alive and well around Hempstead,TEXAS! U.S.A.
(The locomotive is on a private estate, and is not accessible to the public.)
(Apparently the link has been corrupted, so I removed it. )
Subscribers to T/O .com or the web site for "Two Footers' might be able to access it.(?)
Hmmmm.... yeah, forgot about that beastie, you're right, it would be more practical than the Y6b.
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