I visited Davis-Monthan Air Force Base, just outside of Tucson, a few years ago (Thanks, Amtrak). It is a weird place! There are thousands, and thousands, and thousands of 'retired' aircraft on the ground. A 'graveyard', per se, but, as a retired military person, I wasn't allowed out of the tour bus! Couldn't even go to the commissary or BX! Very strange, methinks. I still hold a 'Top Secret' security clearance, but the 'Zoomies' that run the place don't care. Anyhoo, it is a big place and has a railroad spur. Why couldn't the 'gummint' put in a few tracks to store obsolete/historic/out-of-favor railway equipment? Better than selling our Alco PAs to Mexico, methinks, or leaving Rohr 'Turboliners' in the woods of Michigan. The 'Gummint' doesn't seem to be in a hurry to sell any of the beer-can fodder, but the sale of a few B-52s, to AB-InBev of Belgium (Budweiser) or SAB Miller of South Africa (Miller Hi-Life) would pave-the-way! The rail link could take the scrap away, helping to pay for the new trackage. It is a great environment for preserving old equipment, but I wouldn't want to live there.
If you are "allowed" to visit Davis-Monthan AFB, do so! It is a 'boondoggle' of the highest order! It made me sick!
Hays
For a retired military person , your ignorance is appalling. AMARC (commonly known as the boneyard but properly as the Aircraft Maintainance and Regeneration Center) is NOT just a storage facility. Some aircraft with potential for reuse are in storage. Perhaps you would just rather scrap them and buy new? B52s, if there are any left and I don't think so, are not usuable as beer cans. The aircraft are held until all useable parts are removed and the residue is sold for scrap. No they don't let tourists of any stripe run loose. If you had gone to the gate and shown ID you would have been welcome at all exchange, commisary, and medical facilities. The rail lead , like most military rail facilities, has not been used for many years and does not go to AMARC. AMARC pays for itself many times over. The government is not in the business of spending tax money to cater to the whims of hobbyists, railfan or otherwise.
Also "top Secret" is not a clearance, but a level of classification for materials. Clearances are known by letters such as "Q" , "M", and "L'.
tdmidget For a retired military person , your ignorance is appalling. AMARC (commonly known as the boneyard but properly as the Aircraft Maintainance and Regeneration Center) is NOT just a storage facility. Some aircraft with potential for reuse are in storage. Perhaps you would just rather scrap them and buy new? B52s, if there are any left and I don't think so, are not usuable as beer cans. The aircraft are held until all useable parts are removed and the residue is sold for scrap. No they don't let tourists of any stripe run loose. If you had gone to the gate and shown ID you would have been welcome at all exchange, commisary, and medical facilities. The rail lead , like most military rail facilities, has not been used for many years and does not go to AMARC. AMARC pays for itself many times over. The government is not in the business of spending tax money to cater to the whims of hobbyists, railfan or otherwise. Also "top Secret" is not a clearance, but a level of classification for materials. Clearances are known by letters such as "Q" , "M", and "L'.
I may be misunderstanding your quote but there are def. still B-52 (H models, IIRC) in active service so I'd imagine there are some "spares" in desert storage. The older G models were scrapped to comply with treaty limitations and I suspect they are all gone..
"I Often Dream of Trains"-From the Album of the Same Name by Robyn Hitchcock
I beg to differ. My latest Department of Defense Form 873 (DD 873) lists my clearence as "TOP SECRET". I never saw your Alfa codes in use. "Q", for quee... No, I won't go there. The AMARC is a complete boondoggle, in my opinion. I presented my DD Form 2A at the gate. No problema. Unfortunately, I was on a bus with a bunch of veterans. Most of them had no military ID, so we didn't stop at the BX or commissary, even though I could have signed them in. We just didn't have enough smokers on-board to make it worthwhile. So, you are telling me that all of the scrap metal, and parts, are shipped out of D-MAFB by truck. Cool! Truly, there is so much junk/crap out there that the EPA should investigate! No wonder they have such tight security, for a boneyard! My thought was, simply, that some historic equipment could be parked on the un-used rails. Who would it bother/hurt? At least, it would save the builder's plates and bells, and maybe keep the windows from being broken and graffiti sprayed on the equipment. Dunno about those contract guards, though...
What would the EPA investigate? All incoming aircraft have all fluids removed as part of the preservation process. No ordinance is on any stored aircraft. Many parts are flown out as well as by truck. Intact aircraft and potentially airworthy airframes are either flown out or towed to dealers and repair facilities adjacent to the base. Scrap airframes are trucked to scrapyards nearby or towed to yards adjacent to the base.
I believe that all H models are in service if airworthy. They have virtually no parts in common with earlier versions.
Davis-Monthan had rail service when I was stationed there in the early '80s - I got my only cab ride on the base diesel.
Last time I looked at Google Maps satellite view, it appeared that the railroad tracks were gone. If that isn't the case, I would be happy to stand corrected. However, even if the rails are still in place, the "Boneyard" shipments of scrap and spare parts are measured in hundreds of pounds, not hundreds of tons.
D-M welcomes retirees of all stripes, one reason my father retired in Tucson. I retired there (26 years' service) but didn't stay in the area, the only member of my family that didn't end up in Tucson. Of course, you have to arrive at the base gate in your own vehicle, not a tour bus. (I used to commute by bicycle!)
The "Boneyard" has been covered by several made-for-TV specials, including one on the series of the same name. It has been a moneymaker from the beginning, and has returned millions to the treasury from scrap sales, as well as saving billions in spare parts purchases.
Anyone who would rather look at 'pretty' aircraft that will never fly again can visit the Pima Air Museum, which is immediately adjacent to the south border of D-M.
Chuck, MSgt(ret) USAF
A security clearance does expire. I had a Top Secret-Crypto clearance when I left the military in 1972. A temp assignment with my employer in 1981 required me to renew that clearance level again. At least the FBI was not interviewing my parent's neighbors this time! In actual practice, your clearance is only good on a 'need to know' basis. After the 6 month temp assignment(and signing off again on the 1954 based agreement not to divulge information), I went back to my normal job. That clearance and 75 cents may get you coffee out of the vending machine.
I have also toured DM-AFB a number of years ago with a group of vet's - it can be done. Really more impressive is the arial maps of the place you can find on Terraserver or Google!
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
We visited in 2008 starting at the Pima Air Museum. There we found out that they ran four tours a day to the boneyard for $6.00. We signed up and came back later to the museum entrance. An airconditioned bus with a former Airforce Vet who had worked at the boneyeard took us for about an hour and a half tour. We couldn't get off the bus, but could take all the photos we wanted out of the windows. They have one area where they keep one of each type of aircraft that is stored there. They drive real slow and close so you get good photos.
There were some B-52 in designated storage and some that were in the process of being cut up. One of the interesting things we learned was that on average about 5 to 7% of the aircraft stored are returned to flight status each year. Either replacing damaged aircaft in our services or sold to allied countries.
Craft that are scrapped are salvaged of any useful components that are then put in stock as replacement parts. The tour guide did say that the facility made a profit.
The Pima Air Museum is a First Class facility and definitely worth a visit. Okay, "Wing Nuts"! If you don't want our smelly locomotives stored at D-MAFB, maybe we could tuck them away on a warm/dry army post. We really can't afford to cover all of them, but the salt-free climate would help. Maybe Fort Irwin, CA or Fort Bliss, TX. Just a thought....
tdmidgetB52s, if there are any left and I don't think so,
B52s fly over my place of employment daily, Barksdale AFB is, and you can trust me on this, is quite full of operating B52's. I'm quite certain Osama Bin Laden knows they are still around as well, since it was B52's that bombed the _____ out of Tora Bora.
They will continue to serve us long into the future as well.
NELLIS AIR FORCE BASE, Nev. -- A B-52 from Barksdale Air Force Base, La., arrives here Aug. 21 to participate in Red Flag 09-5, an intense two-week combat scenario exercise. Red Flag is conducted on the 15,000-square-mile Nevada Test and Training Range, north of Las Vegas. The exercise is one of a series of advanced training programs administered by the U.S. Air Force Warfare Center and Nellis, through the 414th Combat Training Squadron. (U.S. Air Force photo by Staff Sgt. Sarah E. Stegman)(RELEASED)
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
There are also B-52Hs based out of Minot AFB.
http://www.minot.af.mil/
In regards to the B-52Gs, are all being scrapped or just those that were modified to carry ALCMs?
"No soup for you!" - Yev Kassem (from Seinfeld)
When I said that I did not believe that there were any left, I was referring to B-52s at Davis-Monthan. It is my understanding that all prior to the H model were required to be scrapped due to the SALT treaty. I don't see the ALCM as being relevant since all H models are so equipped. The models up to the G are basically a completely different airplane than the H models, with virtually no significant parts commonality.Numerous B-52s of various models were allowed to be preserved in non flying condition for museums and historical preservation. Pima Air ans Space Museum has 4 , I believe. The H model, while simpler to maintain and fly, has a much lower service ceiling and airspeed than the previous models.
As a fan of B-52s, particularly the G model, I am sad to report there was only one left when this picture was taken. I see it was last based a Castle AFB after the reorganization of the USAF in 1992. I was also surprised to see B-1s there.
Since Castle, with the possible exception of Edwards AFB, was the last base to have B-52Gs, and there is a large museum, with space, there, I wonder why the Castle museum never got a B-52G.
Eric, Edwards did not have Gs, they had 2 B models. These were among the highest and fastest and were equipped for dropping the X-15 and other test platforms. One of these is at Pima Air and Space Museuem here in Tucson. They were finally retired due the difficulty in keeping them airworthy, especially the pneudraulic system, as the scavenging of parts for museum exhibits was prohibited. It is one of the most historic aircraft at the museum.
They did have at least one when I went to the air show there in 1993 (ED tail code). I am sure they were not permanently based there like the NB-52Bs There was also that one painted pure white nicknamed Snowbird. I do not remember the serial number.
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