Assuming the Friends of the 261 elects to rebuild another engine in the next couple of years, any guesses as to what they might decide to rebuild next? Here are a few engines to chew on, feel free to add your own.
A GN engine
A Burlington engine (preferably a Hudson type)
Milwaukee Road 265
Frisco 1522
N&W 611
Others?
They'll probably pick the one that best suits their operational needs, that is in the best condition, and made available for the right price.
265 is the only alternative to doing a milwaukee engine of its size and type.
261 was an unexpected newly restored engine to me, perhaps they should look for a completely different engine never restored before.
maybe look for the 643 Bessemer and Lake Erie 2-10-4?
Located at Glenn Campbell, vacant warehouse, "bottoms" section of, McKees Rocks, PA
unedited note, looks like someone is already working on that engine for restoration!
http://www.rr-roadtrip.com/BLE1.htm
maybe try for the C&O 2-6-6-2 at the B&O museum in Maryland.
I would really like to see the "Q" hudson. But I beleive there is a FRISCO 2-8-2 in southern Illinois that is 1/2 restored . They ran out of money. So 1/2 the work is done so maybe they could finish that one?
How about SR 4501? Since she was the queen of excusions in the 1970's
One issue would have to be size and speed (or is that two issues?). Part of the reason 261 worked so well was that it could haul a sizeable passenger train (10-14 cars) at mainline speed, so it wasn't backing up traffic on the CP mainline down the Mississippi River's west bank. A smaller engine or a freight engine might not be able to pull that many cars, or not do it fast enough.
The second issue would be related to how much work it would take to restore an engine, including how many environmental issues (like asbestos problems) were involved. Part of why 261 was chosen to be restored was it was a relatively new engine (built in 1944 IIRC) and didn't have too many environmental problems compared to some other engines they look at.
Since (from their viewpoint) FO261 were not reasonably treated by the NRM, it will be very interesting to see where the title to any new engine resides. In any case, I suspect excursions in the near term will be done with borrowed power such as the fall trip with SP4449.
On a slightly different topic, how reasonable is the 15 year boiler inspection/rebuild requirement in the case of an engine that is only fired a few times each year?
The real steam time the engines were never cooled down kept hot. This contracts the boiler connections and so on, so that sounds reasonable, the real mainline engine may actually been outshopped more often or scheduled more often.
1522 has been stored under a shed in St. Louis since the previous group that operated it was forced to shut it down after they pretty much ran out of money. It appears to be well kept at the museum currently. It would probably need to go through the FRA teardown before operating again. I believe SSW 819 is another possibility, as it is pretty much stranded because UP won't let it run on their tracks.
I don't know that there's an immediate need for the Friends of 261 to get another steam engine. As I understand it, they have a pretty good "business" leasing out their passenger cars for fantrips to other organizations and could probably go on doing that indefinetely. Their cars are all converted to HEP and are up to Amtrak standards, so can really go pretty much anywhere.
As I recall a talk I heard one of their folks made a year or so ago, even when 261 was still expected to return to service for them, they were thinking of getting some diesels as sort of a back-up. For the excursions they run I think they could use restored E or F units and still get people to buy tickets, and would be less of a maintenance problem. Most if not all of their cars are post-war cars that would normally have been pulled by diesels anyway.
I work at the Tennessee Valley Railroad, home of Southern #4501, and we are trying to decide whether to restore it or not. Plus, the #819 or the #1522 might be a good candidate to use, as would the C.B.& Q 4-8-4, # unknown/
In the December 2009 issue of "Northern Lines" (the newsletter from the old "Friends of the 261" group), an article by Steve Sandberg goes into this exact topic.
He states that the "Friends" group has had some preliminary discussions with several museums and municipalities. If they decide to rebuild another steam loco, they will do it with one to ties to the Midwest. They specifically eliminate candidates such as the Frisco 1522, the C&O 614 and both the Norfolk & Western 611 and 1218.
However locomotives that served the Midwest such as those from the Burlington, Milwaukee Road, New York Central and others might be considered. Then again it bears repeating that they use the specific term, "if we decide to restore another locomotive."
In addition, the group is changing its name to "Railroading Heritage of Midwest America" to reflect their new direction without 261.
Lance
Rumor has it that the next engine the friends of 261 will restore will be...... Mlw 261.
http://www.sterlingrail.com/547/class.php?id=107
http://rypn.sunserver.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=28781
261 was supossedly recently sold to someone out west. Rumors around the web say the new owner will be leaseing it back to the friends of 261. Time will tell if these rumors are true or not.
I don't know what to think about this. I was really hopeing they'd restore a CB&Q Hudson or Northern.
John.
For whatever it may be worth, Steve Sandberg said yesterday that he has no plans to lease the 261 from its new owner. There have been discussions between the two, but leasing the locomotive from the owner was not a topic of conversation.
Welcome to the forums Doug.
steam611 Assuming the Friends of the 261 elects to rebuild another engine in the next couple of years, any guesses as to what they might decide to rebuild next? Here are a few engines to chew on, feel free to add your own. A GN engine A Burlington engine (preferably a Hudson type) Milwaukee Road 265 Frisco 1522 N&W 611 Others?
The good news about the story of the Friends of the 261 is they are looking for another locomotive to run. Unlike the NS steam program or the 1522 group that just stopped running anything. The amount of work that is required to keep a steam locomotive running is just not possible today unless many sacrifies are made by the workers.
Check out the 2926 progress over the past several years and it still has three more to go. We should all appreciate their work and donate to the project so the work can go on.
CZ
Steaminfo For whatever it may be worth, Steve Sandberg said yesterday that he has no plans to lease the 261 from its new owner. There have been discussions between the two, but leasing the locomotive from the owner was not a topic of conversation.
Aw really? Is it too much to ask that 261 runs again? Ugh...
Your friendly neighborhood CNW fan.
Lord Atmo Steaminfo For whatever it may be worth, Steve Sandberg said yesterday that he has no plans to lease the 261 from its new owner. There have been discussions between the two, but leasing the locomotive from the owner was not a topic of conversation. Aw really? Is it too much to ask that 261 runs again? Ugh...
I read a post that the deal to purchase the 261 did not happen. Anyone know if that is true??
CAZEPHYR I read a post that the deal to purchase the 261 did not happen. Anyone know if that is true??
See the following Trains Newswire story:
Mike
I just read that a few minutes ago. I can hope for the best out of this deal then. It would be nice if the same group ended up running the locomotive again. I'm guessing lease agreements with one person are probably much easier than with a whole museum?
.
Wel If you ask me Steve Sandsberg and the Friends of 261 should restore that New York Central Engine #3001. That would be a good engine I would like to see running.
P.S. my first time on the Trains forums
I understand that #261 needs $500,000-700,000 worth of boiler work to be recertified for operation. The engine could be purchased as is for $225,000.
Considering the intent of the Sandberg group to acquire another engine for operation, which of the possible candidates could be purchased and made operational for under $925,000?
Well one thing is for certian we are going to miss Milwaukee Road 261. As for the Friends of 261 and Steve Sandsberg I wish them alot of luck finding another engine to run again.
Well, to answer my own question two posts up, I would speculate that there is no locomotive available as an alternate to #261 that could be purchased and put into operation for under $925,000. Therefore, since #261 is for sale for $225,000, why doesn’t the Sandberg group just buy it, put the $700,000 into the boiler work that it needs, and run it?
Bucyrus Well, to answer my own question two posts up, I would speculate that there is no locomotive available as an alternate to #261 that could be purchased and put into operation for under $925,000. Therefore, since #261 is for sale for $225,000, why doesn’t the Sandberg group just buy it, put the $700,000 into the boiler work that it needs, and run it?
NewYorkCentralBucyrus Well, to answer my own question two posts up, I would speculate that there is no locomotive available as an alternate to #261 that could be purchased and put into operation for under $925,000. Therefore, since #261 is for sale for $225,000, why doesn’t the Sandberg group just buy it, put the $700,000 into the boiler work that it needs, and run it? Well if you ask me thats a question I think every Railfan should be asking Steve Sandsberg About.
You're assuming that they are looking into operating another steam locomotive ...
Need the $925,000 plus anything else you run into first.
The group has changed its name due to the change of circumstances. It is now "Railroading Heritage of Midwest America" if I remember correctly. I wonder how many years it will take before the old name disappears from common usage.
Tugboat Tony Bucyrus Well, to answer my own question two posts up, I would speculate that there is no locomotive available as an alternate to #261 that could be purchased and put into operation for under $925,000. Therefore, since #261 is for sale for $225,000, why doesn’t the Sandberg group just buy it, put the $700,000 into the boiler work that it needs, and run it? Need the $925,000 plus anything else you run into first.
I understand what you mean, but with #261, they have already covered all that other ground. It only needs the boiler work for recertification to be ready to work.
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