A title to a car does not do anything to dictate its authenticity, it mearly states that you own the car.
For railroad museums, there is a certain percentage of the original that needs to be preserved and incorporated into the restoration for it to be a restoration and not a replica. I remember having a discussion with someone about this a while ago. (I don't remember what the percentage is either at the moment.)
Parts that wear out (gaskets, bearings, etc.) are ususally not counted as part of a restoration, although even if they were, they should be a small part - you don't routinely want to replace a majority of your streetcar or automobile, do you?
Regarding the Baldwin, it looks like its mostly there. The important things would be the body and trucks (you can see those are there), then the motors (probably there), the compressors and controlers (might or might not be there, but could be replaced from preserved parts), and then the details (lights, doors, windows, etc.) Most of it looks like its there.
Sounds like we're getting into the old "restoration or replication" debate. It usually leads to the old joke about the man who claimed to have the original hatchet that George Washington used to cut down the cherry tree. He used it on a regular basis, and had replaced the handle three times and the head once.
One point that is usually agreed upon, if normal wear parts (bearings, gaskets, flues, etc) are replaced, then it's still restoration. Heck, they were probably replaced more than once while the item was in use. Once you start replacing major assemblies, then the debate starts.
The trolley car refered to above would be a replica. The Baldwin Steeplcab is in much better shape and has most of its major components, so it would be most likely a restoration.
Greg,
As long as you hold title to an original item you can replace every single part in it and it is legally still the original item. You must have a clear chain of ownership in the title back to the original purchase. That is what determines legal authenticity.
Some of the "antique" cars you see at meets have very few and sometimes no original parts. But the owners have a tracable title.
Blackcloud 5229http://www.trolleymuseum.org/collection/national/639.html It took many years of hard work to finish it but as you can see she is beautiful. As an side note this car is the one that the shop forces learned how to Hot Rivet with and later gave a demonstration while rebuilding Boston Type 5 5821 car When the Museum hosted a t.r.a.i.n.s. conventions.Anything is restorable.
It took many years of hard work to finish it but as you can see she is beautiful. As an side note this car is the one that the shop forces learned how to Hot Rivet with and later gave a demonstration while rebuilding Boston Type 5 5821 car When the Museum hosted a t.r.a.i.n.s. conventions.
Anything is restorable.
Minor Nit. From your description, that car wasn't restored, it was replicated. While that is an equally valid and useful endevor, it is a new car. From a museum standpoint, that might actually be a better process sometime. Replicate a car for use while preserving an authentic example in an original but arrested decay status to preserve the original fabric.
But alas, this thread has strayed a long way from "found" lost locomotives. :-)
Greg
Gents and Ladies,
Never say never when it comes to restoration. I joined The Seashore Trolley Museum back in 1965 and during a property clean up campaign around 66 -67 the remains of a Wheeling, West Virgina streetcar number 639 were destined to be scrapped. All that was left was the bottom of one end of the car, the frame/floor and nothing else. A member who at the time was working overseas was vactioning and decided to take on the challenge to restore the car. No running gear, controllers, seats nothing but the remains. Take a look at what she is like today at the following link.
http://www.trolleymuseum.org/collection/national/639.html
James Shanks
When I used to explore that area some 40 years ago there were three of those electrics sitting there. They were used to switch the Locust Summit Breaker of the Reading Anthracite Company. The ex CNJ 0-6-0 that is now at the station in Minersville was parked near the breaker back then also.
>When I click on the railpictures.net I just get linked back to one of the trains.com main pages.<
Happened to me too. Fortunately somebody posted a photo here in the thread.
sigh
Now I guess I'll have to learn how to navigate this forum ... lurking was so much easier.
When I click on the railpictures.net I just get linked back to one of the trains.com main pages.
I'd love to read more of the story on this engine.
Modeling the "Fargo Area Rapid Transit" in O scale 3 rail.
Fireflite So where is this little gem? (If it's an Undisclosed Location, can we at least know what state?)
So where is this little gem? (If it's an Undisclosed Location, can we at least know what state?)
Mt Carmel, PA, just scroll down to the caption on the photo page.
Blind, yes, but there is usually a small allowance in the mechanism for lateral motion. Also, don't assume the rail under this locomotive is straight.
I dont know if its blind, but its certaily badly aligned, its fallen right off the rail!
Have fun with your trains
I think it is interesting that the middle driver is blind. (Follow the link to the detail photos).
Phil
Timber Head Eastern Railroad "THE Railroad Through the Sierras"
vsmith Its too bad its so rusted out. Doubt something that far gone could be brought back by any museum
Its too bad its so rusted out. Doubt something that far gone could be brought back by any museum
As a static display, this is not in that bad shape. Most of what you see is surface rust, I don't see any actual rust through. Some parts are missing, but I believe they were mostly wood (doors, pilot step, etc) which would need replacement on most restorations. An extensive "under the hood" survey would need to be done to determine potential for operability.
This is something that doesn't happen very often..finding a Baldwin Westinghouse steeple cab abandoned and intact..in a forest..Too bad it wasn't a T1
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=265787&nseq=3
Nothing is more fairly distributed than common sense: no one thinks he needs more of it than he already has.
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.