I heard the other day about a new Natural Gas Fuel Cell using charcoal that pretty much solves the stability problems that normal natural gas vehicles have.
With the abundance of Natural gas today, would they be able to power a steamer on natural gas?
RJ
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Something I was considering was electricity... basically plug it in to heat up coils running through tubes in the boiler, and once they're get steam going, have like a dynamo, alternator, or something similar wired to a generator/recharger for a large bank of lithium batteries in the tender that'd keep the coils hot once it was unplugged..... and thus you'd have a completely clean steam engine that would probably be cheaper in the long run than having to refuel it with gas or otherwise.
I believe there was a country in europe that hooked their steam locos up to the power grid due to coal shortages or something during WW2. They'd use power from overhead electrical lines to heat the boiler instead of a fire. The contraption on top to draw the power was butt ugly though.
miniwyo I heard the other day about a new Natural Gas Fuel Cell using charcoal that pretty much solves the stability problems that normal natural gas vehicles have. With the abundance of Natural gas today, would they be able to power a steamer on natural gas?
Makes sense for something like the Grand Canyon RR (though IINM they are retiring their steam engines)...But if you're talking about revenue service on Class 1's why use a steamer when you can modify a diesel to run on LNG (or CNG)?
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The Dude With The Hair I believe there was a country in europe that hooked their steam locos up to the power grid due to coal shortages or something during WW2. They'd use power from overhead electrical lines to heat the boiler instead of a fire. The contraption on top to draw the power was butt ugly though.
Switzerland, which already had catenary in place over everything except the minor spurs served by the coalburners. When they couldn't get imported coal (thanks to the efforts of the 8th and 15th Air Forces and our British allies in Hawker Typhoons,) they put big heating coils in the boilers of some of their steam switchers, which would build up a good head of steam and hot water and then run rather like fireless steamers on the un-electrified track. When the pressure fell enough, they would scoot back to the catenary and re-heat. Horribly inefficient, and discontinued as soon as coal was available.
The keys to practicality with fuel for a locomotive are energy content and safety. How many BTU can be stored in one cubic foot of fuel tank or bunker. This, IMHO, is the problem with gaseous fuel. I recall seeing Chinese city busses fueled with gas - huge bladder like an overgrown air matress on the roof, bulging at the beginning of the day, sagging sloppily at the end, all to hold the energy equivalent of about 3 cubic feet of #2 diesel. How big will a pressure vessel have to be to carry as much energy as the fuel tanks of a mainline diesel, or a late steam era locomotive with a 25 ton or larger coal bunker? Not to mention that there is no chance of having a BLEVE event with coal or #2 diesel, but there have been LOTS of BLEVE involving LNG and liquid propane...
BLEVE? Burning Liquid Explosive Vapor Explosion - huge fireball and tank cars headed for orbit! A good thing not to be anywhere near.
Chuck
tomikawaTT Not to mention that there is no chance of having a BLEVE event with coal or #2 diesel, but there have been LOTS of BLEVE involving LNG and liquid propane... BLEVE? Burning Liquid Explosive Vapor Explosion - huge fireball and tank cars headed for orbit! A good thing not to be anywhere near. Chuck
Not to mention that there is no chance of having a BLEVE event with coal or #2 diesel, but there have been LOTS of BLEVE involving LNG and liquid propane...
They are making charcoal filled fuel cells and they are supposed to be VERY stable. I ave lived in the gas fields all my life, its what brought my family here, and who pays me (for now) so I have seen how unstable it can be. I can't count the number of company trucks i have seen burned down. But this charcoal thing is supposed to fix that.
Poor efficency prevents the perpetual motion machine. The efficiency of early steam locomotives were in the 10-20% range. For every 1,000 watts of power you put into it, you realize only 100-200 watts power (work). Actually, the very early boiler designs yielded under 10% efficiency. Even an internal combustion enine (gasoline engine) has a very very low efficiency rating. Most of it's energy is lost in disipated heat - waste heat. Oh well, no free lunch.
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