What weighs 30 tons and eats lots of wood?

[cacole]

Home Depot, Lowe's, and other stores sell used railroad ties to the public in their garden shops for use as retaining walls.  I think only fresh creosote is an environmental or health hazard, and by the time a crosstie is removed from use the creosote threat has diminished significantly.

A rail line was recently torn out here in SE Arizona and the ties were tagged as being the private property of a railroad salvage company.  The Union Pacific is in the process of replacing hundreds of miles of wooden ties with cement here in Arizona, and they are gathering up and selling the old ties to someone.

Perhaps the shredded ties can be used as filler for roadway asphalt.

[spbed]

Well that is very nice of U. I do not think the RRs are involved. When I was out on the GSR in March they were doing lots of tie replacement also & the used ones were being collected by private vendors who paid the UPRR for the used ties or so the drivers said

 

 

 

I could not find much about the specifics of creosote hazard.  I know it can be a skin irritant.  Something I read suggested that it might have been regulated to be less potent than it was in the past.  A rather famous creosote pollution case involves the former site of Republic Creosote Company in St. Louis Park, MN.  I lived in that general vicinity, and recall it well.  Here is the story:

http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/hac/PHA/reilly_mn/rtc_p1.html

 

I would not jump to the conclusion that this tie shredding is illegal or that the shredded material will be used in a way that will be illegal or pose a hazard.  I would guess that railroads and tie contractors are well versed on what it permitted.  And the issue has certainly not gone un-noticed by law makers and other authorities.

  There were permits displayed in a case, actually.  I'll drive by today and see what they said.  I could also talk to the city.  Hmm...

[spbed]

I could not find much about the specifics of creosote hazard.  I know it can be a skin irritant.  Something I read suggested that it might have been regulated to be less potent than it was in the past.  A rather famous creosote pollution case involves the former site of Republic Creosote Company in St. Louis Park, MN.  I lived in that general vicinity, and recall it well.  Here is the story:

http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/hac/PHA/reilly_mn/rtc_p1.html

 

I would not jump to the conclusion that this tie shredding is illegal or that the shredded material will be used in a way that will be illegal or pose a hazard.  I would guess that railroads and tie contractors are well versed on what it permitted.  And the issue has certainly not gone un-noticed by law makers and other authorities.

  There were permits displayed in a case, actually.  I'll drive by today and see what they said.  I could also talk to the city.  Hmm...

[CNW 6000]

I could not find much about the specifics of creosote hazard.  I know it can be a skin irritant.  Something I read suggested that it might have been regulated to be less potent than it was in the past.  A rather famous creosote pollution case involves the former site of Republic Creosote Company in St. Louis Park, MN.  I lived in that general vicinity, and recall it well.  Here is the story:

http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/hac/PHA/reilly_mn/rtc_p1.html

 

I would not jump to the conclusion that this tie shredding is illegal or that the shredded material will be used in a way that will be illegal or pose a hazard.  I would guess that railroads and tie contractors are well versed on what it permitted.  And the issue has certainly not gone un-noticed by law makers and other authorities.

  There were permits displayed in a case, actually.  I'll drive by today and see what they said.  I could also talk to the city.  Hmm...

[Anonymous]

I could not find much about the specifics of creosote hazard.  I know it can be a skin irritant.  Something I read suggested that it might have been regulated to be less potent than it was in the past.  A rather famous creosote pollution case involves the former site of Republic Creosote Company in St. Louis Park, MN.  I lived in that general vicinity, and recall it well.  Here is the story:

http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/hac/PHA/reilly_mn/rtc_p1.html

 

I would not jump to the conclusion that this tie shredding is illegal or that the shredded material will be used in a way that will be illegal or pose a hazard.  I would guess that railroads and tie contractors are well versed on what it permitted.  And the issue has certainly not gone un-noticed by law makers and other authorities.

[spbed]

Wow maybe someone contact the EPA as I presume they are going to sell it for mulch that will leech into the ground. Not good IMHO 

 

 

 

By their appearance and the smell in the air they definately were creosoted.

[CNW 6000]

By their appearance and the smell in the air they definately were creosoted.

[spbed]

Ugh hopefully then were non cresoted otherwise whomever is doing that is throwing our ecology out of whack

 

 

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107001.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107002.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107003.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107004.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107005.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107006.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107007.jpg
This guy!

It was operating in Oshkosh, WI.  My only question is what happens to the byproduct/mulch-like stuff that is made from the ties?  Where does it go and what's it used for?

[CNW 6000]

The issue of creosote getting off/out of the ties into the environment begs the question: what effect does it have?  The information I've found so far says that it mainly causes irritation of respiratory tissues and if ingested could cause nausea or diarrhea.  Nothing about water or anything.  It's apparently hard to get out of clothing.

[gabe]

(1)  I seem to remember that the environmental impact of burning such ties is diminished if the fire is hot enought.  Apparently, intense heat can break down the chemical.

(2)  If it is a big environmental concern, me and my home town is in trouble.  When NS single tracked its Decatur, IL St. Louis, MO ex Wabash main, it replaced all of the ties on the South bound main, and removed all of the ties on the North bound.  NS put about 100 miles worth of ties (actually 50, but, remember, there were two mains) in a HUGE pile that covered seven acres and was about 20 feet high.  One of the crazy neighbors to this pile decided he did not like to look at it, so he set a match to it.

You could litterally see the smoke from more than 50 miles away, and flame from 10 miles away.  The flre was so hot, it melted vynl siding off a house 250 yards away.

As it did not get sued over this, I am sure NS sent him a thank you card, as it disposed of the head ache of dealing with the ties.

It was quite the event.

Gabe

[Anonymous]

Bucyrus,

Thanks for the link.  Great article.  So, as I said, I wouldn't want to be around or use chipped ties -- as fuel or anything else.  It does beg the question though, what is to be done with all the wooden ties that are too eroded to use or that are just laying next to miles and miles of track?

I have seen cases where they were just left stacked to dry and wait to be consumed by the next inevitable grass fire.  But for massive tie replacement projects, there must be a more concerted effort to deal with them.  The article about shredding them and using them for fuel sounded like this was not without some controversy about the ultimate disposition of the creosote.

The issue of creosote in the environment raises the question of creosote emitted from ties in use.  Certainly creosote must be constantly entering the ground after being washed off ties by rain.  I have never heard a discussion of this issue. 

[Richard A]

Bucyrus,

Thanks for the link.  Great article.  So, as I said, I wouldn't want to be around or use chipped ties -- as fuel or anything else.  It does beg the question though, what is to be done with all the wooden ties that are too eroded to use or that are just laying next to miles and miles of track?

[spokyone]

Somewhere I have a video of Grand Canyon Railway. They piled up all the old ties many years ago. The EPA will not let them burn 'em or bury 'em. They were still stacked there when we passed by.
Edit: Thanks for the great pics Dan.
  

[Anonymous]

Apparently shredded ties are used for fuel.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3652/is_200202/ai_n9039015

 

[Poppa_Zit]

My only question is what happens to the byproduct/mulch-like stuff that is made from the ties?  Where does it go and what's it used for?

They make big bucks bagging and selling it as cereal at health food stores. One half-cup is worth a full week's fiber requirement. The celebrity spokeman used to be Phil Hartman. 

[doghouse]

I was going to say termites.

It'd have to be about 10.9 billion termites at least.

So THAT'S how they make toothpicks

 

Gotta be the most hardcore foamer that wants creosote-flavored-toothpicks, you think?

Can they even sell that stuff with the cerosote on it?

[JT22CW]

I was going to say termites.

It'd have to be about 10.9 billion termites at least.

So THAT'S how they make toothpicks

Gotta be the most hardcore foamer that wants creosote-flavored-toothpicks, you think?

[Richard A]

Now I'm curious, too!  This isn't your normal "mulch".  Considering the high percentage of kreosote and who knows what other chemicals, the downstream use must be unique.  Hope someone chimes in soon with an answer.  Meanwhile, I'll see what Google has to say.

[CANADIANPACIFIC2816]

My initial thought was "It must be one heck of a BIG termite!"

CANADIANPACIFIC2816

[CNW 6000]

The neat thing was watching the mulch-like finished product come out like a flash.  There was a huge pile of ties there and it was reduced to nothing but mulch pretty quick.  Where does this stuff go?  Who buys it?

[vsmith]

AHHHH!!! So THATS how they make toothpicks!

[dldance]

when I saw the subject - my answer was "Jupiter" the 30 ton wood burning locomotive at Golden Spike.  I haven't looked at your pictures yet as I am on the road.

 dd

[doghouse]

 

I was going to say termites.

[CNW 6000]

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107001.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107002.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107003.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107004.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107005.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107006.jpg http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o88/bronzegod4ever/TieGrinderMay3107007.jpg
This guy!

It was operating in Oshkosh, WI.  My only question is what happens to the byproduct/mulch-like stuff that is made from the ties?  Where does it go and what's it used for?