New hopper cars....

[Murphy Siding]

     They say a picture is worth a thousand words...........I wish I had a picture, because my fingers are going to get tired.

     Our local shortline, The Dakota & Iowa Railroad, hauls a unit rock train every day from Dell Rapids, South Dakota, to Sioux City, Iowa, about 90 miles.  Recently, the D&I got some new hoppers to carry crushed rock.  They are *different* than what I'm used to seeing, and I wonder why.  Picture a common hopper car.  The front and back end of the *tub* that holds the rocks is just about equal to the front and back of the wheel trucks.  The couplers extend beyond this line.  Each end has a ladder built in to each side, for a trainman to ride while switching, I presume.  These new hoppers, have the trucks extended, about another 4 to 6 feet forward and backward.  As a consequence, they have almost a *porch* on the front and back.  A trainman could climb up the east ladder, walk accross the porch, and walk down the west ladder.  Why are these different?  I don't see an advantage.  They are, perhaps 8 to 12 feet longer than the old style hoppers.  As such, they must cost more, and make a train longer.  Are they designed to make the wheelbase longer?  If so, why?

[ericsp]

Sounds like Ortner cars.

http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/spcars/byclass/hopper/h100-42.htm

[cordon]

Wild guesses, from looking at two different kinds of rock cars. 

The designers want to have three doors instead of two, so the trucks have to be farther apart to provide clearance for the doors. 

Why not build the car body all the way out to the ends of the trucks?  To assure the rock all falls out and doesn't get hung up inside, the floor of the car must have a certain slope, which limits the length of the useful car body.

Why three doors?  It seems to me that a three-door arrangement provides more load space because of the slope mentioned above.

 

[ericsp]

I would guess the reason for more doors is faster unloading. SP's Ortner cars have the same capacity as its other, more traditional design, gravel hoppers built around the same time.

[CShaveRR]

Eric's probably right--they sound similar to Ortner's design, which would, I believe, belong to Trinity Industries now.

Ortner was a pioneer in the quick-dumping field, and its hopper design is pretty much like having the bottom fall out of the car when it opens.  Aggregate is far denser than coal, so it doesn't need as long a car to hold as much weight.  And yes, wheelbase length becomes a consideration to keep the car at 40 feet overall length or better.

Did you get a reporting mark and number?

[Dakguy201]

I haven't seen any of these cars as yet, but the reporting mark will be LGEX,  LG Everist Inc, which is the owner/operator of the rock quarry, and owns the D&I as well.

The line to which Murphy refers, as well as the northbound lanes of Interstate 29, were blocked by a landslide on Tuesday.  The interstate is back open, but the railroad still has some digging to do. 

[Murphy Siding]

Sounds like Ortner cars.

http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/spcars/byclass/hopper/h100-42.htm

They are really similar to this, except there is a diagonal support brace, that extends down from the ends of the top of the tub, then vertically down to the frame.  It makes sense, that they are elongated to provide room for a third door.

[Murphy Siding]

     Locomutt sent me an e-mail that they might be Ortner Rapid Discharge hoppers.  I found some photos, but they were something different.  If the wheelsets were moved further forward and backward, to provide room for a third door, why wouldn't they extend the tub portion of the car forward and backward as well?  Wouldn't that lower the sides, and the center of gravity?

[ericsp]

     Locomutt sent me an e-mail that they might be Ortner Rapid Discharge hoppers.  I found some photos, but they were something different.  If the wheelsets were moved further forward and backward, to provide room for a third door, why wouldn't they extend the tub portion of the car forward and backward as well?  Wouldn't that lower the sides, and the center of gravity?

Carl wrote that opening the doors is like having the bottom of the car fall out. If it were more of a traditional design, opening the doors would not have the same effect.

[CShaveRR]

Dave Casdorph's web site reports a couple of new series of LGEX hoppers (built during 2006), one built by National Steel Car and one built by Kasgro (the same folks that bring you the heavy-duty flat cars).  The AAR Car Type Codes shown, however, identify them as conventional hoppers (HT) as opposed to the quick-dumping variety (HTS).  It might bear looking into (or at, at least) if I knew that one of these groups were the cars we were talking about.

[Murphy Siding]

     Thanks for the info Carl.  I looked over those sights, but didn't see what I'm looking for.  I'll have to take more notes, next time I'm closer to the train.  Is there usually anything written on a new railcar that says who built it?

[ericsp]

If it is in its factory paint, there will probably be a builder's logo. It seems like it is usually at the bottom of the car toward the right.

Carl, do you think we can convince Trains to start a freight car forum?

[CShaveRR]

That would almost certainly keep me from lurking elsewhere!  I certainly see enough interesting stuff all the time, but I don't know how many other folks would be interested in it.

Murph, if the cars were built by National Steel, they have a small circular decal in the lower right or lower left corner (or both) of the sides.  Kasgro cars aren't marked, that I've seen--you'd have to read some of the fine print about paint, brakes, and bearings scattered about the car.

[Murphy Siding]

     Well, if I ever get into the freightcar building business,  The Murphy Siding Car Company will be putting a builder's plate, with company herald on each car!

[cordon]

Does your car look like this?

 

 

[Murphy Siding]

Does your car look like this?

Ding! Ding!  We have a winner!  That's the one!  I'm trying to visualize why there is such a space at the end of the car-enough to allow the walkway from side to side?  I thought the ones I saw had that external pipe brace type afair going to the far end (coupler side) of the platform.  Darn memory.

( Thanks cordon )

[ericsp]

Does your car look like this?

Ding! Ding!  We have a winner!  That's the one!  I'm trying to visualize why there is such a space at the end of the car-enough to allow the walkway from side to side?  I thought the ones I saw had that external pipe brace type afair going to the far end (coupler side) of the platform.  Darn memory.

( Thanks cordon )

That looks like NSC's logo at the far ends of the car, just below the slanted "roof". Those cars look even stranger than the Ortner cars.

My guess is that the platforms exist because the moved the trucks out to allow for rapid discharge, there is very little of the hopper that extends beyond the doors.

[cordon]

I think the slope you see on the ends continues down to the doors, and I think the designers want the slope to be as steep as it is to make sure all the gravel/sand falls out.  The rock plant workers here want to get every last pebble out.  They even sweep the top edges of the car before they move it off the pit. 

The slope determines the minimum distance of the truck from the center of the car. 

These cars have doors powered by compressed air, so there are two air hoses connecting them.  One is the normal train brake air line, and the other is for the doors.  The rock plant here doesn't use air power, however.  They still operate the doors manually.  These cars first appeared here in Frisco, TX, about a year ago.

MWAX is Martin Marietta Materials.  If you search on Google for MWAX, it is about the 8th item down the first page of results.  There are more pics there. 

Glad I could help.