Mookie-whys.....

kenneo

Member since
December 2001
From: Upper Left Coast
1,796 posts

Posted by kenneo on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 3:29 PM

QUOTE: Originally posted by CShaveRR

depending on the speed of the train (the faster it's going, the further back it's tripped). If the train stops before it gets to thecrossing, the gates will lift after a certain amount of time...not the engineer's doing, completely automatic! They'll go down again when motion is detected.
.........
I like UP's permanent speed-restriction sign shapes...when you come to a place where speed is to be reduced, it's denoted by a yellow arrow pointing downward ... When you're past the speed restriction, and can resume normal speed, the arrow-shaped sign points upward, and is green.

--------------------------
For the crossing, it is called a predictor circuit. Should the train/engine get into what is called the "island" or "center" circuit, the gates will stay down.

Where predictor circuits are used, should a train be standing in an approach circuit, and the rail move due to heating or cooling of the rail, the predictor will see this as train movement.

You almost got the RS (Resume Speed) sigh correct. You resume to the speed posted prior to the temporary reduction. If you were authorized 60 and came to a reduction board that says 45, that board is placed 2 miles in advance of the place where the speed reduction is to take effect. At the end of that restriction (curve, bridge, tunnel, etc.) you find the Green Resume Speed board at the spot where the increased speed is authorized to begin. So in our illustration, you do 60, then 45, then 60. One final note, the front coupler must not be proceeding at a speed greater than authorized at the point where the reduction takes effect (45) and FRED must not exceed the reduction (45) until it has passed the Green board.

Mookie, I would wager that this yard you speak about is a BN facility. The BN put a mile post identifier at each "intermediate structure" such as a crossing, culvert, bridge, etc.

Eric

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kenneo

Member since
December 2001
From: Upper Left Coast
1,796 posts

Posted by kenneo on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 3:29 PM

QUOTE: Originally posted by CShaveRR

depending on the speed of the train (the faster it's going, the further back it's tripped). If the train stops before it gets to thecrossing, the gates will lift after a certain amount of time...not the engineer's doing, completely automatic! They'll go down again when motion is detected.
.........
I like UP's permanent speed-restriction sign shapes...when you come to a place where speed is to be reduced, it's denoted by a yellow arrow pointing downward ... When you're past the speed restriction, and can resume normal speed, the arrow-shaped sign points upward, and is green.

--------------------------
For the crossing, it is called a predictor circuit. Should the train/engine get into what is called the "island" or "center" circuit, the gates will stay down.

Where predictor circuits are used, should a train be standing in an approach circuit, and the rail move due to heating or cooling of the rail, the predictor will see this as train movement.

You almost got the RS (Resume Speed) sigh correct. You resume to the speed posted prior to the temporary reduction. If you were authorized 60 and came to a reduction board that says 45, that board is placed 2 miles in advance of the place where the speed reduction is to take effect. At the end of that restriction (curve, bridge, tunnel, etc.) you find the Green Resume Speed board at the spot where the increased speed is authorized to begin. So in our illustration, you do 60, then 45, then 60. One final note, the front coupler must not be proceeding at a speed greater than authorized at the point where the reduction takes effect (45) and FRED must not exceed the reduction (45) until it has passed the Green board.

Mookie, I would wager that this yard you speak about is a BN facility. The BN put a mile post identifier at each "intermediate structure" such as a crossing, culvert, bridge, etc.

Eric

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Mookie

Member since
June 2001
From: US
13,488 posts

Posted by Mookie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 12:41 PM

Carl - I like the automatic system! That sounds pretty useful! This is the edge of the yard and I have seen switch engines sit while waiting to go back into the yard. They will leave them down if no one is around and waiting to cross. But when someone comes along, they immediately put them up for them to cross. Most of them. Once in awhile you get one of the 7 dwarfs - grumpy - that won't do it for anyone, no how. And these are the same switch engines that I see all the time doing it!

The sign post was at the entrance to the yard, where they do have to cross a small bridge. The six sets of tracks all funnel across this bridge and then fan out into a pretty good sized yard.

I read so much - but I believe I read it in GCOR that the speed limit or restriction signs must always be passenger on top and freight on bottom. Some of those things they repeat each time and after awhile you remember it!

Thanx

Jen

She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw

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Mookie

Member since
June 2001
From: US
13,488 posts

Posted by Mookie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 12:41 PM

Carl - I like the automatic system! That sounds pretty useful! This is the edge of the yard and I have seen switch engines sit while waiting to go back into the yard. They will leave them down if no one is around and waiting to cross. But when someone comes along, they immediately put them up for them to cross. Most of them. Once in awhile you get one of the 7 dwarfs - grumpy - that won't do it for anyone, no how. And these are the same switch engines that I see all the time doing it!

The sign post was at the entrance to the yard, where they do have to cross a small bridge. The six sets of tracks all funnel across this bridge and then fan out into a pretty good sized yard.

I read so much - but I believe I read it in GCOR that the speed limit or restriction signs must always be passenger on top and freight on bottom. Some of those things they repeat each time and after awhile you remember it!

Thanx

Jen

She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw

Reply

CShaveRR

Member since
June 2001
From: Lombard (west of Chicago), Illinois
13,681 posts

Posted by CShaveRR on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 9:44 AM

We have some grade crossings that are tripped at different places depending on the speed of the train (the faster it's going, the further back it's tripped). If the train stops before it gets to thecrossing, the gates will lift after a certain amount of time...not the engineer's doing, completely automatic! They'll go down again when motion is detected. The crossing west of our commuter station goes through that every hour.

It's unusual to have a mileage marker with a fraction of a mile like that. Was it at (or on) something like a bridge?

On a signal mast with a number board (not an absolute signal...check GCOR!), the number is quite often the mileage multiplied by ten...that is, a block signal at Mile 98.7 would say "987" on its board.

Speed limit signs: CSX used to have them at block signals...circular signs with numbers for freight-only speeds, and diamond-shaped signs with two numbers: first number for passenger, second for freight.

I like UP's permanent speed-restriction sign shapes...when you come to a place where speed is to be reduced, it's denoted by a yellow arrow pointing downward with the restrictions stencilled on them (first number for passenger, second for freight). When you're past the speed restriction, and can resume normal speed, the arrow-shaped sign points upward, and is green. No number necessary; you should know that from the timetable.

Carl

Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)

CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)

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CShaveRR

Member since
June 2001
From: Lombard (west of Chicago), Illinois
13,681 posts

Posted by CShaveRR on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 9:44 AM

We have some grade crossings that are tripped at different places depending on the speed of the train (the faster it's going, the further back it's tripped). If the train stops before it gets to thecrossing, the gates will lift after a certain amount of time...not the engineer's doing, completely automatic! They'll go down again when motion is detected. The crossing west of our commuter station goes through that every hour.

It's unusual to have a mileage marker with a fraction of a mile like that. Was it at (or on) something like a bridge?

On a signal mast with a number board (not an absolute signal...check GCOR!), the number is quite often the mileage multiplied by ten...that is, a block signal at Mile 98.7 would say "987" on its board.

Speed limit signs: CSX used to have them at block signals...circular signs with numbers for freight-only speeds, and diamond-shaped signs with two numbers: first number for passenger, second for freight.

I like UP's permanent speed-restriction sign shapes...when you come to a place where speed is to be reduced, it's denoted by a yellow arrow pointing downward with the restrictions stencilled on them (first number for passenger, second for freight). When you're past the speed restriction, and can resume normal speed, the arrow-shaped sign points upward, and is green. No number necessary; you should know that from the timetable.

Carl

Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)

CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)

Reply

JoeKoh

Member since
April 2003
From: Defiance Ohio
13,309 posts

Posted by JoeKoh on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 9:05 AM

on harris road there is a milemaker still in stone.The farmer keeps it painted,180 miles to chicago 82 miles to willard ohio a subdivision point for CSX.
stay safe
Joe

Deshler Ohio-crossroads of the B&O Matt eats your fries.YUM! Clinton st viaduct undefeated against too tall trucks!!!(voted to be called the "Clinton St. can opener").

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JoeKoh

Member since
April 2003
From: Defiance Ohio
13,309 posts

Posted by JoeKoh on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 9:05 AM

on harris road there is a milemaker still in stone.The farmer keeps it painted,180 miles to chicago 82 miles to willard ohio a subdivision point for CSX.
stay safe
Joe

Deshler Ohio-crossroads of the B&O Matt eats your fries.YUM! Clinton st viaduct undefeated against too tall trucks!!!(voted to be called the "Clinton St. can opener").

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BentnoseWillie

Member since
January 2002
From: Nova Scotia
825 posts

Posted by BentnoseWillie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 9:02 AM

Thank you muchly. He likes pictures of trains, especially SP. I don't know where I went wrong so quickly...[:o)]

B-Dubya -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Inside every GE is an Alco trying to get out...apparently, through the exhaust stack!

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BentnoseWillie

Member since
January 2002
From: Nova Scotia
825 posts

Posted by BentnoseWillie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 9:02 AM

Thank you muchly. He likes pictures of trains, especially SP. I don't know where I went wrong so quickly...[:o)]

B-Dubya -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Inside every GE is an Alco trying to get out...apparently, through the exhaust stack!

Reply

Mookie

Member since
June 2001
From: US
13,488 posts

Posted by Mookie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 8:53 AM

Thanx B-Dubya - that clears up a lot.

Keep meaning to tell you - cute baby - are you reading GCOR? Start 'em young!

Mookie

She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw

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Mookie

Member since
June 2001
From: US
13,488 posts

Posted by Mookie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 8:53 AM

Thanx B-Dubya - that clears up a lot.

Keep meaning to tell you - cute baby - are you reading GCOR? Start 'em young!

Mookie

She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw

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BentnoseWillie

Member since
January 2002
From: Nova Scotia
825 posts

Posted by BentnoseWillie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 8:41 AM

1) At most crossings, there's a small control box mounted on the outside of the relay "bungalow" that issecured with a switch lock. The engineer or conductor can open this with their switch key and raise the crossing gates by pushing a button, then lower them again and lock up the box again.

2) It's a milepost, used to indicate location. Railroads are divided into divisions and subdivisions, and the location is given in terms of the mileage from end of track or the junction to the next subdivision. In this case, you were 0.94 miles from the end of the subdivision, be it end of rail or the next subdivision.

At the dividing point, the milepost should have different mileages on each side - mile X of subdivision A and mile 0 of sudivision B.

3) That sounds like a permanent speed restriction. This is a permanent "slow zone" where trains are restricted to a lower speed than the normal limit ("track speed"). Temporary speed restrictions are put in place for various problems with the track (drainage, crossing maintenance, etc.), and are usually noted in operating bulletins issued by the dispatcher and by flags erected at trackside. Permanent restrictions are put in for long-term causes (lightly-built bridge or swing bridge, heavy vehicle traffic at a crossing, etc.) and are noted in the timetable, and may also result in a more permanent sign trackside.

On CN and its derivavtives, the normal speed limit for a stretch of track (track speed) is noted on a diamond-shaped sign with freight train speed at the top, and passenger train speed beneath.

Hope this sheds a little light, Mookster!

B-Dubya -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Inside every GE is an Alco trying to get out...apparently, through the exhaust stack!

Reply

BentnoseWillie

Member since
January 2002
From: Nova Scotia
825 posts

Posted by BentnoseWillie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 8:41 AM

1) At most crossings, there's a small control box mounted on the outside of the relay "bungalow" that issecured with a switch lock. The engineer or conductor can open this with their switch key and raise the crossing gates by pushing a button, then lower them again and lock up the box again.

2) It's a milepost, used to indicate location. Railroads are divided into divisions and subdivisions, and the location is given in terms of the mileage from end of track or the junction to the next subdivision. In this case, you were 0.94 miles from the end of the subdivision, be it end of rail or the next subdivision.

At the dividing point, the milepost should have different mileages on each side - mile X of subdivision A and mile 0 of sudivision B.

3) That sounds like a permanent speed restriction. This is a permanent "slow zone" where trains are restricted to a lower speed than the normal limit ("track speed"). Temporary speed restrictions are put in place for various problems with the track (drainage, crossing maintenance, etc.), and are usually noted in operating bulletins issued by the dispatcher and by flags erected at trackside. Permanent restrictions are put in for long-term causes (lightly-built bridge or swing bridge, heavy vehicle traffic at a crossing, etc.) and are noted in the timetable, and may also result in a more permanent sign trackside.

On CN and its derivavtives, the normal speed limit for a stretch of track (track speed) is noted on a diamond-shaped sign with freight train speed at the top, and passenger train speed beneath.

Hope this sheds a little light, Mookster!

B-Dubya -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Inside every GE is an Alco trying to get out...apparently, through the exhaust stack!

Reply

Mookie

Member since
June 2001
From: US
13,488 posts

Mookie-whys.....

Posted by Mookie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 7:45 AM

Been scribbling like mad and have a few:

Engine gets close enough to crossing to activate the gates and lights. Engineer can turn them off. How?

Saw a sign post that read 0.94. Means what?

Read in article that the railroads have permanent speed signs. Really!

Tell me more!

Later

Mookie

She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw

Reply

Mookie

Member since
June 2001
From: US
13,488 posts

Mookie-whys.....

Posted by Mookie on Wednesday, August 20, 2003 7:45 AM

Been scribbling like mad and have a few:

Engine gets close enough to crossing to activate the gates and lights. Engineer can turn them off. How?

Saw a sign post that read 0.94. Means what?

Read in article that the railroads have permanent speed signs. Really!

Tell me more!

Later

Mookie

She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw

Reply

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