QUOTE: Originally posted by dharmon QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz I just read the link that dblstack placed in his post. I quote from the article here: "Officials said it appeared that the fifth car of the 12-car train hit the bridge. The back end of the car was broken off and the fourth car veered off the rails and rolled onto its side, while three other cars jackknifed farther up the line. The lead locomotive remained on the tracks, and the driver apparently was unaware of the disaster. It came to a stop only after the station master at Eschede activated an emergency brake." Is it just me, or does anyone else notice something odd about the chain of events listed here?? Ummm......I guess it kinda seems odd that the sudden loss of air pressure didn't trigger a mild reaction of .... say brakes, maybe they need to put Ed's mirror on it so they can periodically check and see if the rest of the consist is still there.
QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz I just read the link that dblstack placed in his post. I quote from the article here: "Officials said it appeared that the fifth car of the 12-car train hit the bridge. The back end of the car was broken off and the fourth car veered off the rails and rolled onto its side, while three other cars jackknifed farther up the line. The lead locomotive remained on the tracks, and the driver apparently was unaware of the disaster. It came to a stop only after the station master at Eschede activated an emergency brake." Is it just me, or does anyone else notice something odd about the chain of events listed here??
Originally posted by zardoz In the Trains Magazine news wire for Friday 7-31, there was an article about how a British Rail Eurostar train hit 208 mph in a test run. The article goes on to mention that the French TGV has reached 300 mph, and that Japanese Shinkansen has hit 345 mph in speed tests! 345! Eem,, I think the problem is that the news wire may have confuse miles per hour with kilometers per hour,because Europe and Japan use the Metric system where a kilometre is only 5/8ths of a mile, so sure it seems fast. Generally a lurker by natureBe AlertThe world needs more lerts.It's the 3rd rail that makes the difference. Reply Hugh Jampton Member sinceSeptember 2003 From: Southern Region now, UK 820 posts Posted by Hugh Jampton on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 12:12 PM Originally posted by zardoz In the Trains Magazine news wire for Friday 7-31, there was an article about how a British Rail Eurostar train hit 208 mph in a test run. The article goes on to mention that the French TGV has reached 300 mph, and that Japanese Shinkansen has hit 345 mph in speed tests! 345! Eem,, I think the problem is that the news wire may have confuse miles per hour with kilometers per hour,because Europe and Japan use the Metric system where a kilometre is only 5/8ths of a mile, so sure it seems fast. Generally a lurker by natureBe AlertThe world needs more lerts.It's the 3rd rail that makes the difference. Reply daveklepper Member sinceJune 2002 20,096 posts Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 7:46 AM There is a better design for a track structure. It consists of a continous upside down "pi" of very hard steel, with a precoated standard rail in very hard neoprene wedged into the upside down pi, with a space on both sides of the rail to the flange on each side of one wheel wideth. The flanges acting as continuous guard rails. The wide base of the upside-down pi provides the support needed, off the ballast, and instead of wood ties, there are steel rods keeping the "pi"s properly spaced for guage. A track structure that is both resilient and rigid enough to prevent sunkinks, and very very safe at high speed. Dave PS Possibly that is where the money being used for fuel cell Hydrogen research should really go. Reply daveklepper Member sinceJune 2002 20,096 posts Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 7:46 AM There is a better design for a track structure. It consists of a continous upside down "pi" of very hard steel, with a precoated standard rail in very hard neoprene wedged into the upside down pi, with a space on both sides of the rail to the flange on each side of one wheel wideth. The flanges acting as continuous guard rails. The wide base of the upside-down pi provides the support needed, off the ballast, and instead of wood ties, there are steel rods keeping the "pi"s properly spaced for guage. A track structure that is both resilient and rigid enough to prevent sunkinks, and very very safe at high speed. Dave PS Possibly that is where the money being used for fuel cell Hydrogen research should really go. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 2:47 AM I live only one kilometer away from the 2002 opened highspeed line from Frankfurt to Cologne. It´s very impressive when such an ICE3 passes the Limburg station with 300 kilometers per hour. At our two other highspeedlines, Wuerzburg - Hannover and Mannheim - Stuttgart the maximum speed is 280 km/h. At the new line the roadbed is complete concrete! And the latest news that I had heard is that the test ICE, the ICE/S, made a run with more than 360 km/h there at one early morning (3 pm!!!) I had the luck to become cabrides from Frankfurt to Muenster with an ICE3 - over the complete line from Frankfurt to Cologne, and from Frankfurt to Hamburg. There the used ICE1, uses the line to Hannover, the train enters this line at Fulda, about 99 kilometers in the north of Wuerzburg. This rides are very impressive. I remember that the ICE3 ran a maximum speed of 302.4 km/h! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 2:47 AM I live only one kilometer away from the 2002 opened highspeed line from Frankfurt to Cologne. It´s very impressive when such an ICE3 passes the Limburg station with 300 kilometers per hour. At our two other highspeedlines, Wuerzburg - Hannover and Mannheim - Stuttgart the maximum speed is 280 km/h. At the new line the roadbed is complete concrete! And the latest news that I had heard is that the test ICE, the ICE/S, made a run with more than 360 km/h there at one early morning (3 pm!!!) I had the luck to become cabrides from Frankfurt to Muenster with an ICE3 - over the complete line from Frankfurt to Cologne, and from Frankfurt to Hamburg. There the used ICE1, uses the line to Hannover, the train enters this line at Fulda, about 99 kilometers in the north of Wuerzburg. This rides are very impressive. I remember that the ICE3 ran a maximum speed of 302.4 km/h! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 9:40 PM The German ICE Train did suffer at least one catastrophic derailment at high speed. The derailment occurred just short of an overpass and the train basically pilled up against the piers of the overpass. See: http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/europe/9806/04/germany.train/ or Google Search "German ICE Train derailment. The train was traveling at about 200 Kmph when its believed a wheel broke. About 100 died and 88 additional were injured. This happened near Hanover, in North Central Germany. Last year I hosted an exchange student from Germany who lived near Hanover and we had talked about this. He said that in spite of this, ridership is still very strong, given that it was an isolated incident. He said that he found their rail system overall to be pretty convenient. HERE'S THE BIG KICKER that I don't think anyone mentioned above. In Germany, gasoline is about $2.50 euros per liter. ie.. approx $8.00 US / gallon. How much would you drive your car if gas cost that much in the US? What do you think the govt does with the revenue that they raise? Perhaps transportation projects like high-speed rail. I think many U.S. citizens want the perks of this, but don't want to pay for it. There is also a big difference in the US in terms of population and Geography. Germany is approx 2.5 times the size of my home state (Wisconsin), but has nearly 10 times the population. That changes the mass transit dynamic tremendously. I guess its all got to be viewd in context. It is ironic how much money is poured into government built and funded airports, highways, canals and ports .... but when it comes to a rail project, there is a VERY jaundiced eye turned toward it. Maybe there still some stigma from the land grants given by the govt to RR's in the past and the abuses that happened there. Who knows. Maybe its just an generally un-educated public who doesn't understand the potential of passenger rail and that virtually every other form of transportation that they use is REALLY publicly funded underneath it all. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 9:40 PM The German ICE Train did suffer at least one catastrophic derailment at high speed. The derailment occurred just short of an overpass and the train basically pilled up against the piers of the overpass. See: http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/europe/9806/04/germany.train/ or Google Search "German ICE Train derailment. The train was traveling at about 200 Kmph when its believed a wheel broke. About 100 died and 88 additional were injured. This happened near Hanover, in North Central Germany. Last year I hosted an exchange student from Germany who lived near Hanover and we had talked about this. He said that in spite of this, ridership is still very strong, given that it was an isolated incident. He said that he found their rail system overall to be pretty convenient. HERE'S THE BIG KICKER that I don't think anyone mentioned above. In Germany, gasoline is about $2.50 euros per liter. ie.. approx $8.00 US / gallon. How much would you drive your car if gas cost that much in the US? What do you think the govt does with the revenue that they raise? Perhaps transportation projects like high-speed rail. I think many U.S. citizens want the perks of this, but don't want to pay for it. There is also a big difference in the US in terms of population and Geography. Germany is approx 2.5 times the size of my home state (Wisconsin), but has nearly 10 times the population. That changes the mass transit dynamic tremendously. I guess its all got to be viewd in context. It is ironic how much money is poured into government built and funded airports, highways, canals and ports .... but when it comes to a rail project, there is a VERY jaundiced eye turned toward it. Maybe there still some stigma from the land grants given by the govt to RR's in the past and the abuses that happened there. Who knows. Maybe its just an generally un-educated public who doesn't understand the potential of passenger rail and that virtually every other form of transportation that they use is REALLY publicly funded underneath it all. Reply Edit dehusman Member sinceSeptember 2003 From: Omaha, NE 10,621 posts Posted by dehusman on Monday, January 5, 2004 7:21 PM It would be much easier for a passenger train to hit 345 mph in the US. Since so few people would ride it, it wouldn't have much of a load. 8-) Dave H. Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com Reply dehusman Member sinceSeptember 2003 From: Omaha, NE 10,621 posts Posted by dehusman on Monday, January 5, 2004 7:21 PM It would be much easier for a passenger train to hit 345 mph in the US. Since so few people would ride it, it wouldn't have much of a load. 8-) Dave H. Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com Reply TH&B Member sinceJuly 2003 964 posts Posted by TH&B on Monday, January 5, 2004 7:15 PM Subway train tracks are layed on conrete in tunnels without wooden ties, they don't seem to derail all the time and the train comes by every 2 mins right here in American cities. Reply TH&B Member sinceJuly 2003 964 posts Posted by TH&B on Monday, January 5, 2004 7:15 PM Subway train tracks are layed on conrete in tunnels without wooden ties, they don't seem to derail all the time and the train comes by every 2 mins right here in American cities. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 5:34 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz In the Trains Magazine news wire for Friday 7-31, there was an article about how a British Rail Eurostar train hit 208 mph in a test run. The article goes on to mention that the French TGV has reached 300 mph, and that Japanese Shinkansen has hit 345 mph in speed tests! 345! And here we are in the great and mighty and rich USA getting excited that we may have trains going 110 mph soon. And on our "pride & joy" northeast corridor we hit an breathtaking 150mph, when the trains are not pulling down the catenary that was installed 100 years ago!! I seriously doubt that Japan, France, or England have much more cash available for such projects than the USA. They just have the determination and foresight. [:D] AM i the only one the finds things that are made in Japan, like most toilets, they break very often.. I used to work maintenance, Japaneese toilets were hated among us. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 5:34 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz In the Trains Magazine news wire for Friday 7-31, there was an article about how a British Rail Eurostar train hit 208 mph in a test run. The article goes on to mention that the French TGV has reached 300 mph, and that Japanese Shinkansen has hit 345 mph in speed tests! 345! And here we are in the great and mighty and rich USA getting excited that we may have trains going 110 mph soon. And on our "pride & joy" northeast corridor we hit an breathtaking 150mph, when the trains are not pulling down the catenary that was installed 100 years ago!! I seriously doubt that Japan, France, or England have much more cash available for such projects than the USA. They just have the determination and foresight. [:D] AM i the only one the finds things that are made in Japan, like most toilets, they break very often.. I used to work maintenance, Japaneese toilets were hated among us. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 5:31 PM Henry Ford once tried mounting railroad ties into concrete. That old genius thought he knew more about railroads than railroaders. He built the track into concrete and sent the locomotive on its way...it derailed. He had his technicians rerail the locomotive and the same thing happened again. Setting the rails in concrete completely defeats the purpose of the railroad. Setting the ties in concrete makes the rails rigid. What Henry Ford learned the hard way is that the rails have to be flexible because the axles and the bogies are not flexible. In order for a 4-wheel bogie to round a curve, the rails must spread a bit and then return to their original gauge once the rear axle passes. The vibration of the prime mover and other aspects of the train's motion are absorbed by the ballast in order to prevent the rails from breaking and to give the passengers and freight a smoother ride. A train running on rails set in concrete would have about the same ride quality as a car driving the interstate on rims. There has to be flexibility somewhere, and that flexibility comes from setting the railroad ties in ballast. Revenue service in excess of 200 MPH is possible today. It would require a completely new signal system, and the maintenance bill would be astronomical. Maglev and Aircraft are the only practical means of transportation faster than 200 MPH. The reason for aircraft is obvious...the atmosphere is the flexibility needed to ensure a smooth ride. Maglev has a different system to provide the necessary flexibility or suspension for a smooth ride. Magnetic fields hold the train in midair. The train wraps around the guideway to make derailment impossible. The train does not touch the guideway. The ride is kept smooth by the magnetic fields which support the train. Furthermore, since the train does not touch the guideway, the maintenance bill is extremely low. Incidentally, Siemens and Thyssenkrup (The parent companies for the German "Transrapid" maglev system) have built guideway sections out of concrete, steel, and other materials to test the viability thereof. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 5:31 PM Henry Ford once tried mounting railroad ties into concrete. That old genius thought he knew more about railroads than railroaders. He built the track into concrete and sent the locomotive on its way...it derailed. He had his technicians rerail the locomotive and the same thing happened again. Setting the rails in concrete completely defeats the purpose of the railroad. Setting the ties in concrete makes the rails rigid. What Henry Ford learned the hard way is that the rails have to be flexible because the axles and the bogies are not flexible. In order for a 4-wheel bogie to round a curve, the rails must spread a bit and then return to their original gauge once the rear axle passes. The vibration of the prime mover and other aspects of the train's motion are absorbed by the ballast in order to prevent the rails from breaking and to give the passengers and freight a smoother ride. A train running on rails set in concrete would have about the same ride quality as a car driving the interstate on rims. There has to be flexibility somewhere, and that flexibility comes from setting the railroad ties in ballast. Revenue service in excess of 200 MPH is possible today. It would require a completely new signal system, and the maintenance bill would be astronomical. Maglev and Aircraft are the only practical means of transportation faster than 200 MPH. The reason for aircraft is obvious...the atmosphere is the flexibility needed to ensure a smooth ride. Maglev has a different system to provide the necessary flexibility or suspension for a smooth ride. Magnetic fields hold the train in midair. The train wraps around the guideway to make derailment impossible. The train does not touch the guideway. The ride is kept smooth by the magnetic fields which support the train. Furthermore, since the train does not touch the guideway, the maintenance bill is extremely low. Incidentally, Siemens and Thyssenkrup (The parent companies for the German "Transrapid" maglev system) have built guideway sections out of concrete, steel, and other materials to test the viability thereof. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, August 4, 2003 8:42 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by starwardude If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject. No sweat, all opinions are welcome here[:)][:)] Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, August 4, 2003 8:42 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by starwardude If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject. No sweat, all opinions are welcome here[:)][:)] Reply Edit starwardude Member sinceMay 2003 From: Somewhere in CT, US 75 posts Posted by starwardude on Monday, August 4, 2003 8:21 PM If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject. Long time lurker, poster of little. Reply starwardude Member sinceMay 2003 From: Somewhere in CT, US 75 posts Posted by starwardude on Monday, August 4, 2003 8:21 PM If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject. Long time lurker, poster of little. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, August 4, 2003 6:23 PM As for Amtrak service in Texas, and lack of any improvements by Mr. Gunn. Our great senator, Kay Bailey Hutchinson, a tireless worker for Amtrak on the Transportation committee, sought to get improved service to Texas. As the Texas Eagle was improved to daily service, from trice a week service, the timetables were changed to improve ridership in Texas. Three years later, the timetable looks as if it never changed, still getting into San Antonio after midnight, too late to rent a room at any hotel/motel. She sought to change the route of the Sunset Limited from Cactus Jack territory near Big Bend to Dallas, Abilene, Midland, & Odessa so that there would at least be trice a week service between Houston and Dallas. We are still waiting. She sought to expand the Crescent with a branch from Meridian Mississippi to Dallas thru Jackson and Shreveport similar to what the Southern Railroad did before Amtrak. We are still waiting. Back during the glory days more people rode the train to Dallas than to New Orleans. Oh, well. I guess Amtrak has not realized that Texas is the second largest state in population in the Union..... I can name ONLY two cities of over 5 million in metropolitan population in America 245 miles apart that does not have Amtrak railway service daily. Yep, Dallas and Houston.... But Amtrak did put in a service daily from Oklahoma City and Fort Worth. Sorry Amtrak, you went in the wrong direction.... But Amtrak does run a bus service from Dallas to Houston to catch the Sunset Limited going east to New Orleans, Mobile, Tallahassee, Jacksonville, and Orlando. Catch the Greyhound at 2 am and catch the Sunset Limited in Houston at 6 am..... Or leave Houston at 1 am and get to Dallas at 5 am..... Sorry, most TEXANS sleep during those hours..... Of course, you could go west to El Paso, Tucson, Los Angeles. Pull into San Antonio at 1 am and get switched to the Sunset Limited leaving San Antonio at 7 am. It also works the other way, pull into San Antonio at 3 am and get switched to the Texas Eagle that leaves at 9 am. But there is no swithing of cars going eastbound in San Antonio. You are supposed to take Greyhound after midnight. You can take the train, but the station is closed. If it rains, there is no cover. Of course, you'll get no sleep that night, being on the east side of downtown San Antonio in the warehouse district.... Then there is the slow track. Amtrak averages less than 30 mph from Dallas to San Antonio and vice a versa. Too slow for most.... I hate to admit it, but you actually hope the Sunset Limited is so late pulling into San Antonio, it misses the Eagle and Amtrak buses you home to Dallas..... NOT ANYWHERE NEAR GOOD ENOUGH FOR A STATE WITH OVER 22 MILLION IN POPULATION, WHICH IS EXPECTED TO DOUBLE IN THE NEXT 25 YEARS TO 50 MILLION! There is no border..... Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Originally posted by zardoz In the Trains Magazine news wire for Friday 7-31, there was an article about how a British Rail Eurostar train hit 208 mph in a test run. The article goes on to mention that the French TGV has reached 300 mph, and that Japanese Shinkansen has hit 345 mph in speed tests! 345! Eem,, I think the problem is that the news wire may have confuse miles per hour with kilometers per hour,because Europe and Japan use the Metric system where a kilometre is only 5/8ths of a mile, so sure it seems fast. Generally a lurker by natureBe AlertThe world needs more lerts.It's the 3rd rail that makes the difference. Reply daveklepper Member sinceJune 2002 20,096 posts Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 7:46 AM There is a better design for a track structure. It consists of a continous upside down "pi" of very hard steel, with a precoated standard rail in very hard neoprene wedged into the upside down pi, with a space on both sides of the rail to the flange on each side of one wheel wideth. The flanges acting as continuous guard rails. The wide base of the upside-down pi provides the support needed, off the ballast, and instead of wood ties, there are steel rods keeping the "pi"s properly spaced for guage. A track structure that is both resilient and rigid enough to prevent sunkinks, and very very safe at high speed. Dave PS Possibly that is where the money being used for fuel cell Hydrogen research should really go. Reply daveklepper Member sinceJune 2002 20,096 posts Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 7:46 AM There is a better design for a track structure. It consists of a continous upside down "pi" of very hard steel, with a precoated standard rail in very hard neoprene wedged into the upside down pi, with a space on both sides of the rail to the flange on each side of one wheel wideth. The flanges acting as continuous guard rails. The wide base of the upside-down pi provides the support needed, off the ballast, and instead of wood ties, there are steel rods keeping the "pi"s properly spaced for guage. A track structure that is both resilient and rigid enough to prevent sunkinks, and very very safe at high speed. Dave PS Possibly that is where the money being used for fuel cell Hydrogen research should really go. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 2:47 AM I live only one kilometer away from the 2002 opened highspeed line from Frankfurt to Cologne. It´s very impressive when such an ICE3 passes the Limburg station with 300 kilometers per hour. At our two other highspeedlines, Wuerzburg - Hannover and Mannheim - Stuttgart the maximum speed is 280 km/h. At the new line the roadbed is complete concrete! And the latest news that I had heard is that the test ICE, the ICE/S, made a run with more than 360 km/h there at one early morning (3 pm!!!) I had the luck to become cabrides from Frankfurt to Muenster with an ICE3 - over the complete line from Frankfurt to Cologne, and from Frankfurt to Hamburg. There the used ICE1, uses the line to Hannover, the train enters this line at Fulda, about 99 kilometers in the north of Wuerzburg. This rides are very impressive. I remember that the ICE3 ran a maximum speed of 302.4 km/h! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, January 6, 2004 2:47 AM I live only one kilometer away from the 2002 opened highspeed line from Frankfurt to Cologne. It´s very impressive when such an ICE3 passes the Limburg station with 300 kilometers per hour. At our two other highspeedlines, Wuerzburg - Hannover and Mannheim - Stuttgart the maximum speed is 280 km/h. At the new line the roadbed is complete concrete! And the latest news that I had heard is that the test ICE, the ICE/S, made a run with more than 360 km/h there at one early morning (3 pm!!!) I had the luck to become cabrides from Frankfurt to Muenster with an ICE3 - over the complete line from Frankfurt to Cologne, and from Frankfurt to Hamburg. There the used ICE1, uses the line to Hannover, the train enters this line at Fulda, about 99 kilometers in the north of Wuerzburg. This rides are very impressive. I remember that the ICE3 ran a maximum speed of 302.4 km/h! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 9:40 PM The German ICE Train did suffer at least one catastrophic derailment at high speed. The derailment occurred just short of an overpass and the train basically pilled up against the piers of the overpass. See: http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/europe/9806/04/germany.train/ or Google Search "German ICE Train derailment. The train was traveling at about 200 Kmph when its believed a wheel broke. About 100 died and 88 additional were injured. This happened near Hanover, in North Central Germany. Last year I hosted an exchange student from Germany who lived near Hanover and we had talked about this. He said that in spite of this, ridership is still very strong, given that it was an isolated incident. He said that he found their rail system overall to be pretty convenient. HERE'S THE BIG KICKER that I don't think anyone mentioned above. In Germany, gasoline is about $2.50 euros per liter. ie.. approx $8.00 US / gallon. How much would you drive your car if gas cost that much in the US? What do you think the govt does with the revenue that they raise? Perhaps transportation projects like high-speed rail. I think many U.S. citizens want the perks of this, but don't want to pay for it. There is also a big difference in the US in terms of population and Geography. Germany is approx 2.5 times the size of my home state (Wisconsin), but has nearly 10 times the population. That changes the mass transit dynamic tremendously. I guess its all got to be viewd in context. It is ironic how much money is poured into government built and funded airports, highways, canals and ports .... but when it comes to a rail project, there is a VERY jaundiced eye turned toward it. Maybe there still some stigma from the land grants given by the govt to RR's in the past and the abuses that happened there. Who knows. Maybe its just an generally un-educated public who doesn't understand the potential of passenger rail and that virtually every other form of transportation that they use is REALLY publicly funded underneath it all. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 9:40 PM The German ICE Train did suffer at least one catastrophic derailment at high speed. The derailment occurred just short of an overpass and the train basically pilled up against the piers of the overpass. See: http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/europe/9806/04/germany.train/ or Google Search "German ICE Train derailment. The train was traveling at about 200 Kmph when its believed a wheel broke. About 100 died and 88 additional were injured. This happened near Hanover, in North Central Germany. Last year I hosted an exchange student from Germany who lived near Hanover and we had talked about this. He said that in spite of this, ridership is still very strong, given that it was an isolated incident. He said that he found their rail system overall to be pretty convenient. HERE'S THE BIG KICKER that I don't think anyone mentioned above. In Germany, gasoline is about $2.50 euros per liter. ie.. approx $8.00 US / gallon. How much would you drive your car if gas cost that much in the US? What do you think the govt does with the revenue that they raise? Perhaps transportation projects like high-speed rail. I think many U.S. citizens want the perks of this, but don't want to pay for it. There is also a big difference in the US in terms of population and Geography. Germany is approx 2.5 times the size of my home state (Wisconsin), but has nearly 10 times the population. That changes the mass transit dynamic tremendously. I guess its all got to be viewd in context. It is ironic how much money is poured into government built and funded airports, highways, canals and ports .... but when it comes to a rail project, there is a VERY jaundiced eye turned toward it. Maybe there still some stigma from the land grants given by the govt to RR's in the past and the abuses that happened there. Who knows. Maybe its just an generally un-educated public who doesn't understand the potential of passenger rail and that virtually every other form of transportation that they use is REALLY publicly funded underneath it all. Reply Edit dehusman Member sinceSeptember 2003 From: Omaha, NE 10,621 posts Posted by dehusman on Monday, January 5, 2004 7:21 PM It would be much easier for a passenger train to hit 345 mph in the US. Since so few people would ride it, it wouldn't have much of a load. 8-) Dave H. Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com Reply dehusman Member sinceSeptember 2003 From: Omaha, NE 10,621 posts Posted by dehusman on Monday, January 5, 2004 7:21 PM It would be much easier for a passenger train to hit 345 mph in the US. Since so few people would ride it, it wouldn't have much of a load. 8-) Dave H. Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com Reply TH&B Member sinceJuly 2003 964 posts Posted by TH&B on Monday, January 5, 2004 7:15 PM Subway train tracks are layed on conrete in tunnels without wooden ties, they don't seem to derail all the time and the train comes by every 2 mins right here in American cities. Reply TH&B Member sinceJuly 2003 964 posts Posted by TH&B on Monday, January 5, 2004 7:15 PM Subway train tracks are layed on conrete in tunnels without wooden ties, they don't seem to derail all the time and the train comes by every 2 mins right here in American cities. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 5:34 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz In the Trains Magazine news wire for Friday 7-31, there was an article about how a British Rail Eurostar train hit 208 mph in a test run. The article goes on to mention that the French TGV has reached 300 mph, and that Japanese Shinkansen has hit 345 mph in speed tests! 345! And here we are in the great and mighty and rich USA getting excited that we may have trains going 110 mph soon. And on our "pride & joy" northeast corridor we hit an breathtaking 150mph, when the trains are not pulling down the catenary that was installed 100 years ago!! I seriously doubt that Japan, France, or England have much more cash available for such projects than the USA. They just have the determination and foresight. [:D] AM i the only one the finds things that are made in Japan, like most toilets, they break very often.. I used to work maintenance, Japaneese toilets were hated among us. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 5:34 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz In the Trains Magazine news wire for Friday 7-31, there was an article about how a British Rail Eurostar train hit 208 mph in a test run. The article goes on to mention that the French TGV has reached 300 mph, and that Japanese Shinkansen has hit 345 mph in speed tests! 345! And here we are in the great and mighty and rich USA getting excited that we may have trains going 110 mph soon. And on our "pride & joy" northeast corridor we hit an breathtaking 150mph, when the trains are not pulling down the catenary that was installed 100 years ago!! I seriously doubt that Japan, France, or England have much more cash available for such projects than the USA. They just have the determination and foresight. [:D] AM i the only one the finds things that are made in Japan, like most toilets, they break very often.. I used to work maintenance, Japaneese toilets were hated among us. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 5:31 PM Henry Ford once tried mounting railroad ties into concrete. That old genius thought he knew more about railroads than railroaders. He built the track into concrete and sent the locomotive on its way...it derailed. He had his technicians rerail the locomotive and the same thing happened again. Setting the rails in concrete completely defeats the purpose of the railroad. Setting the ties in concrete makes the rails rigid. What Henry Ford learned the hard way is that the rails have to be flexible because the axles and the bogies are not flexible. In order for a 4-wheel bogie to round a curve, the rails must spread a bit and then return to their original gauge once the rear axle passes. The vibration of the prime mover and other aspects of the train's motion are absorbed by the ballast in order to prevent the rails from breaking and to give the passengers and freight a smoother ride. A train running on rails set in concrete would have about the same ride quality as a car driving the interstate on rims. There has to be flexibility somewhere, and that flexibility comes from setting the railroad ties in ballast. Revenue service in excess of 200 MPH is possible today. It would require a completely new signal system, and the maintenance bill would be astronomical. Maglev and Aircraft are the only practical means of transportation faster than 200 MPH. The reason for aircraft is obvious...the atmosphere is the flexibility needed to ensure a smooth ride. Maglev has a different system to provide the necessary flexibility or suspension for a smooth ride. Magnetic fields hold the train in midair. The train wraps around the guideway to make derailment impossible. The train does not touch the guideway. The ride is kept smooth by the magnetic fields which support the train. Furthermore, since the train does not touch the guideway, the maintenance bill is extremely low. Incidentally, Siemens and Thyssenkrup (The parent companies for the German "Transrapid" maglev system) have built guideway sections out of concrete, steel, and other materials to test the viability thereof. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 5, 2004 5:31 PM Henry Ford once tried mounting railroad ties into concrete. That old genius thought he knew more about railroads than railroaders. He built the track into concrete and sent the locomotive on its way...it derailed. He had his technicians rerail the locomotive and the same thing happened again. Setting the rails in concrete completely defeats the purpose of the railroad. Setting the ties in concrete makes the rails rigid. What Henry Ford learned the hard way is that the rails have to be flexible because the axles and the bogies are not flexible. In order for a 4-wheel bogie to round a curve, the rails must spread a bit and then return to their original gauge once the rear axle passes. The vibration of the prime mover and other aspects of the train's motion are absorbed by the ballast in order to prevent the rails from breaking and to give the passengers and freight a smoother ride. A train running on rails set in concrete would have about the same ride quality as a car driving the interstate on rims. There has to be flexibility somewhere, and that flexibility comes from setting the railroad ties in ballast. Revenue service in excess of 200 MPH is possible today. It would require a completely new signal system, and the maintenance bill would be astronomical. Maglev and Aircraft are the only practical means of transportation faster than 200 MPH. The reason for aircraft is obvious...the atmosphere is the flexibility needed to ensure a smooth ride. Maglev has a different system to provide the necessary flexibility or suspension for a smooth ride. Magnetic fields hold the train in midair. The train wraps around the guideway to make derailment impossible. The train does not touch the guideway. The ride is kept smooth by the magnetic fields which support the train. Furthermore, since the train does not touch the guideway, the maintenance bill is extremely low. Incidentally, Siemens and Thyssenkrup (The parent companies for the German "Transrapid" maglev system) have built guideway sections out of concrete, steel, and other materials to test the viability thereof. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, August 4, 2003 8:42 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by starwardude If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject. No sweat, all opinions are welcome here[:)][:)] Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, August 4, 2003 8:42 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by starwardude If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject. No sweat, all opinions are welcome here[:)][:)] Reply Edit starwardude Member sinceMay 2003 From: Somewhere in CT, US 75 posts Posted by starwardude on Monday, August 4, 2003 8:21 PM If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject. Long time lurker, poster of little. Reply starwardude Member sinceMay 2003 From: Somewhere in CT, US 75 posts Posted by starwardude on Monday, August 4, 2003 8:21 PM If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject. Long time lurker, poster of little. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, August 4, 2003 6:23 PM As for Amtrak service in Texas, and lack of any improvements by Mr. Gunn. Our great senator, Kay Bailey Hutchinson, a tireless worker for Amtrak on the Transportation committee, sought to get improved service to Texas. As the Texas Eagle was improved to daily service, from trice a week service, the timetables were changed to improve ridership in Texas. Three years later, the timetable looks as if it never changed, still getting into San Antonio after midnight, too late to rent a room at any hotel/motel. She sought to change the route of the Sunset Limited from Cactus Jack territory near Big Bend to Dallas, Abilene, Midland, & Odessa so that there would at least be trice a week service between Houston and Dallas. We are still waiting. She sought to expand the Crescent with a branch from Meridian Mississippi to Dallas thru Jackson and Shreveport similar to what the Southern Railroad did before Amtrak. We are still waiting. Back during the glory days more people rode the train to Dallas than to New Orleans. Oh, well. I guess Amtrak has not realized that Texas is the second largest state in population in the Union..... I can name ONLY two cities of over 5 million in metropolitan population in America 245 miles apart that does not have Amtrak railway service daily. Yep, Dallas and Houston.... But Amtrak did put in a service daily from Oklahoma City and Fort Worth. Sorry Amtrak, you went in the wrong direction.... But Amtrak does run a bus service from Dallas to Houston to catch the Sunset Limited going east to New Orleans, Mobile, Tallahassee, Jacksonville, and Orlando. Catch the Greyhound at 2 am and catch the Sunset Limited in Houston at 6 am..... Or leave Houston at 1 am and get to Dallas at 5 am..... Sorry, most TEXANS sleep during those hours..... Of course, you could go west to El Paso, Tucson, Los Angeles. Pull into San Antonio at 1 am and get switched to the Sunset Limited leaving San Antonio at 7 am. It also works the other way, pull into San Antonio at 3 am and get switched to the Texas Eagle that leaves at 9 am. But there is no swithing of cars going eastbound in San Antonio. You are supposed to take Greyhound after midnight. You can take the train, but the station is closed. If it rains, there is no cover. Of course, you'll get no sleep that night, being on the east side of downtown San Antonio in the warehouse district.... Then there is the slow track. Amtrak averages less than 30 mph from Dallas to San Antonio and vice a versa. Too slow for most.... I hate to admit it, but you actually hope the Sunset Limited is so late pulling into San Antonio, it misses the Eagle and Amtrak buses you home to Dallas..... NOT ANYWHERE NEAR GOOD ENOUGH FOR A STATE WITH OVER 22 MILLION IN POPULATION, WHICH IS EXPECTED TO DOUBLE IN THE NEXT 25 YEARS TO 50 MILLION! There is no border..... Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz In the Trains Magazine news wire for Friday 7-31, there was an article about how a British Rail Eurostar train hit 208 mph in a test run. The article goes on to mention that the French TGV has reached 300 mph, and that Japanese Shinkansen has hit 345 mph in speed tests! 345! And here we are in the great and mighty and rich USA getting excited that we may have trains going 110 mph soon. And on our "pride & joy" northeast corridor we hit an breathtaking 150mph, when the trains are not pulling down the catenary that was installed 100 years ago!! I seriously doubt that Japan, France, or England have much more cash available for such projects than the USA. They just have the determination and foresight.
QUOTE: Originally posted by starwardude If anyone here,who I think there is, lives near railroad tracks, You'll Know what I mean. I live about 1 Mile from a freight yard, and a mile from a 4-track mainline used by Amtrak, CSX, and Metro North RR. It would be pretty dumb to redo a 4 track bridge so that ALL New York - bound trains would go up along the Housatonic, west to Danbury,then back south and probably end up in Norwalk when you want to go to Bridgeport. If you're wondering, I live in Stratford. I'm just saying that.This Probably isn't even related to the posted subject.
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