Required reading

[Mookie]

If I don't phrase it that way, no one will read this! Saw what looked to me like an SW10 switcher today - but since I still can't identify everything I see, I look on the plate near the front. Nothing there but an F. Help?

Jen

[Anonymous]

Where was it? If it is at a grain elevator or other private firm you can look it up in the "Comprehensive Guide to Industrial Locomotives". It is a SW-10 if it looks like a older switcher with two radiator fans on top of the hood. There is also no radiator guard on the front of the unit.

[mudchicken]

(1) Been exposed to a diesel spotter's guide?

(2) Still have a builder's plate on the frame under the engineer's window?

(3) If it's an EMD unit, is the frame number visible? (stamped INTO the frame in 3/4" letters on the engineers side front corner and the diagonally opposite side) If you can get the frame number, you can trace the engine's pedigree.

(4) If you cannot get close enough for (2) or (3), whose colors and what road number.

BNSF has had some of its mongrel end cab switchers working NW of you at Sioux City. One of them? Or does it have a large raised radiator at the end of the long hood (not the cab end)...

-mudchicken

[mudchicken]

(required reading for you Nebraskans is Steven Ambrose's "Nothing like It In The World")

[edblysard]

Hi jenny,
Unless it was painted armour yellow and gray, it wasnt a SW10. EMD never made the SW10, it was a homemade project of UP, they rebuilt their older fleet of SW7s, SW9s, and their TR5 cow/calf combos into the SW10. No one else had them, although some, when retired off the UP roster, were sold to industries and private switchers. Most were scrapped after the SP/UP merger.
Odds are you will never find the builders plate on a old switcher, if it is still on the locomotive, it buried under layers of paint, but most were attached to the frame proper, hard to see, unless your head is under the side sill.
Odds are what you saw was either a MP15, or its predecessor, the SW1500, they look a lot alike. A SW10 has no radiator grill on the front, instead, the rad is on the top of the nose, laying flat, with two cooling fans from a GP7 or GP9 on the top. Where a radiator is normaly, there is a huge sandbox, and the entire nose of the SW10 is taller that other switchers, with vents in the sides up near the top. It "bumps up" at the front.
Sent you some photos of both a SW10, and a MP15.
You will notice the difference right off the bat. If you ever see one in real life, you wont forget it.
And I know you know what the F on the front is for, it siginifies the front of the locomotive.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Mookie]

Will have to go look it up and see - but the title sounds just like Nebraska! :)

Jen

[Mookie]

Ok - I checked my resources - that 2nd pair of eyes. We have what we call a "fish engine" here -
my driver says it sounds just like fish monger's horn. It is Pumpkin and Green and is marked SW10 on the side, just like the SD70's and the Dash 9's.

This one had no markings, will try to get a # off it. You are right - it has a lot of paint on it. We have at least two switchers with "fin" radiators right down the front panel. I have seen those fins move. They haul lots of boxcars around the city.

But in looking thru my books (got 2 more from bookstore) a lot of the engines are marked with just an F - right on the front. Saw an old "covered wagon" with this F marking. This one was on the conductors (left) side - only marking on it that was readable.

If this was to mark the front of the engine, I wouldn't let that get out into the public - imagine a railroader not knowing which end of his horse to get on. Ok - bad joke. Why did they feel it necessary to mark the front of the engine?

Jen

[edblysard]

Hi Jen,
When the railroads started the transition from steam, which runs with the long boiler in front, and the cab at the rear, to the road diesels, like the GP7 and GP9, which run with the long hood to the rear, they marked the front of the locomotive to identify which way it was designed to be run, although it make no difference in performance, they work just as well both ways. Some roads, like NS, ran their diesels with the long hood forward, and you still see a couple of them around. Note the motors we use, if you didnt know better, most would guess that like other switchers, the long hood is the front. It isnt, so we have a F on the sill next to the steps.And the reason the long hood is forward on switchers is because most switching moves are shoves, your pushing the cars ahead of the motor, not dragging them behind it.
It also offers some extra protection for the engineer, if he does get run into something, he has all of the engine and such between him and whatever he hit.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Mookie]

Want to go home and mull that one over. I saw one of the early diesels (Dad called them covered wagons) and it has a big F printed right at the very front corner, on the side. Surely the front would be very obvious, since that is where the cab was! The other I can understand. It will be awhile before I get that close again - we are parking under a highway overpass where it is shady and not right up close and personal where we usually park! Will go home and look in my picture books again!

Thanx

Jen

[Anonymous]

Jenny, there were locomotives that had control stands on both sides facing opposite directions. The NP also bought some SD9s that actually were built so the long end was the front. Because directions for movement are many times given as either "ahead" or "back" there had to be a unambiguous way of determine direction. While it is not a real problem with modern locomotives, it is probably a FRA requirement. Besides there are still some of the old locomotives left.

[Mookie]

The light dawns!!!! Thanx Pfrench! Now I understand! I am on the ground wondering why you would not know and the rest of the world is in the cab, knowing why.....

:)

Jen

[Anonymous]

Jen, those vertical fins that you are talking about are shutters for the radiator. They control airflow to help control coolant temp. The "F," deal is very important. The older NS units ran long hood forward. If you give the hogger the lantern or radio command to back up, he will move the engine backward (opposite the F) and if you give him the ahead, just the opposite.
Ken

[Anonymous]

Jen, these guys know their engines better than I do (mainly cause I don't care, as long as the toilet don't stink), but I have seen the units that you are talking about. I seen them in Lincoln and now I see one in Springfield. Ed says that they are some sort of oddball. He is probably right, I don't know. But they are repaints and are marked sw10. Your eyes aren't deceiving you.
Ken

[edblysard]

Hi Ken,
Re read my UP retired roster list, seems they didnt scrap all of their SW10s, they sold to leaseing companies and a few private industries, a totla of 11 SW10s.
If what your seeing looks like someone took the rear of a GP9, and grafted it to the nose of a SW9, then you looking at a ex-UP SW10.
It is possible that a shop somewhere remotored or re wired old SW9s, and classed them SW10s, but I havent heard of it. (which isnt saying all that much)
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Jackflash]

The small letter "F" is a federal requirment
its in the CFR, they dont care what end its painted on but it must be painted on one end or
the other. jackflash

[Mookie]

Bless you Ken - I saw one parked about 25 feet from my nose - it was switching and "pausing" and marked SW10. The more I thought about it, I bet I could find one out around the old Havelock Shops! The underpass has tracks over it and there is usually one oldie parked just beyond the overpass. Now I have to make a trip out there and see.

Jen

[Mookie]

Well, I think I have figured out the F. And it wasn't just for people like me to know where the front of the engine is!

I saw those fins open and close as the little switcher was backing up and going forward. We kind of figured they were radiator air flow. Now I need to get a number to go with the radiator so we, correction, I know what I am looking at!

Jen

[Anonymous]

Jen,
they're are so many old switchers running around it's hard to keep track.
marty