RAIL GRINDING

[louisnash]

I saw CSX grinding their rails not to long ago. What actually does this do?
I thought maybe to just clean the surface of the rail.
Any replies are very much appreciated.

Brian (KY)

[edblysard]

Brian,
Its to reshaped the railhead back to round, or crowned. Even though the rail is made from very strong steel, the ball, or head, gets misshappen, most often, but no always, on a curve. The weight of the trains combined with centrifugal force literaly pushes the steel to the sides. As a example, on a curve that goes from the upper left of your screen to the lower right, with trains moving from either direction, the outside of the righthand rail will have a sharp edge or overhang created by the wheels pushing the steel of the railhead to the right, and the inside of the left rail will show the same results. The inside of the right hand rail will also show a lot of wear from the wheel flanges, up to and including a groove cut into the railhead.
If left unchecked on a busy mainline, the wear can become so bad that wheel flanges can ride up and over the rail because the groove can become so pronounced that it can fail, and allow the flange to slide up and over the edge.
I work in a yard, and we have 135 lb rail on our leads. Because of the constant use the lead receives, we have it ground appox once a year. The outer edge can become so sharp it is almost a razor edge, and can easily cut through your work boot and pants. The last time we ground the railhead, the top of the rail was as wide as my hand is long, about 6", and the surface was almost flat, no ball, or crown to speak of. The ball, or crown, allows some free play in the wheels from side to side, if it wasnt there, the flanges would bind on a curve. We did that to it in 14 months of 24 hour a day switching.
Note too that the wheel surface is not flat, or 90 degrees to the flange, but instead, taper in slightly from the flange(inside) to the outside,
the inside dia being slightly bigger, about a 3 degree taper. This not only reduces surface contact and wheel wear, but also allows the wheel to track, or follow the rail easier.
You want a tapered wheel riding on a round railhead to reduce friction.
They will also regrind a track that has several flat spots, often caused by locomotives slipping their wheels, that can cut a dip, or flat spot in the railhead real quick, and on a main line, this presents a problem, due to the wheels of other trains hitting the flat spot, and making it bigger, and hammering the rail to the point it can break, or cause severe stress cracks. Its cheaper to reshape the rail often, as opposed to replacing it.
Stay Frosty,
The Unihead Ed

[louisnash]

Hey Ed,
Thanks for your info. It has been greatly appreciated.
Brian (KY)

[edblysard]

More than welcome, the name of the company we use escapes me right now, I will remember sometime where I dont have access to a computer, but they have an entire train, grinder, shaper and what I think is a raidogram? car all in one. About five cars total, and it make a great sight, sparks shooting out from the sides, but loud as all get out.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[dknelson]

Check the index and your back issues of Trains because about 3 or 4 years ago Trains ran a first rate article about railgrinding trains
I happened to be on the other side of the tracks when the main photo for the article was taken, and I have seen rail grinders in operation about 3 times on the CN, the BNSF and the Soo/CP -- unforunately I have never seen one in action at night when it must be spectacular.
the equipement itself was interesting -- older stuff modified for the purpose.
Interestingly when a train runs over rail that has just been ground it makes a singing or ringing almost a buzzing noise. That goes away as the cross grooves in the rail wear down.
Dave Nelson

[edblysard]

You ought to be riding on the end of a car as it runs down freshly ground rail, it make a buzz, almost like the sound a small propeller driven airplane makes. First time I heard it, I looked around for the plane I was sure was about to crash next to us. It took a few seconds before I realized it was the rail humming.
And yeah, I read the article too, not the same guys we use, but the "train" looked about the same, except the one in Trains was painted blue, our guys were in solid yellow.
And it does make a heck of a light show, at dusk its almost hypnotizing, you cant take your eyes off of it.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[dknelson]

I wondered what it sounded like in the cab. Thanks for the inside info Ed.
I got a going-away shot showing a massive cloud of dirt and dust and bits of metal blowing towards a residential area -- fortunately it was winter and nobody had their laundry out!
The other interesting thing about the railgrinder process is the strange shaped metal it leaves -- the molten remains of the rail edges.
I think the railgrinder I saw on the CN was marked "Speno" but another big name is "Loran" and there are one or two others. I am pretty sure it was Loran that I saw on the Soo/CP here in Milwaukee.
Don't worry about us -- we are staying frosty here in Milwaukee. In fact we are wondering when summer will arrive. Once it gets nice warm -- it's Galesburg (IL) here I come!
Dave Nelson

[louisnash]

Mr. Nelson
I noticed that you said you saw it done in the winter time.
When I say that I saw it done a while ago i actually saw it late last summer. They had a guy on the back of it with a water hose looking for any little fires that may be ignited by the sparks. It was quite a sight during the day and like you and Ed say I bet even more spectacular in the evening.
Thanks Again,
Brian (KY)

[edblysard]

Hi Dave, wasnt in the cab, was riding the end of a tank car, on a shoving move to the Dow plant. It not only sounded weird, but the vibrations in my feet tickled.
And I will trade you weather. Its 96, with a heat index of 107 down here.
Sperry Rail service was the name I lost last night. I always thoug they were just a rail inspection service, but they grind rail also.
And did you get a wiff of the air when they were grinding? Man, never thought steel could stink so bad.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[dknelson]

I think "acrid" is the word for the smell
Steel plants have some of that same odor. I once railfanned Northwestern Steel & Wire in 1980 and the smell was quite present, as was a sort of gray dust everywhere in town
By the way the reason I was railfanning Northwestern Steel and Wire was because their eccentric 96 year old owner insisted on using STEAM LOCOMOTIVES -- and note I said 1980. The day we were there, three ex GTW 0-8-0s (of a total of maybe 12?) were in full steam operation -- and they whistled for every change of direction. Northwestern Steel was where lots of steam locomotives went to die (and become nails). Before the 0-8-0s they had used CB&Q 2-6-2s
Dave Nelson

[Soo2610]

Dave, also enjoyed watching them at Northwestern steel. Unfortunately, they and Northwestern steel are now gone.
Watched a grinding operation on the UP main out here and got a close up look at the equipment when they parked on a siding in town during the day. The night time light show was just fantastic!
I think the name of the company doing the grinding was something like Pandag Jackson. Have been trying to remember the name for the last couple of days. Have some photos around here somewhere if I can put my hands on them.

[dknelson]

Is that Pandrol Jackson?
Dave Nelson

[mudchicken]

Pandrol Jackson now owns SPENO (and a lot of other familiar names....who all seem to be owned by HARSCO)....As the railroads get fewer, so does the number of surviving maintenance tool suppliers.

Nobody mentioned the smoother ride felt in the cab, especially the older GE's....The noise is the reduced truck hunting allowing you to hear the whir of the roller bearings instead of the wheel flange digging into the gage side ball of the rail.

Ed: That rail that started life as 136# rail is now down to 135#? You guys have a just a few flat spots in wheels dragged around in the course of a day??? The roadmaster down there must be going absolutely nuts!

[Anonymous]

Ed is right, it is important to keep the crown shape to the rail for best operations. We had some rail in our bowl actually ground flat. The rail the installed was so crowned that the skates were constantly being kicked off allowing the cars to come out on the lead. After grinding the rail flat, the skates remained under the wheels of the cars.

[edblysard]

Pandrol Jackson, I have seen those guys on the UP main several times. I think they are the same company that makes pandrol clips for fastening rails to steel ties.
Ed

[edblysard]

Ready for a hoot? We have rail dated from 1935 and up in the yard proper, looks almost like new, but the leads get hammered all the time, our main switching lead is on a curve, they swap rail from side to side every six months to even out the wear.
In the yard there are so many compromise joints you couldnt count them all, they replace sections with what ever is on hand. You see main line code rail bolted to something that looks like trolly rail all the time.
Last time I was out a the Cargil elevator, I found a section of rail that was dated 1910, you could just read the word illinois on the side. And they run SD 70s over this stuff all the time. Its a wonder it dosnt just crumble under the weight.
But it aint broke, so they dont fix it.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Anonymous]

When I seen Pandrol Jackson grinding on Wiscinson Central they had quite a managery of cars and engines. I think they built most of there equipment themselves.
TIM A

[edblysard]

Yeah, the one I see down here looks like a european bus mated to a catipiller dump truck, with just about every do-dad they could think of bolted on. You would never think it ran on rauls, looks like some home mede piece of mining equipment.
Ed

[mudchicken]

Now I really feel sorry for the roadmaster & the track gang doing everything with next to nuthin....(must be a really creative at jury-rigging everything to hold it all safely together!)

PS: Speno's locomotives are a combination of new and used/ heavilly modified, at least one of the slugs in the big grinder set is an ex-L&N Alco slug under that red/orange paint.

-mudchicken

[ironhorseman]

The exact issue that article was in TRAINS is November 1998, Vol. 58, No. 11, Pg. 50, "Succeeding at the daily grind: At work with Pandrol Jackson's
RMS-5 and the men who run it" By Jim Zeirke.

It took me forever to find that issue so maybe that will help anyone else who is looking for it.

ironhorseman

[Soo2610]

Yes, it would be. Thanks. At least I had the Jackson part right.

[Soo2610]

Thanks for the right name. Have seen them on the UP twice. Once in West Chicago on the line that runs through Rochelle and out to Clinton, Iowa and Again here in Crystal Lake on the Northwest line that runs out to the Chrysler plant in Belvidere and I believe on up to the GM plant in Janesville. See an awful lot of autoracks and parts cars on this line.