here is a quicky from a book titled the Story of American Railroads published in 1948
Cyrus Kurtz Holliday formed the town of Topeka and thru lobbying got it proclaimed territorial capitol....he went on to plan and charter a RR along the Santa Fe trail in 1859 and named it the Atchison and Topeka RR...he received a 3,000,000 acre land grant and started building toward the Colorado boarder a drought in 1879\80 almost wrecked the RR Thomas Nickerson a banker from Boston stepped in and took over.....he hired one of the great RR men of the 1800's....a man named William Barstow Strong ( yes Barstow ca is named after him)...the RR was reorganized in 1881 as the Atchison Topeka & Santa Fe with Barstow as general Manager...it was he who drove the rails thru DRGW territory and "generaled" the troops thru the Raton Pass war....he also formed the New Mexio & Southern Pacific RR to build ATSF lines into New Mexico and into California as a law in that State (by the instagation of the SP) forbade outside lines from building there...side note...in 1881 the ATSF bought controlling interest in the then new St.Louis and San Fransico RR hoping to use that lines charter to get to CA....but Jay Gould and C.P. Huntington stopped them by secretly buying up most of the preferred stock....the Cotton Belt has been in the Espee family ever since
in 10 years the ATSF under Strong went from just over 2000 miles to 7000
next came 4 to 5 years of mismanagement and corruption that agian almost wrecked the company.....along came Edward R. Ripley who for 24 years ran the ATSF like one inspired and under his direction the road became a 11,000 mile powerhouse .....his biggest contribrution was in his policy of promotion thru the ranks....a lifelong railroader tended to be a better manager to that road....he also introduced a pension and insurance system for all employees.....the ATSF owes its success to a employee morale that was unmatched by most lines of the time.....
and lets not forget Fred Harvey....more later if ya want
BNSF_RAILFAN wrote:How did the ATSF "Santa Fe" get it's name? And how did it come about to become a Great Railroad? Allan.
Check this website link and it may give you some true answers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atchison,_Topeka_and_Santa_Fe_Railway
spbed wrote:Did you do a Google before posting this? I am sure out there on the wb is your answer why the ATSF chose those 3 cities for there corporate name.
Dude, all the replies above become someone else's Google results, and therefore contribute to the base of knowledge available to other inquiring minds. There's nothing wrong with asking a bunch of railfans a railroad question. Google might yield some great facts, but a forum adds the conversational, anecdotal touch
Nothing personal, spbed. It may just be me, but I don't like being referred to Google for my questions
I love to read some of the yarns & rabbit trails other posters take us down. For example, I would never guess Santa Fe's mgt did a 360 on their Ctr policy until you mentioned it
Originally posted by MP173 [ Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply beaulieu Member sinceDecember 2001 From: NW Wisconsin 3,857 posts Posted by beaulieu on Saturday, December 17, 2005 7:32 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by MP173 spbed: Explain your 360 degree comment. thanks, ed Santa Fe was focused on Premium TOFC, they had developed the "Fuel Foiler" lightweight 10-platform articulated flatcar as their primary IM car. All of their hotshots consisted of nothing but these cars. 991, 199, 891, 198, and 971 were solid TOFC "Pigs" no containers, the cars were not designed for it. Santa Fe was the last of the Super Seven to embrace doublestacked containers. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, December 17, 2005 9:05 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by MP173 I think much of it had to be that so many model train sets were Santa Fe. They were America's railroad. ed According to a documentary on the history of Lionel, Santa Fe paid Lionel $6000 to paint some post-war FTs in the warbonnet scheme. Lionel didn't think they would sell very many, but demand quickly wiped out supply and it became Lionel's most popular road name on the F units. Reply Edit MP173 Member sinceMay 2004 From: Valparaiso, In 5,921 posts Posted by MP173 on Saturday, December 17, 2005 7:51 AM spbed: Explain your 360 degree comment. thanks, ed Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Saturday, December 17, 2005 7:31 AM I found this while doing a Goggling of ATSF http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atchison%2C_Topeka_and_Santa_Fe_Railway#Startup_and_initial_growth Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Friday, December 16, 2005 9:40 AM Did you do a Google before posting this? I am sure out there on the wb is your answer why the ATSF chose those 3 cities for there corporate name. They also were not doing so well until the BNRR came knocking on their door. One thing I can tell you for sure from my dealings with the ATSF people is that they did a 360 when it came to hauling steamship line containers. [:)] Originally posted by BNSFrailfan. [ Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, December 16, 2005 7:59 AM Thank you all of you. Now I understand. Allan. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, December 16, 2005 12:39 AM here's a quich history of the Santa Fe ------------------------------- The Santa Fe which formed in 1860 had a modest goal-to connect the Kansas cities of Atchison and Topeka w/ Santa Fe, New Mexico. Construction began in 1868. After the above line was completed the RR built west through Colorado. As a result they were able to tap coal mines and livestock production. It was only natural the RR would target California. The Santa Fe tracks crossed the CA state line in 1883. Los Angeles was reached in 1887. By the end of the 1800's Santa Fe had reached Denver (1882) and Chicago (1888). SF also covered Kansas & Oklahoma with branch lines. Santa Fe reached it's peak in 1931 w/ 13,568 miles of mainline track. For years it was the longest RR in the U.S. Santa Fe was both a sucessful freight & passenger carrier. SF held a reputation of the finest passenger trains in America. (until 1971 when Amtrak took over salect trains) SF pioneered many freight handling methods. In 1976 it built the experimental 6-unit flatcar for carrying freight containers. This method later became the industry standard. In 1960 it was the first RR to carry automobiles on racks attached to flatcars (vs. boxcars). In 1983 SF announced merger plans w/ Southern Pacific. The merge was rejected by the Interstate Commerce Commission in 1986. Between 1985&1995 SF carried more intermodal units (truck trailers and containers on special flatcars) than any other RR. In 1994 there was a surprise announcment that Santa Fe would merge w/ Bulington Noethern. On Sept. 22,1995 they merged forming the largest (at that time) RR in U.S. history: Burlington Northern Santa Fe Reply Edit Jack_S Member sinceDecember 2004 339 posts Posted by Jack_S on Thursday, December 15, 2005 10:49 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by BNSFrailfan. How did the ATSF "Santa Fe" get it's name? And how did it come about to become a Great Railroad? Allan. I have a Santa Fe history somewhere and I remember it this way. Originally started as a link between varius cities in Kansas (including Atchison and Topeka) they decided to replicate the Santa Fe trail route in rails. They got in a legal and shooting war with the Denver & Rio Grande Western over who got control of the passes to the west and southwest from southeastern Colorado. The D&RGW got the Arkansas River route and the ATSF got Raton Pass into New Mexico. Somewhere along here they got the chance to snag the rail rights to a line west across New Mexico and Arizona to California and they refocussed their gaze westward. When they saw the grade they'd have to climb to enter Santa Fe they bypassed it and ran a spur from Lamy to Santa Fe. So the ATSF never actually went thru Santa Fe, but it sure gave them a mellifluous name that rolls nicely off the tongue. Judy Garland even proved it could be sung. They were noted for keeping up excellent maintenance on their rolling stock, upgrading their ROW, and for really understanding PR, advertising, and keeping their name before the public. They jumped at the chance to pull off PR stunts like Death Valley Scotty's fast trip to Chicago. Their respect for passenger traffic was unmatched and most all the available pictures and films of passenger travel during the Streamliner Era are of the various Chiefs. Some say this respect for passenger trains still exists in the way they prioritize AmTrak on their ROWs. Reply MP173 Member sinceMay 2004 From: Valparaiso, In 5,921 posts Posted by MP173 on Thursday, December 15, 2005 10:17 PM I think much of it had to be that so many model train sets were Santa Fe. They were America's railroad. ed Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 6:27 PM I do have to agree. I truly did love the Santa Fe's Passenger Trains. A top 10. But for some reason. The word Santa Fe was a very special name when I was very young. Allan. Reply Edit MP173 Member sinceMay 2004 From: Valparaiso, In 5,921 posts Posted by MP173 on Thursday, December 15, 2005 5:00 PM I cannot answer how they got their name, but consider this...none of the three cities are on the mainline. Granted, a case could be made that Topeka was on a secondary main, but Atchison is north of Kansas City and Santa Fe is off of the Raton Pass main. How did they become a great railroad? Look at a map of their operations. A straight line from Chicago to KC. Then two routes southwestward which rejoin in NM and continue on to LA and then up to SF. Also, routes to Texas and Denver. They were the only carrier to go direct from Chicago to California and had the best route. They also were in the valley area of California, the greatest agricultural district in our country. They had great passenger trains and they were in California when that area exploded with growth. ed Reply vsmith Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Smoggy L.A. 10,743 posts Posted by vsmith on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:55 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by BNSFrailfan. Mostly all in Kansas,Right? Allan. Sort of.. Atchison and Topeka are both in Kansas, only 50 miles apart! Santa Fe is Santa Fe New Mexico, its intended goal, the RR was started in 1859 didnt get there till 1880. The name "Santa Fe" has far more to do with the fact that the RR was build literally on top of the old Santa Fe Trail which had carried wagon trains westward for many years. Have fun with your trains Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:50 PM Not quite sure. I know they were in Kansas, and Santa Fe is in New Mexico, so I guess they were mostly in the soutwest, right? Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:39 PM Mostly all in Kansas,Right? Allan. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:35 PM ATSF stands for Atichson (spelling) Topeka (spelling) and Santa Fe. These are all names of cities. How did it become a great railroad? Not sure. Good management? Succesful operations? I am not sure. Hope that helps. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Santa Fe. (ATSF) Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:30 PM How did the ATSF "Santa Fe" get it's name? And how did it come about to become a Great Railroad? Allan. Reply Edit Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub
QUOTE: Originally posted by MP173 spbed: Explain your 360 degree comment. thanks, ed
QUOTE: Originally posted by MP173 I think much of it had to be that so many model train sets were Santa Fe. They were America's railroad. ed
Originally posted by BNSFrailfan. [ Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, December 16, 2005 7:59 AM Thank you all of you. Now I understand. Allan. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, December 16, 2005 12:39 AM here's a quich history of the Santa Fe ------------------------------- The Santa Fe which formed in 1860 had a modest goal-to connect the Kansas cities of Atchison and Topeka w/ Santa Fe, New Mexico. Construction began in 1868. After the above line was completed the RR built west through Colorado. As a result they were able to tap coal mines and livestock production. It was only natural the RR would target California. The Santa Fe tracks crossed the CA state line in 1883. Los Angeles was reached in 1887. By the end of the 1800's Santa Fe had reached Denver (1882) and Chicago (1888). SF also covered Kansas & Oklahoma with branch lines. Santa Fe reached it's peak in 1931 w/ 13,568 miles of mainline track. For years it was the longest RR in the U.S. Santa Fe was both a sucessful freight & passenger carrier. SF held a reputation of the finest passenger trains in America. (until 1971 when Amtrak took over salect trains) SF pioneered many freight handling methods. In 1976 it built the experimental 6-unit flatcar for carrying freight containers. This method later became the industry standard. In 1960 it was the first RR to carry automobiles on racks attached to flatcars (vs. boxcars). In 1983 SF announced merger plans w/ Southern Pacific. The merge was rejected by the Interstate Commerce Commission in 1986. Between 1985&1995 SF carried more intermodal units (truck trailers and containers on special flatcars) than any other RR. In 1994 there was a surprise announcment that Santa Fe would merge w/ Bulington Noethern. On Sept. 22,1995 they merged forming the largest (at that time) RR in U.S. history: Burlington Northern Santa Fe Reply Edit Jack_S Member sinceDecember 2004 339 posts Posted by Jack_S on Thursday, December 15, 2005 10:49 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by BNSFrailfan. How did the ATSF "Santa Fe" get it's name? And how did it come about to become a Great Railroad? Allan. I have a Santa Fe history somewhere and I remember it this way. Originally started as a link between varius cities in Kansas (including Atchison and Topeka) they decided to replicate the Santa Fe trail route in rails. They got in a legal and shooting war with the Denver & Rio Grande Western over who got control of the passes to the west and southwest from southeastern Colorado. The D&RGW got the Arkansas River route and the ATSF got Raton Pass into New Mexico. Somewhere along here they got the chance to snag the rail rights to a line west across New Mexico and Arizona to California and they refocussed their gaze westward. When they saw the grade they'd have to climb to enter Santa Fe they bypassed it and ran a spur from Lamy to Santa Fe. So the ATSF never actually went thru Santa Fe, but it sure gave them a mellifluous name that rolls nicely off the tongue. Judy Garland even proved it could be sung. They were noted for keeping up excellent maintenance on their rolling stock, upgrading their ROW, and for really understanding PR, advertising, and keeping their name before the public. They jumped at the chance to pull off PR stunts like Death Valley Scotty's fast trip to Chicago. Their respect for passenger traffic was unmatched and most all the available pictures and films of passenger travel during the Streamliner Era are of the various Chiefs. Some say this respect for passenger trains still exists in the way they prioritize AmTrak on their ROWs. Reply MP173 Member sinceMay 2004 From: Valparaiso, In 5,921 posts Posted by MP173 on Thursday, December 15, 2005 10:17 PM I think much of it had to be that so many model train sets were Santa Fe. They were America's railroad. ed Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 6:27 PM I do have to agree. I truly did love the Santa Fe's Passenger Trains. A top 10. But for some reason. The word Santa Fe was a very special name when I was very young. Allan. Reply Edit MP173 Member sinceMay 2004 From: Valparaiso, In 5,921 posts Posted by MP173 on Thursday, December 15, 2005 5:00 PM I cannot answer how they got their name, but consider this...none of the three cities are on the mainline. Granted, a case could be made that Topeka was on a secondary main, but Atchison is north of Kansas City and Santa Fe is off of the Raton Pass main. How did they become a great railroad? Look at a map of their operations. A straight line from Chicago to KC. Then two routes southwestward which rejoin in NM and continue on to LA and then up to SF. Also, routes to Texas and Denver. They were the only carrier to go direct from Chicago to California and had the best route. They also were in the valley area of California, the greatest agricultural district in our country. They had great passenger trains and they were in California when that area exploded with growth. ed Reply vsmith Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Smoggy L.A. 10,743 posts Posted by vsmith on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:55 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by BNSFrailfan. Mostly all in Kansas,Right? Allan. Sort of.. Atchison and Topeka are both in Kansas, only 50 miles apart! Santa Fe is Santa Fe New Mexico, its intended goal, the RR was started in 1859 didnt get there till 1880. The name "Santa Fe" has far more to do with the fact that the RR was build literally on top of the old Santa Fe Trail which had carried wagon trains westward for many years. Have fun with your trains Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:50 PM Not quite sure. I know they were in Kansas, and Santa Fe is in New Mexico, so I guess they were mostly in the soutwest, right? Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:39 PM Mostly all in Kansas,Right? Allan. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:35 PM ATSF stands for Atichson (spelling) Topeka (spelling) and Santa Fe. These are all names of cities. How did it become a great railroad? Not sure. Good management? Succesful operations? I am not sure. Hope that helps. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Santa Fe. (ATSF) Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, December 15, 2005 4:30 PM How did the ATSF "Santa Fe" get it's name? And how did it come about to become a Great Railroad? Allan. Reply Edit Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
QUOTE: Originally posted by BNSFrailfan. How did the ATSF "Santa Fe" get it's name? And how did it come about to become a Great Railroad? Allan.
QUOTE: Originally posted by BNSFrailfan. Mostly all in Kansas,Right? Allan.
Have fun with your trains
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