End of the line for Greyhound!

[daveklepper]

A national pulbic transportation network is essential.

[Anonymous]

With gasoline going up and up, and with demand passing our capacity to refine the stuff, it won't be long before Americans give up driving long distances.....especially when the long lines reappear and stations close for not having tany gasoline to sell....

Then those who are opposed to Amtrak might rethink their position....

Greyhound has been losing money too for a long time. Killing Amtrak with a dying Greyhound isn't the answer.....especially for rural America.....

[Anonymous]

I think Greyhound is actually following the railroad's tactics here. They are cutting out branch lines and sticking with main routes. The only problem with that is at least the railroads allow short lines or regionals to take over, but with Greyhound they took over all the competition years ago now their is no one to take over the lost bus routes.

[SALfan]

QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45

ModelCar hits on a good point.

Greyhound and Amtrak's relationship, inspite of various connections, has generally been viewed as adverserial.

In these times of $3.00+ gallon for gasoline Amtrak and Greyhound can indeed become much more viable and valued. However, as long as we persist with the general attitude that we don't want to leave our cars or big SUV's sitting in the garage, this idea won't work.

If I could catch a train from Tampa to Macon GA that runs 79 mph most of the way, connect and fini***he trip to Vidalia, GA on Greyhound.....I sure would! I get a headache just thinking about driving my family for 5+ hours on I-75, where I have seen so many traffic jam-ups and jack-knived trucks and car accidents. On my last long distance drive on this interstate, we got to see to smashed up semi-trucks sitting in a ditch........while we poked along at 4 mile per hour for over 1/2 hour.

As Earl Pitts says daily: Wake up, Uh-Merica! [:0][:p]

AntonioFP45: I'm impressed that you know Vidalia exists; you, piouslion and I are probably the only ones on the forum who do. Have you ever tried U.S. 301 as an alternative to I-75?

Know what you mean about I-75. Have you ever been on I-95 around Christmas? DON'T!! When traveling from the DC area to Tallahassee, FL at Christmas, we take the old Federal-shield highways whenever possible, just to avoid the craziness on the interstates. I, too, would be willing to take the train and a connecting bus if the schedules could work. We can shoehorn ourselves into what the airlines or a private car can do, but the train as currently set up just won't work.

[StillGrande]

QUOTE: Originally posted by HighIron2003ar

I
Greyhound's express routes are the way to go, the local routes adds hours and days to your trip. Sure you leave the station right away out of D.C. but find yourself jumping on and off I-81/I-40 for the next 18 hours. Yuck.

Amen to that. I took the bus from Richmond to DC and back. Made the mistake of taking a local up there. I thought we would never get there. It must have taken 5 hours to go 90 miles. I did get to see every podunk nowhereville between the two. Took an express back. Never again. I'll walk first. They called the movie Planes, Trains, and Automobiles because that is the selection order. Not even the actors would get on a bus!

[chad thomas]

QUOTE: Originally posted by greyhounds

Well, I'm relieved. I thought I was meeting my demise.

I guess the rumors of your demise were highly exadurated.[;)]

[AntonioFP45]

ModelCar hits on a good point.

Greyhound and Amtrak's relationship, inspite of various connections, has generally been viewed as adverserial.

In these times of $3.00+ gallon for gasoline Amtrak and Greyhound can indeed become much more viable and valued. However, as long as we persist with the general attitude that we don't want to leave our cars or big SUV's sitting in the garage, this idea won't work.

If I could catch a train from Tampa to Macon GA that runs 79 mph most of the way, connect and fini***he trip to Vidalia, GA on Greyhound.....I sure would! I get a headache just thinking about driving my family for 5+ hours on I-75, where I have seen so many traffic jam-ups and jack-knived trucks and car accidents. On my last long distance drive on this interstate, we got to see to smashed up semi-trucks sitting in a ditch........while we poked along at 4 mile per hour for over 1/2 hour.

As Earl Pitts says daily: Wake up, Uh-Merica! [:0][:p]

[Anonymous]

Well--- Very Simple Cross Honor Amtrakand Greyhound tickets and share reservations computers

[jabrown1971]

Greyhound is in trouble, has been since March of 03. That is where I worked for 14 years until I got laid off in the first round. Since then, routes have been cut, stations shuttered and jobs lost. Greyhound does cut back towns and routes every so often, last time was 1990. They will get to the level they want, start rebuilding and reorganizing and go all over again. Don't cry for Greyhound.....they have been trying for goverment subsidies since the airlines got bailed out after 9/11.

[Sterling1]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DSchmitt

QUOTE: Originally posted by conrailman

That why we need Amtrak more than ever Before. Greyhound and Airlines are going downhill everyday. We Need More Travel Choices like more Amtrak around.[2c]

If there isn't enough ridership for a bus, how could AMTRAK do better?

Perhaps with an RDC or railbus (20 seat) like the ones the Native Americans use on fmr BC Rail route . . .

[Murphy Siding]

So, Open Access killed Greyhound?[}:)]

[Junctionfan]

That might be a good idea. I know in Ontario, GO Service includes GO buses as well as GO trains and often coordinate with each other. The main problem with giving that as an example is that GO is reclusive to the GTA and areas around it where as Amtrak and Greyhound are national if not international (I don't think they own property in Canada-could be wrong). So the expenses are on a greater scale.

[Modelcar]

....Perhaps our counrty should mesh Amtrak and Greyhound service together to serve more "smaller" communities and make our ground transportation more complete...Details would have to be assembled by our transport exports...but the two services together serving 25 and 40 million is quite a chunk as it is now....and with intergrated services and properly funded, perhaps the two working together could do even a better job of moving people.

[Valleyline]

Sounds like Greyhound is going through the same thing the railroads went through. The first trains to go were the small town locals. The last were the city to city name trains. How anyone in rural America can survive without a personal car is a mystery to me.

[daveklepper]

The USAS does need a national passenger transportation system with Amtrak and its rail routes as its core and all markets analyzed as to whether bus or rail is most suitable for existing conditions. In some cases, tourist railroads could provide the service for less subsidy than anyone else.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by greyhounds

Well, I'm relieved. I thought I was meeting my demise.

Thanks for the [^]

[greyhounds]

Well, I'm relieved. I thought I was meeting my demise.

[Anonymous]

I have ridden greyhound 5 times in arranging oreintation for trucking into the Midwest and down into the Tennessee.

I will not ever ride Greyhound again. There is just too much time lost trying to stay awake and watch your person/valuables and fighting off the bums that panhandle for money.

Greyhound's express routes are the way to go, the local routes adds hours and days to your trip. Sure you leave the station right away out of D.C. but find yourself jumping on and off I-81/I-40 for the next 18 hours. Yuck.

America's need for passenger ridership really is very high. Will the Government pay for routes and passenger trains or other service into every little town that needs it? No.

Frankly it is my opinion we as Americans have the responsibility to establish commerce and private ventures for profit aimed at providing the services we need. No one else is going to do it.

I suspect also the re-urbanization and movement of peoples out of the smaller towns back into the large areas that have the services and transport is also happening. The rest of us are able to get around with our cars and SUV's.

When I travel, I look at Airline first, train second and finally my own vehicle third. I would prefer to travel two days between Little Rock to Baltimore with a overnight in a nice hotel at Knoxville TN than endure a packed bus full of everything from the good to the bad and tripping over the ugly.

[andrewjonathon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DSchmitt

QUOTE: Originally posted by conrailman

That why we need Amtrak more than ever Before. Greyhound and Airlines are going downhill everyday. We Need More Travel Choices like more Amtrak around.[2c]

If there isn't enough ridership for a bus, how could AMTRAK do better?

Rather than give Amtrak more money to pick-up where Greyhound left off, maybe the government should give Greyhound direct subsidies like it gives Amtrak. If Greyhound lost $22 million in the first quarter (typically a slow travel period) then in theory at most the government would have to do is provide a $100 million dollar subsidy to Greyhound to maintain currently levels of service. Sounds a lot cheaper than what Amtrak is asking for. Greyhound transported 40 million people last year versus Amtrak's 25 million and provides service to over 6000 cities and towns versus 500 on Amtrak. Sounds like giving the money to Greyhound would better decision than giving it to Amtrak. I like trains but its hard to ignore the numbers.

[Anonymous]

In spite of predicted energy shortages we still proceed as though it's our manifest destiny to provide infrastructure for every motor vehicle the manufacturers can sell.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DSchmitt

QUOTE: Originally posted by conrailman

That why we need Amtrak more than ever Before. Greyhound and Airlines are going downhill everyday. We Need More Travel Choices like more Amtrak around.[2c]

If there isn't enough ridership for a bus, how could AMTRAK do better?

It won't. As a matter of fact. Amtrak is useless just like the rest of the transportation system. Hiway systems across this country are severly over crowded,our government would rather fork out billions for the hiway's than try to convince americans to switch their modes of transportation. Bus lines and airlines are on the verge of going banktrupt. Amtrak struggle. Hiway system over crouded. Any ideas? Allan.

[Junctionfan]

Well that is a good question. My only thought is that bottlenecking and the lack of other modes of transportation will require some sort of mass-transit renewal (did I spell that right?-it doesn't look right)

[DSchmitt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by conrailman

That why we need Amtrak more than ever Before. Greyhound and Airlines are going downhill everyday. We Need More Travel Choices like more Amtrak around.[2c]

If there isn't enough ridership for a bus, how could AMTRAK do better?

[conrailman]

That why we need Amtrak more than ever Before. Greyhound and Airlines are going downhill everyday. We Need More Travel Choices like more Amtrak around.[2c]

[Anonymous]

Rural Greyhound passengers get last boarding call By Patrik Jonsson, Correspondent of The Christian Science Monitor
Fri Aug 26, 4:00 AM ET



WINDSOR, N.C. - For the first time in as long as most people can remember, the old "silver dog" failed to stop last week in Hollywood, Fla.; Hurricane Mills, Tenn.; and Ludlow, Vt. - just a few of close to 1,000 out-of-the-way hamlets where residents can no longer leave the driving to Greyhound.

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So far, 750 rural towns - and hundreds of more in-between "flag stops" in even smaller places - have lost their Greyhound connection this year. Service stopped at 81 locales last week alone, and hundreds more are expected to be dropped as the Dallas-based carrier and its subsidiaries roll out new routes across the country into 2006.

It's part of a broad restructuring of the 91-year-old long-distance carrier, which is trying to regain traction after losing $22 million in the first quarter of this year. Left in a puff of exhaust are the small towns that helped define the image of the Greyhound as a low-rent hitch that appealed to Americans' sense of adventure and earned it broad cultural recognition in everything from country songs to movies like "Midnight Cowboy."

Greyhound's new strategy: adopt faster and more direct urban routes.

But in bypassed towns like Windsor, N.C., one of 31 stops in this state that lost bus service last week, the decision compounds a sense of dislocation and increasing distance from the country's booming urban centers - not to mention the loss of a cheap ticket to the big city for many rural poor, especially in the South, for whom the Greyhound remains an important connector to country roots.

"Most people come from the country, not the city, and they have to have a way to come back for weddings and funerals, and the bus is still that way for a lot of people," says Maria Wesson of Windsor, as she packs pork barbecue sandwiches at the Duck-Thru convenience store that served as the bus stop for the past two years.

But nostalgia won't pay the bills. A recent bus that came through tiny - and now off-the-grid - Pinetops, N.C., carried a single passenger northward to New York City. To stem the slide and become more relevant, Greyhound surveyed its passengers and found a new kind of bus traveler emerging: more urban, less interested in traveling distances over 450 miles, and more concerned with speed. Lengthy, meandering routes were passengers' biggest complaint - and they also failed to attract business. In all of 2004, for example, only 121 outbound passengers used the small terminal in Humboldt, Tenn., which closed last week.

"It's never an easy decision to discontinue service to a community that you've been serving, but when customer demand is low or nonexistent, to stay in business you have to make tough decisions," says Anna Folmnsbee, a Greyhound spokeswoman.

The biggest culprit behind declining ticket sales is the car; even the poorest rural family likely has one. But, from a business point of view, Greyhound's leaving is an affirmation of many towns' decline as destinations and points of departure.

"The real reason that service has gone down is that people are leaving those communities," says Elvis Latiolais, general manager for Carolina Trailways, a Greyhound subsidiary.

Some communities could replace the lost service through rural transportation grants from the Federal Transit Administration. Yet in April, before departing for a new post, FTA chief Jennifer Dorn warned state transportation officials: "Rural service is no longer a certainty."

The silver coach became a key plot twist in major life events, from elopements to enlistments to the journeys of budding small-town starlets trying their luck in Hollywood. For artists, the Greyhound has long been a symbolic way to depict a unique American wanderlust: Sometimes as a way out, often as a way home.

"Greyhound really brought America as a whole together, and it's always been more of an adventure than riding the train," says Gene Nicolelli, the director of the Greyhound Bus Origin Center, a museum in Hibbing, Minn.

The company, which first started making runs in 1914, did what the railroad couldn't by connecting flourishing small towns off the main railline. In the process, every American could take part in Manifest Destiny, riding on the cheap through the Rockies or dozing through Mississippi's cotton fields.

But since 1970, the Greyhound has gradually lost its importance and appeal. Ridership is down to 40 million from a 1970 high of 130 million. Where once the Greyhound stopped in 17,000 communities, it today pulls into only 6,000.

It's still a great way to ride, says Samuel Avent, waiting to catch a bus in Rocky Mount, N.C., a small Greyhound hub that remains active. "There's no wear on your car, you leave the driving to some one else, you have something to eat - and mostly you sleep," he says, leaning his head back and closing his eyes by way of example.

Back inPinetops, antiques shop owner Patricia Webb can no longer enjoy watching for the new stranger to step off the bus - always a good topic of conversation for across-the-counter gossip.

But more deeply, the end of the route means that little Pinetops, a struggling eastern North Carolina town of mostly African-Americans and older whites, where the bus stopped in front of the police station, is increasingly irrelevant to the world at large. "It's another sign that small towns like ours are being left behind," says Ms. Webb.

The route of Trailways driver Leonard Cofield wound past live oak swamps, tobacco shacks and Princeville, N.C., where he used to get a barbecue sandwich and chat up the locals.

The route has been discontinued. Instead, Carolina Trailways is adding new service to Wilmington and Charlotte, N.C., and Richmond, Va., most of them express buses and direct routes. Mr. Cofield, for one, bemoans the end of his own rural, two-lane line.

"It was a great route," he says. "I'm sad to see it go."

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