End of the line.

[Anonymous]

This Sunday the last Three Rivers train will depart New York for Chicago. This line built by the Pennsylvania Railroad goes through the center of Pennsylvania and will no longer, at least for now see Chicago-nyc service. The route of such trains as the Broadway limited is gone. Also, philadelphia will no longer see daily service to Chicago.

[kenneo]

An area that does need service, but unless W wants to pony up the bucks, nothing is what he wants, and nothing is what he intends to get.

I have ridden the Broadway between Philly and Chicago and also once rode the PRR East out of St. Louis. None of those areas have had service since the start of Amtrack with the exception of the PRR main between Pittsburg and Philly most notably with the Three Rivers.

Sad.

[Modelcar]

...Just seems to sound a bit 3rd worldi***hat we can't provide rail passenger transportation between NYC and Chicago.

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

I don't know how 3rd worldish it appears when you consider the number of airline seats available every day between those cities.

[BaltACD]

It's operation on CSX creates all sorts of operational nightmares.

[joecool1212]

darn that CSX

[Modelcar]

Csshegewisch....I wasn't referring to airline seats....

[Anonymous]

I get it.... 1st world = airplanes. 3rd world = trains.

[joecool1212]

now you got it. Joe A.

[Anonymous]

So Great Britain and France are 3rd world nations because the have good high speed trains???????

[JoeKoh]

sad indeed.
stay safe
joe

[CopCarSS]

QUOTE: So Great Britain and France are 3rd world nations because the have good high speed trains???????

I assure you, even the best Amtrak has to offer does not qualify as "good high speed trains." Forget Acela, and Amtrak DOES look incredibly 3rd worldish compared to European rail.

Chris
Denver, CO

[joecool1212]

the way we finance Amtrak certanly looks third worldish. Joe A.

[conrailman]

Well, Amtrak is losing too many trains now like Pennsylvanian, Three Rivers west of Pittsburgh to Chicago the old Broadway Limited, Silver Palm, Twilight Shoreliner, Boston section of Lake Shore, The Desert Wind,and The Pioneer. We need more Train not less trains in the U.S. Amtrak should make The Three Rivers a Superliner train from Philadelphia to Chicago hook up with the Capital Limited in Pittsburgh to Chicago to save some money and be on a Better Route. Run 1 sleeping car and 2 coach on the Capital LImited?? But Amtrak Need to order more Superliners Cars.

[Anonymous]

Number one thing,It's the love affair with the Airplane and the rubber tire back in the early 30's and 40's that did a thing to the passenger Trains of today.
BNSFrailfan.

[mvlandsw]

The Lake Cities will still run from New York to Chicago.

[CopCarSS]

QUOTE: Amtrak should may The Three Rivers a Superliner train from Philadelphia to Chicago hook up with the Capital Limited in Pittsburgh to Chicago to save some money and be on a Better Route.

I was under the impression that Amtrak couldn't run Superliners basically anywhere east of Chicago due to tunnel height constraints.

[kevarc]

Hopefully this is the first step in lowering amtraks flag. Good riddance.

[oskar]

Dosen't the 3 rivers run on NS




kevin

[MP57313]

QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS
I was under the impression that Amtrak couldn't run Superliners basically anywhere east of Chicago due to tunnel height constraints.

That is only partially true. Amtrak runs the Capitol Ltd. and Auto-Train with Superliners.

The Cardinal ran with Superliners from '96-'02. It reverted to single level after an A-T derailment in Spring '02, when the Cardinal's cars were re-deployed to A-T (according to a source on another board).

The Capitol Ltd. cars do fit under the catenary at Washington Union Station (not much clearance though), and when on the Cardinal ran through Capitol Hill Tunnel.

Certain other lines may not clear Superliners, though. I don't think they ever ran on the Crescent. I don't know if that was due to limited equipment available or clearance issues along that route.

[Modelcar]

...The original Pennsy route now...NS, has clearance for double stack units so believe superliners should be ok....Tunnels were altered with more clearance some years ago.
Don't know about the tunnels into Manhattin...doubt if the superliners can be used there.

[oltmannd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar

...The original Pennsy route now...NS, has clearance for double stack units so believe superliners should be ok....Tunnels were altered with more clearance some years ago.
Don't know about the tunnels into Manhattin...doubt if the superliners can be used there.

You can get as far east as 30th St. in Phila - CR used to run their full length dome out of there, at least on track 1.

Penn Sta. in NY is a 'no go'.

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

Clearances into GCT and Penn Station are incredibly tight. The Han*** air whistle on FL9's is placed low to meet clearances into GCT. GCT had (has?) some overhead third rail in places to bridge gaps over double-slip switches. Also note pictures taken in Penn Station showing how low the catenary is. I'm sure that the MP15B's recently delivered to Amtrak have the low cabs to meet these clearances.

[Modelcar]

...Yes I figured the tunnels into both ends of Penn Station would have tight clearances and would not even be close to providing enough room for Superliners.

[AntonioFP45]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevarc

Hopefully this is the first step in lowering amtraks flag. Good riddance.

Wll Kevarc,

Just don't say that to the passengers that jam-pack the Silver Star and Silver Meteor between New York and Florida because they're tired of lousy flights, airport delays and bumper to bumper traffic on I-75 and I-95. I've ridden these trains before and for the service was exceptional. My mother rode the Silver Palm a few months ago between Tampa and Miami. She absolutely enjoyed it.

So you say "Get rid of it".

Well you may get your wish and then again the American public will say otherwise. For those crying that Norm MIneta's reform is a good thing, don't forget that regardless if these long distance trains run full, he wants to ax them and contract them out. As we know, passenger trains don't make money, except on "some" tourist lines and specialty runs like the American Orient Express. So what Long Distance trains would survive? Other than the Auto Train, virtually none.

LET'S SEE:
[1] We can send billions to help the Tsunami victims,
[2] Fund millions to rebuild Iraq's railroad,
[3] Fund millions to museums that feature sick, twisted art,
[4] Subsidize billions of dollars to the airline industry,
[5] Observe interstate systems that at rush hour turn into parking lots,

To top it off, according to the news mediea OPEC is planning to really stick it to us over the next 5 years and they're not hiding it either! (I'm so glad I don't drive a gas hog!)

BUT we can't support a passenger transportation system that's increasing in popularity? And some of us celebrate its demise? [%-)][B)]

Hmmmmmm........the logic is in there.....somewhere.......... O.K! Where is it[?]

[BaltACD]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevarc

Hopefully this is the first step in lowering amtraks flag. Good riddance.

Which will go first -

Joe Paterno at Penn State or Amtrak?

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45
[3] Fund millions to museums that feature sick, twisted art,

I agree with you on all but # 3. $0.75 out of evreyones' taxes is all that funds that "sick/twisted" art. I am a railfan and an artist and Congress is hurting both things I love by cutting art and rail funding. [xx(] Until we find a balance for "transportation" spending, roads and airlines will continue to get more money.

BUT this is a nation that wants it right now. We want to be in Chicago right now so how do I get there right now? Not by a slow train, but by a fast jet, or I drive myself. Unfortunately thats the situation. We want it right now. OPEC is only capitaling on our desire.

SO YOU ALL DRIVE YOUR SUV'S AND HAVE FUN WHILE YOU CAN!!!!!! [}:)]

[METRO]

Okay so Amtrak can survive on about a billion dollars a year, well figure that someone wanted to actually be nice to them and give them double that so we'll say two billion. That's probably enough to run all the trains and get some great upgrades and put us on the track to a real high-speed network at leas on a regional level.

So two billion dollars, that's only 1/150th the cost of the war in Iraq (0.67%) and only 1/5500th of our National GDP (0.02% acording to 2004 figures) For a safe and efficent alternative to clogged airways and deadly, polluting interstates, that sounds like a good idea to me!

BTW I wonder how many billions of dollars are going to be spent on upgrading America's airports this year, and how many more billions spent enlarging the highways.

Another thing, I'd like to see the ecological impact of different modes of transportation: cars we all know pollute an amazing amount (just look at the sky in LA if you need proof) but I'd imagine that a fully loaded Amtrak train with two modern P-42s in the lead would probably impact less than an airliner and carry more people, especially if the P-42s were running on a high-eff diesel like biodiesel.

~METRO

[daveklepper]

Superliners cannot go into either the tunnels into Manhattam (all, East River, Hudson River, and Park Avenue) nor into the Baltimore Tunnel on the PRR rouite. (Others can tell me abouit the B&O tunnel.) Amtrak has two NY - Chicago through trains, the Lake Cities and the Lake Shore, the first on the (mostly) ex PRR route and the second on the (mostly) ex-NYC route. The first serves Philadlephia and Pittsburgh, and the second Albany and Buffalo? and Cleveland? with question marks indicating a rough time to board or leave a train. So actually there are now four ways to get from the East Coast to Chicago, with the Capitol and Caradinal, added, these two requiring a ride up the Corridor to get to NY. So, enjoy them all!

[AntonioFP45]

Hello Guys,

Contact the senators in your district, both Republican and Democrat. You can send e-mail or take just a minute and mail a letter. It does make a difference!

Also contact your state governor. Most governors support Amtrak but since most are experiencing strained budgets, they will likely balk at MIneta's "matching funds" program.
Mineta knows this.