MP173Today it is more about monitoring the railroads thru the web cams and on line scanners and observing the operations.
Hence the question posed somewhere about putting together a matrix of the various cams and which are "connected." F'rinstance, some trains seen on the Fairport cam can be seen later on the Deshler cam, and vice versa. Berea may fit into that sequence as well. And Fostoria.
It's not hard to imagine folks "following" a train on a regular basis.
I would think that such a project would be "crowdsourced," with various people familiar with a given railroad's operations adding their expertise.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
My railfan experience has gravitated over the years. Years ago it was taking photos of trains, particularly the locomotives with interesting backdrops such as towers, depots, scenery, etc.
Today it is more about monitoring the railroads thru the web cams and on line scanners and observing the operations. Thus, I am more of an "economic railfan". I like to know information such as 1. origin/destination 2. types of freight being transported 3. Schedule 4. Is the train on time 5. Number of cars, tonnage, length, etc. 6. Possible revenue per train.
Difficult to gather that info, particularly revenue, cars, tonnage, etc....but by observing operations over a period of time, one gets a pretty good idea of how a railroad is operating.
Train symbols can be gathered on certain wiki pages...just type in CSX train symbols (or whatever railroad). Listings are provided, but not schedules.
I watch Berea, Oh webcam and listen in on the attached scanner. Also Deshler...which has a load of info with the train log. I like Berea better because it has both NS and CSX mainlines.
I keep my own "log" of daily trains observed with time and if time permits the number of cars. I do this for particular trains such as hot intermodals carrying LTL and UPS/FedX. Also certain manifest trains such as CSX 368 which carries a large number of lumber racks and refer. One can sort of monitor the economics of the nation by watching certain trains and car movements.
I have gotten pretty good at identifying trains by symbol number when I turn the scanner down to concentrate on work. Trains are very repetitive on car types carried and schedules.
Am I a nerd? Guilty.
ed
SD70Dude Lithonia Operator I'm surprised they announce the direction. I would have thought that a train of a given number would always be going a particular direction. On CN, odd numbers are supposed to be west/north and evens east/south. But this doesn't always work out, and some locals operate in both directions under the same number. ... Your mileage may vary on other railroads and on CN south of the border.
Lithonia Operator I'm surprised they announce the direction. I would have thought that a train of a given number would always be going a particular direction.
I'm surprised they announce the direction. I would have thought that a train of a given number would always be going a particular direction.
On CN, odd numbers are supposed to be west/north and evens east/south. But this doesn't always work out, and some locals operate in both directions under the same number.
...
Your mileage may vary on other railroads and on CN south of the border.
CSX attempts to follow a system of Odd numbers for West and South, Even number for East and North. That is all well and good where you have trains that operate in only one Timetable geographic area.
Former B&O and ConRail territories operate with Timetable directions of East & West. Former Seaboard Coastline territories operate on Timetable directions of North and South.
The RF&P Sub, despite being a part of the Baltimore Division which uses East-West, is North-South.
The fact that 'most' train operating on the RF&P also operate on the Capital and Philadelphia Subs allows for effective direction numbering - I031 - the premier Intermodal train from New Jersey to Jacksonville operates Westbound from New Jersey to CP Virginia and Southbound from CP Virginia to Jacksonville.
Where it gets 'sticky' is with scheduled trains operating from points observing N-S numbering conventions that then go West on the Metropolitan and subsequent subdivisions Westbound. A Northbound even numbered train when it gets to JD Tower and turns West - still with its even number.
As I previously stated most Bulk commodity trains operate on a Round Trip identity profile and the odd and even numbering has no bearing on the assignment of these profile numbers.
Each carrier has developed their own train identity conventions and among the Class 1's no two of them are the same. The train identities are among the core elements of each carriers Car & Train Movement computer systems.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
BaltACD The ownership of cars isn't as much of a indicator as it once was.
The ownership of cars isn't as much of a indicator as it once was.
The preponderance of leased cars with shortline markings like AOK, NOKL and COER and TTX/RailBox pool cars make it harder to tell who the car operators are as well.
Chris van der Heide
My Algoma Central Railway Modeling Blog
SD70Dude On CN, odd numbers are supposed to be west/north and evens east/south. But this doesn't always work out, and some locals operate in both directions under the same number.
Yup, a "turn" job will likely be running under the same symbol in both directions.
Also, junctions between lines running in different directions can mess things up. e.g. if a northbound (should be odd) off one subdivision becomes eastbound (should be even) on another line at a junction, its numeric symbol would be the "wrong direction" on one of those subs...
I'll pick on our branchline between Edmonton and Calgary as an example. It is used by westbounds that originate in Winnipeg and eastbounds that originate in Vancouver or Prince Rupert, and they all keep the same numbers. There are also locals between Edmonton and Camrose (L517) and around Mirror (L550) that operate back and forth as needed without the train number changing.
We call the approach signal to each controlled location with the train number, and each mile that ends in '5' with the engine number and direction. So anyone with a scanner could pretty easily figure out which train is which on CN in Canada.
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
The locals in Indiana on the ole C&EI are still using J, at least as of last night. The J has been in use for a couple decades or so around here. I see on railroadfan dot com's WIKI that as of 2-26-22 all locals are using the L. Wasn't L previously used for second sections of R or Q trains, or maybe sections running earlier than scheduled or for trains not running on their designated scheduled days?
Insofar as radio usage, around here many guys also include the engine number when calling signals. If you're taking photos, that would be a dead lock on matching up your pics with train ID's over radio traffic. Occasionally dispatchers issue EC1's over the radio which include train ID and engine number...EC1's are used for slow orders, crossing malfunctions and to annul other EC1's, amongst other things.
Oh, to the OP question, bulk or unit trains can run in multiple directions and also the locals, work trains, Y or yard jobs and Z's which are foreign road movements, I think.
Everything pertains to CSX. I'm not familiar enough with the others to speculate.
Recently CSX has been playing with identities AGAIN.
Intermodal trains are now operating with the letter I as a prefix - if you knew the train under its Q designation, it is the same only with I as the prefix.
Locals used to be governed by having a prefix letter that, at one time, corresponded to a Division designation. Once CSX started redefining their division boundaries that form of identification began to get weird. I understand all, repeat ALL locals now have a L prefix - the present 3 digit number following the L has no relationship to the 3 digit number the followed the Division identifier.
Every time a 'new kid on the block' comes into Service Design they think up a 'new way' to confuse the work force.
If one "fans" a given line enough, one gains a sense of what's running when.
Regulars watching the Deshler cam know the regular symbols - plus a log is kept on-line of everything that passes. Other cam locations often do the same thing.
Occasionally you'll find someone with an inside source. Listening to the dispatchers channels (in addition to the road channels) can prove enlightening.
Then you have lines that may only see a few trains per day. Unless CSX is playing with symbols, I can usually know that a northbound on the CSX St Lawrence Sub is going to be Q620.
Sometimes there are FB and other groups dedicated to a given line or area.
Lithonia OperatorI'm surprised they announce the direction. I would have thought that a train of a given number would always be going a particular direction.
On CSX Bulk Commodity trains in many cases are 'scheduled' for round trip operation from Origin to Destination and return to Origin. Thus the train ID can be moving in both directions - in fact, sometimes it happens that there can be both the loaded and empty trains on the same territory at the same time ie. U331-07 & U331-14 for example (07 & 14 being the dates associated with their date of origin).
Still in training.
Lithonia OperatorA lot of railroad photo cations I see include the train's number or symbol. How does one get that info? I'm assuming you either have to be a RR employee or know one. Is there any other way?
I suspect those photogs that supply train identification with their photos have radio scanners that monitor the railroad channels in use in the area where they are taking the photos.
CSX rules require trains to announce over the Road Radio Channel the indication of every signal they pass - that announcement includes - the identification of the Signal, the indication displayed, track train is on, the identity of the train and its direction. "Boat House, Clear #2 track Q33308 West".
Over time observing trains one can come to a good idea of what the train ID is by the make up of the cars in the train. Scheduled merchandise trains tend to carry the same types of commodities daily. Back in the days of over 100 Class 1 carriers it was 'relatively' easy by noting if the train was made up of Western carriers cars, Southern carrier cars etc. Now that we effectively only have two Western carriers and two Eastern carriers with CN and soon to be CPKC as Central USA carriers operating N-S. The ownership of cars isn't as much of a indicator as it once was.
A lot of railroad photo cations I see include the train's number or symbol. How does one get that info? I'm assuming you either have to be a RR employee or know one. Is there any other way?
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