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He stole a what?

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  • Member since
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  • From: Denver / La Junta
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Posted by mudchicken on Monday, July 2, 2018 6:06 PM

Sam:

ANSWER: Cut your losses and run.  Cheaper to leave it then to have to remove track, ties and ballast section and properly rebuild 20-50 feet of highway. If the local and/or state agency, who was notified of the abandonment, fails to request through STB/ICC to mitigate road crossings, bridges etc. at the time of abandonment, then the inconvenient expense gets ignored. (surveyors get frustrated when a major monument gets removed without referencing as well)

 

AB-870 (X)  (2004-2005) ... 10.6 miles....NITU/CITU granted to Butler County (later assigned to City of Andover) for 3 miles around Andover, the other 7 miles abandoned totally ...Butler County Economic Development (Augusta - Andover)

AB 6-403 (X) (2003-2006) Sedgewick County/Andover to Wichita 16.91 miles..NITU/CITU granted to City of Wichita for 9.93 miles 5-10-05 BNSF Ry. (Andover -Wichita)

East of Augusta in Butler & Greenwood Counties was AB-563-1(x) [1999-2008] which also had parts railbanked, only to later be dropped by Butler County & American Trails Assn. (long story, read the decision, but neither could pony up the $$$ and insurance to be responsible trail owners per board rule) - WATCO/Kansas Eastern RR (Severy - Augusta)

 

If they are outside the granted NITU/CITU limits, better hope they acquired legal title from the landowner of record. You already have KDOT going stupid in SW Wichita on part of the old Orient/KCM&O.

Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
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Posted by samfp1943 on Monday, July 2, 2018 6:03 PM

It is of interest around here that the former Frisco Line that ran into Wichita from the East. Primarily. from Augusta to Andover to Wichita, has been, and is being turned into a trail. Total distance 20 to 30 miles(?). The acrivities have only started within the last several years.  The Frisco line dates to the 1880's and actually came across from SW Missouri via Columbus KS. Independence, Sedan, Severy. Beaumont, (wooden Frisco Water Tank still there) and Augusta, Andover,Wichita. <Andover-Augusta RailTrail Initiative, Redbud Trail >   Link@ https://aartitrail.wordpress.com/

With the questions about ownership of adjacent lands and problems with other rail to trail initiatives, one sort of wonders about this abandoned  Kansas Frisco ROW?

 

 


 

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  • From: South Central,Ks
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Posted by samfp1943 on Monday, July 2, 2018 5:49 PM

mudchicken

The pig feathers certainly flew in Missouri showing how inept the locals were.

The Ulster and Delaware article in today's newswire shows that NY isn't any better. In that case both sides lose and the adjoining landowners probably get a windfall, dependent on color of title.

 

     In the past on the Forum we have touched on [sort of?] this topic. Concerning the 'abandoning' of old ROW bridges and 'highway rail crossings'.

 The area here in Kansas, where many rail lines have been 'abandoned'  and the rails removed along the ROW's. Of course, many of the bridges, were left in place, and seem to be 'forgotten'.  The people/contractors, who removed the rails, and hardware from those ROW's, seemed to 'forget' the bridges.  

 One would wonder why if you have the heavy handliing equipment in place,WHY, would you not also get the salvage, represented by those various steel bridges? The answer, and the case for their being left in place has been made here, by both Mudchicken and BaltACD.  A potential future need for those items(?).            The other question I am curious about; Why do they leave the rails in place at a highway grade crossing?  Is the reasoning the same as a bridge left in place? Might they have a better claim to a crossing if the rails are left under the paving of an abandoned road crossing?     That seems to have happened regularly in this State.   Where railroads are concerned , the term "abandoned' seems to take on different meanings?

 

 

 


 

  • Member since
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  • From: Denver / La Junta
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Posted by mudchicken on Monday, July 2, 2018 2:18 PM

The pig feathers certainly flew in Missouri showing how inept the locals were.

The Ulster and Delaware article in today's newswire shows that NY isn't any better. In that case both sides lose and the adjoining landowners probably get a windfall, dependent on color of title.

Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
  • Member since
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  • From: US
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Posted by BaltACD on Monday, July 2, 2018 8:33 AM

Carriers tend to retain ownership of bridges on lines they have otherwise abandoned - it can be a readily available source for a replacement bridge when one on an active line fails for whatever the reason.  

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

  • Member since
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Posted by mudchicken on Monday, July 2, 2018 7:51 AM

Amen

Junkman's logic... Warped POV is surprisingly present, even in government. In light of the rails-to-trails mess with the Monon High Bridge* further south, one might look into the claim that Hammond actually owns the bridge and the R/W.

 

(*) Bought the bridge from CSX but not the R/W. Local towns and trails groups stupidly claim they have have rails-to-trails ownership of the line, but they don't. They never followed through on the federal NITI/CITU from CSX and they don't have the cash......and then there was the KATY Trail Missouri River Bridge at Boonville MO and how stupid MODOT and the KATY Trail people were. (UP kept that bridge for future use and then Katrina happened)

Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
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  • From: US
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Posted by BaltACD on Monday, July 2, 2018 7:23 AM

Word of caution - even though something hasn't been touched in a large number of years - everything is owned by somebody and unless that somebody is YOU, don't scrap it because you are now a theif.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Monday, July 2, 2018 7:13 AM

It has happened before.  When the City of Chicago built a new bridge over the Calumet River at 130th Street around 1948 or so, the old bridge was removed and placed next to the South Shore Line right-of-way, the city retained title to the bridge in case they needed to use it as a temporary span somewhere else. In the mid-1960's, a scrap dealer sent to crew out to start cutting up the bridge for the metal.  They were caught in the act and were charged with theft.  I don't know how it played out.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
  • Member since
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  • From: Antioch, IL
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He stole a what?
Posted by greyhounds on Monday, July 2, 2018 12:41 AM

“He allegedly stole a bridge."

An old unused Monon bridge has been allegedly stollen.  Is there no end to this lawlessnes?

http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/news/ct-ptb-hammond-bridge-theft-hearing-st-0629-story.html

 

 

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.

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