“Rocket Train” bridge collapse

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“Rocket Train” bridge collapse
Posted by LithoniaOperator on Monday, February 12, 2018 11:07 PM

In the January Trains there is an interesting story about the trains that brought rocket boosters to NASA. A photo shows the aftermath of a bridge collapse while the train was on it. It‘s a real mess. But the text says the bridge was rebuilt in 16 days! Can this be true? That seems impossible.

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, February 12, 2018 11:22 PM

I believe we actually have threads on really fast bridge replacement in a couple of places. 

Now, if you want to see real fast construction, consider the rebuilding of the Portageville  (thanks, Tree) Viaduct.  Construction on this started June 8th, 1875 and was complete and open to traffic by the end of July.  This for a bridge 820' long and up to 240' high ... and the construction quality was good enough to keep it in mainline service over 140 years.

I think you can still see it ... but it is scheduled to be taken down sometime this year, not for any fault of its own.

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Posted by tree68 on Tuesday, February 13, 2018 6:38 AM

Overmod
I think you can still see it ... but it is scheduled to be taken down sometime this year, not for any fault of its own.

The old Portageville bridge is being taken down as we speak.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Tuesday, February 13, 2018 10:27 AM

tree68
 
Overmod
I think you can still see it ... but it is scheduled to be taken down sometime this year, not for any fault of its own.

 

The old Portageville bridge is being taken down as we speak.

 

Correct.  The sad thing is NS offered the bridge to the state of New York as part of a hiking trail, which means the bridge would have lasted who knows how much longer with only pedestrian traffic, but New York said "No thanks!"

Maybe a wise decision in the short term, but in the long term I'll bet they'll be sorry.

And Overmod, those guys knew how to work back in those days!  Hey, it took only 18 months to build the Empire State Building!  Pretty pathetic when you see how long some construction projects take nowadays.

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Posted by switch7frg on Tuesday, February 13, 2018 10:47 AM

Smile, Wink & Grin Indeed it is a sad state of affaires,(you expect us to know what we are doing? )Just give us the money

Y6bs evergreen in my mind

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Posted by ChuckCobleigh on Tuesday, February 13, 2018 1:57 PM

Firelock76
And Overmod, those guys knew how to work back in those days!  Hey, it took only 18 months to build the Empire State Building!  Pretty pathetic when you see how long some construction projects take nowadays.

These days it takes that long to get the first NIMBY suit into the courtroom.

Most NIMBY suits are about as pointless as the polyester leisure suit I purchased in the early seventies, a shameful moment in my life I hope never to repeat.

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Posted by tree68 on Tuesday, February 13, 2018 2:03 PM

Firelock76
And Overmod, those guys knew how to work back in those days!  Hey, it took only 18 months to build the Empire State Building!  Pretty pathetic when you see how long some construction projects take nowadays.

Speaking of NIMBY's, can you imagine the wailing and knashing of teeth were a railroad try to pull off something NYC did not once but (at least) twice in the early 1900's - completely change the course of a major river.  The Central moved the Mohawk River at Little Falls after the Gulf Curve wreck, and also moved the Mohawk River at Utica because it had a tendency to flood the station there.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Tuesday, February 13, 2018 3:23 PM

Oh yeah, and don't forget the environmental impact studies.  There's a proposed light rail project up in New Jersey that's been the subject of numerous EIS's for nearly ten years.  Never mind there's been a rail line there since 1859!

And this new one won't be belching smoke and cinders!

In my humble opinion EIS's have gone beyond a sincere effort to protect the environment into a racket worthy of anything Al Capone might have thought up.

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Posted by BaltACD on Tuesday, February 13, 2018 4:46 PM

Firelock76
Oh yeah, and don't forget the environmental impact studies.  There's a proposed light rail project up in New Jersey that's been the subject of numerous EIS's for nearly ten years.  Never mind there's been a rail line there since 1859!

And this new one won't be belching smoke and cinders!

In my humble opinion EIS's have gone beyond a sincere effort to protect the environment into a racket worthy of anything Al Capone might have thought up.

The preparation of EIS and then their presentation and appeal process have no care for the enviornment and everything to do with running up costs, cost overruns and delay.  Delay being the primary tool of the NIMBY's.

         

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Posted by mudchicken on Friday, February 16, 2018 1:54 AM

Back to the OP, the M&B Bridge was under rehab/replacement when it failed. The material and labor was already there. (Now if the decisions of the bridge contractor and an FRA bridge inspector there before the collapse had been a little different...) 

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Posted by ccltrains on Friday, February 16, 2018 8:08 AM

If paper could be used to build bridges just stack up the EIS studies/reports and the piers would be complete.

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Posted by LithoniaOperator on Friday, February 16, 2018 11:03 AM

mudchicken

Back to the OP, the M&B Bridge was under rehab/replacement when it failed. The material and labor was already there. (Now if the decisions of the bridge contractor and an FRA bridge inspector there before the collapse had been a little different...) 

 

Aha. Makes more sense now. Thanks, mudchicken.

Yes . . . maybe not a great decison to allow that particular train on the bridge at that time!

Oops - Sign

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Posted by Overmod on Friday, February 16, 2018 11:17 AM

LithoniaOperator
Yes . . . maybe not a great decision to allow that particular train on the bridge at that time!

Can I say it now? ... that it wasn't rocket science to make that decision?  No? Oops, too late... Big Smile

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Posted by samfp1943 on Friday, February 16, 2018 6:11 PM

mudchicken

Back to the OP, the M&B Bridge was under rehab/replacement when it failed. The material and labor was already there. (Now if the decisions of the bridge contractor and an FRA bridge inspector there before the collapse had been a little different...) 

 

Just to sort od bring this back to reality...The incident[Bridge Collapse] happened in May of 2007. on The Meridian& Bigbee RR near Demopolis, Ala. The train involved was an 'escorted move' run from Salt Lack City area to Cape Kennedy, Fl.

       It was a move of solid rocket booster motors for the space shuttle, power appears to have been a couple of UPRR SD70's(?).  Weight of the two engines, is something on the order of 400,000#s, each, ( 'give or take' +20,000 lbs, each(?). My guess, is that that 'bridge was dicey' at best, for that move(?); even if it was in any kind of condition, even approaching, excelent condtion. (?).

photo linked @ https://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=1172564

 

Sam

 

 


 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Saturday, February 17, 2018 8:14 PM

Firelock76

 

 
tree68
 
 The old Portageville bridge is being taken down as we speak.
 

 

 

Correct.  The sad thing is NS offered the bridge to the state of New York as part of a hiking trail, which means the bridge would have lasted who knows how much longer with only pedestrian traffic, but New York said "No thanks!"

Maybe a wise decision in the short term, but in the long term I'll bet they'll be sorry.

And Overmod, those guys knew how to work back in those days!  Hey, it took only 18 months to build the Empire State Building!  Pretty pathetic when you see how long some construction projects take nowadays.

 

I have been to Letchworth State Park and I don't recall any shortage of trails.  Can't imagine the state of New York would want to shoulder the $millions to maintain or eventually dismantle the bridge.  Perhaps their neighbor state's Kinzua Bridge experience soured them on these things.  I suspect the real reason is that the Genesee gorge (Grand Canyon of NY?) runs for miles thru the park, and they did not think the views would be enhanced by a second old RR bridge next to a new one.

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