SD70M-2DudeAround here they have to use something stronger, as much of the trackside weed growth is from spilled grain or seeds that have been genetically engineered to be Roundup-resistant. Not sure what it is, but it sure smells different than Roundup.
Here are a couple of the results of the law of unintended consequences in action. I confess I didn't actively think of the considerable spillage of resistant GMO seed on railroad property ... or the subsequent potential maturing of plants and dispersion of pollen or seed from them ... until reading that post. (There are presently 2,4D-resistant species being marketed, and a pitch to use blended 2,4D and glyphosate with reduced volatility, to get around some of the acquired-resistance issues with weeds, too).
Here (thanks, Alberta!) is a nifty chart showing all the group classifications of commercial herbicide, which indicates their methods of action. (I am sorry that the European counterpart of USAN, whatever it is, uses such cutesie childish-appearing generic names!)
Group 9, which iirc are synthetic auxins, are the chemicals we've been discussing; I suspect the chemicals used on railway ROW are far more broad-spectrum than selective growth enhancers ... and likely to be (said cynically) the cheapest thing consonant with low overspray and leaching to groundwater...
CMStPnP Also, yes I meant ROUNDUP.
Also, yes I meant ROUNDUP.
Around here they have to use something stronger, as much of the trackside weed growth is from spilled grain or seeds that have been genetically engineered to be Roundup-resistant.
Not sure what it is, but it sure smells different than Roundup. Also impossible to get the smell out of clothing (exposed from working a switcher the day after they sprayed the yard).
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
Firelock76Well, let's be fair here. The BEST fish n' chips dinner I ever had was in a restaurant in Portsmouth (UK) in 1976.
Yes, but to be strictly fair you'll have to show me the cordon bleu recipe for fish 'n chips...
No doubt but that when it's done right it's really good. I prefer tempura, but that's almost a variant of the same idea.
RME You mean RoundUP, right? (Were you thinking subconsciously of the Milwaukee Road? ) Note that Roundup (glyphosate) is supposed to be different from the mix of 2,4D and 2,4,5T in Agent Orange -- in particular it is supposed to have no 2,4,7,8TCDD dioxin in it, which was the contaminant that I recall causing most of the trouble.
You mean RoundUP, right? (Were you thinking subconsciously of the Milwaukee Road? )
Note that Roundup (glyphosate) is supposed to be different from the mix of 2,4D and 2,4,5T in Agent Orange -- in particular it is supposed to have no 2,4,7,8TCDD dioxin in it, which was the contaminant that I recall causing most of the trouble.
My dad's comment on glyphosphate was that it looked fairly innocuous to him and he had a PhD in Biochemistry. It was my understanding as well that the hazards from Agent Orange were from the contaminant as well, with these contanminants arising from the production of 2,4D and 2,4,5T.
Well, let's be fair here. The BEST fish n' chips dinner I ever had was in a restaurant in Portsmouth (UK) in 1976. I'd go there again in a heartbeat.
The waitress was "Brit Babe" cute too! Loved her accent. God knows what she thought of mine.
Paul of Covington I must have missed something--why did the Belgians hire a British chef?
Because the train and the company are British - I think they're just operating in Belgium presumably with leased or assigned power.
The humor prospects were far funnier when I thought it was a native Belgian operation.
RME Firelock76 ... I was thinking about when the days work is done and the on-board cordon bleu chef is working his magic in the kitchen, Mozart or Haydn is playing on the onboard sound-system... Isn't "British cordon bleu chef' a bit of an oxymoron? Although it might be interesting to see what Brits would play by choice on the stereo to kick back...
Firelock76 ... I was thinking about when the days work is done and the on-board cordon bleu chef is working his magic in the kitchen, Mozart or Haydn is playing on the onboard sound-system...
Isn't "British cordon bleu chef' a bit of an oxymoron? Although it might be interesting to see what Brits would play by choice on the stereo to kick back...
I must have missed something--why did the Belgians hire a British chef?
_____________
"A stranger's just a friend you ain't met yet." --- Dave Gardner
RME wrote the following post 3 hours ago [in part]:"...Note that Roundup (glyphosate) is supposed to be different from the mix of 2,4D and 2,4,5T in Agent Orange -- in particular it is supposed to have no 2,4,7,8TCDD dioxin in it, which was the contaminant that I recall causing most of the trouble.
RME is exactly right ! Without getting into the weeds on this issue: Dioxin was an ingredient that was not teacked in the original product documantation provided to the government on its purchases. Dioxin was a product of the manufacturing process, and was produced when the tech material was left in the process heating equipment for varing reasons (breakdowns, other delays,) Since it was not tracked and reported, it became an unknown. It was a key ingredient that creaqted all the health issue for those that were 'exposed' to it.
Also 'AGENT ORANGE' became the name for that whole family of herbicides used in RVN. The barrels containing the herbicide products, were color coded to the manufacturers, Dow Chem, Rhone Plunk(?) and a number of others, as well. Orange, Pink, white, purple, blue and green, were some colors, I remember .
RME- I would wager that no one on the forum can get through all 45 minutes of that grunge.
RME: This was back in the 1980's but he said at OSMOSE they would climb the piers of the trestle drill holes and inject the crap into the piers every so often. He said a lot of the trestles of ICG in the South were pretty bad in the missing timber department and some would shake or rock when a train went over them. They were supposed to climb down and stand away from the trestle when a train went over it but sometimes their lookout would miss a train or be distracted.
Hmmm, Agent Orange. It ain't Karen Souza's Strawberry Fields, but it has its delights...
Hmmm, Agent Orange. Reminds me of a story from Vietnam...
A Marine helicopter's flying over the jungle and the crew chief's throwing cartons of cigarettes out an open hatch. The pilot sees him and...
"Sergeant! What are you doing back there?"
"Throwing cigarettes to the VC, Captain!"
"What the hell are you doing THAT for?"
"Well Skipper, cancer takes longer but it kills 'em just as dead!"
CMStPnP First he said they use a variant of ROUNDOUT for the weeds.
...they inject a lot of goo into those wooden trestles to keep the wood from rotting and the insects at bay. He never understood what was in the goo but said it was fairly toxic as well.
Here are some Osmose notes (lightly edited) on what they use:
An effective external groundline treatment must have the following characteristics:
BaltACDGuess there is no Rule G in weed spraying!
This might surprise you but the Europeans are allowed to drink both on duty as service members and drink alchol while conducting business as civilians. McDonald's in Germany serves more beer than soda. At least they could in the 1980's. So it is possible they can drink while between shifts of operating trains or railway equipment. The catch-22 is their DUI / OUI laws. In Germany the police can forcibly administer or have administered a blood alchol test without your consent at their discretion. The threshold was .08 when I was there in the 1980's but it is probably been lowered since.
Firelock76 Wow. I wonder what kind of a wine cellar that rig has.
Wow. I wonder what kind of a wine cellar that rig has.
The first thing that went through my mind when I watched that video was that scene from the movie "Apocolypse Now" where that General is trying to get his own Winnebago into Vietnam for quarters.....lol. When I was stationed in Europe it was always a kick to see how the Europeans did things at a few comfort levels higher then the United States. Still remember the hotplates and coolers in the Bristish Armored Personell Carriers and the response of Bristish Troops when we asked how they rate all the luxuries: "Well, war is no reason to be uncivilized.".....classic British answer.
On CSX Weed Spraying was contracted out with CSX supplying locomotives and crew to move the equipment where the contractor directed. The same Weed Spray Foreman returned year after year.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
samfp1943An observation; Notice the open air crew working compartments on the CN Spray Train vs. the 'enclosed working areas' of the European Weed Control train. Maybe, it is just me? But speaking as someone who has lived with the effects of herbicide poisioning (Agent Orange,etc) since 1967/68. Have we learned nothing in those intervening years?
My Sister dated a guy for a while that worked for railroad contractor OSMOSE. Learned a lot from his perspective. First he said they use a variant of ROUNDOUT for the weeds. He worked a lot on the wooden railroad trestles and was particularly critical of ICG and their trestle maintenance.......not that he was an expert. At any rate they inject a lot of goo into those wooden trestles to keep the wood from rotting and the insects at bay. He never understood what was in the goo but said it was fairly toxic as well.
Overall though, I think on a per mile basis railroads use so little of the toxic stuff compared to roads and asphalt highways.........they should be a lower priority. Just my opinion though.
RME: I laughed out loud at your oxymoron!
Best restaurant in any UK town: the French one.
The music: When I listen to British radio I hear lots of Haydn & Mozart, but they're also big on Handel (morning), Coates (afternoon), and Vaughan Williams and Elgar (evening), as well as the usual else.
Firelock76... I was thinking about when the days work is done and the on-board cordon bleu chef is working his magic in the kitchen, Mozart or Haydn is playing on the onboard sound-system...
BaltACD Firelock76 Wow. I wonder what kind of a wine cellar that rig has. Guess there is no Rule G in weed spraying!
Guess there is no Rule G in weed spraying!
Oh, I'm sure there is, but I was thinking about when the days work is done and the on-board cordon bleu chef is working his magic in the kitchen, Mozart or Haydn is playing on the onboard sound-system...
The weed-spraying company is separate from the railroads in question, I think, and evidently doesn't have a blanket proscription against alcohol in the dorms. Bet there are regulations about 'drinking on duty', though...
Firelock76Wow. I wonder what kind of a wine cellar that rig has.
They could always return to the old standby...steam, but I wouldn't worry about anything changing anytime soon in North America, we're not as paranoid as the Europeans are.
CMStPnP https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sp3GPaQL0Hg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sp3GPaQL0Hg
Linked @https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gr_qjHtWnwI#t=170.292625
An observation; Notice the open air crew working compartments on the CN Spray Train vs. the 'enclosed working areas' of the European Weed Control train.
Maybe, it is just me? But speaking as someone who has lived with the effects of herbicide poisioning (Agent Orange,etc) since 1967/68. Have we learned nothing in those intervening years?
Operation Ranch Hand was the application operation of the USAF, utilized aircraft (C-123s) for low level spraying of vegetation in RVN. Due to the ambient heat of the areas and the low level flying conditions; the aircrews generally operated with every opening in the aircraft opened to provide ventilation. Low speeds, and low flight levels caused a lot of the product sprayed to get sucked back into the body of the aircraft, and on to the crews.
Those crews have since suffered high incidences of cancers, and organ failures; all due to their exposures during those application flights. And I see railroad crews, in virtually, similar exposure situations on the railroad spray trains in this country.
It just seems that we Americans do not learn too quickly, at times... Just my personal observations.
Hope they're still using that good old 567 power, too!
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