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Crew Reduction > "And then there was one."

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Crew Reduction > "And then there was one."
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 5:20 PM
So the idea has been kicking around, and now it's starting to come more into the forefront.

There are a few railways that already engage in Engineer Only Operations, such as the Cartier (Iron Ore) Railway in Quebec, Canada.

The idea that freights on Class One Railways (when possible) would be running with a single crew member in the locomotive doesn't seem quite right to me, but it seems like this is more of a reality in the future than a far-fetched idea.

Seems that railways would prefer to get rid of the few remaining classes of running trades employess and just have everyone trained to do the same thing "a transportation employee."

I understand clearly why railways would want to do this to save not only costs, but also make crew calling much easier, you'll only have to have one list of employees and they all have the same credentials.

What are some of your thoughts on the one manned-crew, would like to hear others opinions.


QUOTE:
(The following story by Larry Swisher was published by the Bureau of National Affair’s Daily Labor Report on November 26.)
WASHINGTON, D.C. -- Negotiations between a dozen unions and the five largest U.S. freight railroads for new contracts to cover 155,000 employees have barely begun but already face stumbling blocks, according to labor representatives.


Although face-to-face sessions have yet to be scheduled, the latest round of national bargaining officially began Nov. 1, when the National Carriers' Conference Committee, representing the railroads, began exchanging written lists of demands with the unions, which negotiate separately except on health and welfare issues.


Heading the carriers' list of major demands is a proposal to do away with minimum crew sizes on trains as well as to eliminate the different operating employee crafts, such as engineer, conductor, and switchman. Instead, the railroads want to be able to use a single qualified "transportation employee" to operate a train under some conditions instead of the current requirement for at least one engineer and one conductor on each locomotive.


Unions leaders said the proposal raises safety and other concerns and has the potential of forcing some of the various unions that represent the operating crafts to go out of business or merge with others. Paul Thompson, president of the United Transportation Union, which represents most conductors, said because of the railroads' "extreme" demands, "we are in store for a difficult round of negotiations."


The unions also are fighting another sweeping proposal by the railroads to replace the industry's unique workers' compensation system, established under the 1908 Federal Employees' Liability Act. That law permits railroad workers who suffer serious injuries on the job to sue companies for damages in addition to lost wages and medical costs. Labor leaders vowed to oppose the railroads' bid to develop a legislative proposal for Congress that would enact a no-fault-type program like the joint federal-state workers' compensation system for on-the-job injuries in most other industries.
The current contracts, which become amendable Jan. 1, will remain in effect indefinitely as long as negotiations continue. In previous rounds, the two sides sometimes have taken three or four years to reach agreements.
Don Hahs, president of the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers, which represents 30,000 engineers and other railroad workers, said the key issue in this round of negotiations is the carriers' proposal to do away with the traditional train operating and engine service crafts and consolidate them into a "transportation employee" category, working under a single collective bargaining agreement.


"I doubt very seriously that they'll get to that point," Hahs told BNA Nov. 19.
Hahs said he believes the railroads' underlying goal is to secure changes in the contracts that will enable them to dictate how many employees and which ones will make up the crew for any train, depending on the workload and trip.
"Everything with the carriers is cost control--doing more with less," he said. "People are not equipment."


The carriers, which include the Burlington Northern and Santa Fe Railway Co., CSX Transportation, Kansas City Southern Railway Co., Norfolk Southern Railway Co., and Union Pacific, have increased volume, revenues, and employment over the past year as economic growth has picked up.
Currently, because of a shortage of qualified crews and booming freight business, employees are working too many days and shifts without sufficient rest, Hahs and UTU officials agreed. "They are being pushed in many cases beyond their limit," Hahs said, adding that a number of accidents have occurred recently because of fatigue.


The far-reaching implications of the railroads' train crew proposal prompted BLE, which competes with UTU for membership among operating employees, to ask all rail unions to join in a coalition to bargain collectively with the carriers, presenting a united front against the crew change. By agreeing to bargain jointly, the unions could prevent the railroads from reaching a detrimental agreement with one union that would become a pattern for subsequent negotiations with the others, Hahs said. UTU represents about 46,000 employees.


In response to the coalition proposition, UTU along with most other major rail labor organizations sent representatives to a meeting Nov. 22 in Washington, D.C., aimed at reaching agreement on the proposed coalition. UTU and the Transportation Communications Union declined to join, however, according to Hahs and a UTU spokesman. Organizations representing maintenance of way employees, signalmen, firemen, and oilers agreed to be part of the group, Hahs said, and most other unions also are expected to join. "Obviously we left the door open for the others to reconsider and be a part of it as time goes by," he told BNA Nov. 23. Even without UTU and TCU, the group will represent a majority--probably about 53 percent--of all railroad workers, he said.
UTU spokesman Frank Wilner said UTU already has an agreement with the carriers that every train will carry a conductor, while BLE does not have a similar agreement for engineers. "Only a fool would open the hen house door and provide a power of attorney and negotiating power to someone who might not have the best interests of the UTU at heart," Wilner said.


Freight Railroads Seek Productivity Gains

The current contracts require the railroads to use more employees than needed with today's improved technology and increased use of computers and other technology, NCCC Chairman Robert Allen said Nov. 9.
"So we want to use only those number of employees required, not more," Allen said in an interview. The fact that the operating employees have two unions is "their business," he said. "But it's like having two unions in the cockpit of an airplane. It doesn't make sense." If the change to a one-person crew means the two unions have to merge, "so be it," he said.


Unlike most railroad unions, UTU is not affiliated with the AFL-CIO, and the rivalry between UTU and BLE has intensified since BLE members voted in December 2001 to reject a proposed merger with UTU (237 DLR A-1, 12/12/01). This year, both BLE and the Brotherhood of Maintenance of Way Employes, which represents about 35,000 workers, voted to join the International Brotherhood of Teamsters as independent divisions in a new railway conference of the IBT.


The carriers' group explained that over the past 20 years, new technologies, such as remote control devices, have been introduced that improve both the safety and productivity of railroad operations. Despite recent growth in freight volume and income, companies still struggle to fund the high capital costs of building and maintaining rail infrastructure, Allen said.

Consolidating the operating employee crafts and reducing crew sizes will lead to "steady business growth, new job opportunities in the long run, and a stronger, more balanced national transportation system," the railroads said.
A growing number of retirements among the aging rail workforce will allow the productivity improvements to be made without causing employees to lose jobs, Allen said.

Amtrak, which bargains separately from the freight carriers, has used one-person passenger train crews on limited-duration trips for many years, he said. "When we can safely operate with one person, that's what we're after," Allen said.


But Hahs said one-person Amtrak trains are allowed only on trips lasting less than six hours. The Northeast corridor, where most of those trains operate, has automatic train stops, so if something happens to the engineer, the train cannot move, he said.


"There's a lot to be considered" in discussing crew sizes and composition, Hahs said. He suggested that the railroads would be better off keeping two operating employees on each train but training conductors to relieve engineers for short periods en route to reduce fatigue. "It would make for safer operating and wouldn't take near the redefining of the workplace," he said.


Workers' Compensation System Called 'Corrupt.'
Allen criticized the rail workers' compensation system under the Federal Employees' Liability Act as a "a fault-based system that pits one side against the other."


Many injury claims end up in court and jury trials, he said. "A lot of time and money" is spent on the process, and a large portion of the damages awarded goes to trial lawyers, not the employees, Allen said. "This system breeds corruption," he added.


"We feel strongly that FELA needs to be changed," he said. "We're asking labor to work with us on a win-win solution and together go to Congress."

Critics of the system gained fuel for their arguments with the recent convictions of two former UTU officials on racketeering charges for soliciting cash payments from lawyers who received official approval from the Cleveland-based union to represent members in FELA cases. In July, a federal judge sentenced former UTU presidents Byron Boyd of Seattle and Charles A Little of Leander, Texas, to serve two years in prison without parole and forfeit to the government $100,000 each in racketeering proceeds (134 DLR A-14, 7/14/04).


UTU spokesman Frank Wilner said replacing FELA would reduce safety and that the union responded to the scandal by terminating the two officers and establishing an ethics board headed by former National Mediation Board Chairman Joshua Javits. The new board has created and will enforce rules of conduct for UTU-approved attorneys as well as for all UTU officers, members, and employees.


To continue to be designated by the union to represent members, attorneys had to attest in writing that they did not make any such illegal cash contributions.


"When juries award damages under FELA, strong messages are sent to carriers that they cannot ignore workplace safety without paying an even greater price than if they corrected the unsafe workplace conditions to begin with," UTU's Thompson said.


The railroads need to do a better job of "protecting the public and their employees from real dangers rather than attacking an injury compensation program," Wilner said. "This is another shocking example of putting profit above safety."
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 5:27 PM
Some of this is aimed at reducing 3 man crews to 2 man as well. Think about all the 3 man yard jobs going to 2 man Remote jobs already.

As to one man crews I think it can work well under certain well defined situation such as short distance locals and shuttle type junit trains. I seem to recall an article in TRAINS a couple years back about the Indiana RR and hom Tom Hoback and his guys were running mainline trains with one man crews as well as some local or switching operations that wouldn't support a 2 man crew.

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Posted by railman on Monday, November 29, 2004 5:34 PM
Scary stuff. It's bound to happen, but it's too bad, in my book.
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Posted by martin.knoepfel on Monday, November 29, 2004 5:42 PM
European railroads run freight trains with one-man-crews. there is no safety-problem.
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 6:23 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by martin.knoepfel

European railroads run freight trains with one-man-crews. there is no safety-problem.


Ah, but thefre are other issues. Check out this month's TRAINS magazine article about european freight railroading. Simply put, one man crews run shorter, lighter trains and are less able to perform switching enroute. In addition, there can be safety issues as well...

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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 6:26 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by Limitedclear

QUOTE: Originally posted by martin.knoepfel

European railroads run freight trains with one-man-crews. there is no safety-problem.


Ah, but thefre are other issues. Check out this month's TRAINS magazine article about european freight railroading. Simply put, one man crews run shorter, lighter trains and are less able to perform switching enroute. In addition, there can be safety issues as well...

LC


Yes, that was a good article.

European railroading, really is an entirely different story altogether.
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 6:27 PM
In the past how many people worked on a single freight train. Also, how about passenger trains. In the late 60's I heard more people worked on some trains than rode them California Zepher
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 6:30 PM
Ya well very soon you won't be seeing NO Trains with any Humans at all!
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 6:33 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by CHPENNSYLVANIA

In the past how many people worked on a single freight train. Also, how about passenger trains. In the late 60's I heard more people worked on some trains than rode them California Zepher


At one time there was a mightly crew of 5 to run a freight train.

In the locomotive there was the Engineer, Fireman, Head End Brakeman.
In the Caboose there was the Conductor and Tail End Brakeman.

The Fireman was the first to go, leaving the train with 4 crew members, then they ditched the caboose and tail-end brakeman.

They also then got rid of the head-end brakemen on most trains (usually just locals will have a brakeman nowadays) leaving the trains with a crew of two, and now of course the next logical step, they want to ditch the conductor and run with a single crew member.
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 7:18 PM
Way down here in New Zealand we have been running single man trains since the late 80's.

http://www.steelribbons.org.nz/
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Posted by ajmiller on Monday, November 29, 2004 7:36 PM
In the old days, didn't the Conductor outrank the Engineer? And today with 2 man crews, doesn't the Engineer outrank the Conductor? How have the duties of the Conductor changed? When they got rid of cabooses, did the former Conductors get demoted?
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 8:04 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by ajmiller

In the old days, didn't the Conductor outrank the Engineer? And today with 2 man crews, doesn't the Engineer outrank the Conductor? How have the duties of the Conductor changed? When they got rid of cabooses, did the former Conductors get demoted?


The conductor was never demoted.

The conductor has always been responsible for the administration of the train, whereas the engineer is responsible for the physical running of the train.

Technically you could say that the conductor is still the boss, even though if that train goes through a red light, both conductor and engineer will be responsible.

From CROR rules 106 ---

106. CREW RESPONSIBILITIES

(a) A train will run under the direction of its conductor.

(b) The locomotive engineer of a train is in charge of and responsible for the operation of the engine of such train. 

(c) When a train is operated without a conductor, the locomotive engineer will perform the duties of the conductor. 

(d) The conductor and locomotive engineer, (also pilot if any) are responsible for the safe operation of the train or equipment in their charge and for the observance of the rules. Under conditions not provided for by the rules, they must take every precaution for protection. Other crew members are not relieved of their responsibility under the rules. 
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Posted by ajmiller on Monday, November 29, 2004 8:25 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by macguy
Technically you could say that the conductor is still the boss, even though if that train goes through a red light, both conductor and engineer will be responsible.


But aren't today's conductors paid less and have less experience than the engineers? It seems a little backwards to call the conductor the boss. I always thought that in the old days, engineers were promoted to become conductors, but today conductors are promoted to become engineers. Maybe the term conductor is a misnomer for the modern position. Do today's conductors do paperwork for managing their trains?
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 8:42 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by ajmiller

QUOTE: Originally posted by macguy
Technically you could say that the conductor is still the boss, even though if that train goes through a red light, both conductor and engineer will be responsible.


But aren't today's conductors paid less and have less experience than the engineers? It seems a little backwards to call the conductor the boss. I always thought that in the old days, engineers were promoted to become conductors, but today conductors are promoted to become engineers. Maybe the term conductor is a misnomer for the modern position. Do today's conductors do paperwork for managing their trains?


Yes it does seem a little backwards, nowadays running trades employees are hired on as conductors, and when (if) the time comes, they are trained to become locomotive engineers.

Yes, the conductors on the trains today are responsible for the paperwork, and talking on the radio, etc.

Really, all the locomotive engineer does is run the locomotive, the conductor does pretty much everything else.

It does seems backward, perhaps, but it is the way it's done nowadays.
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 9:12 PM
Much of the time, especially with new hires (like myself not too long ago), engineers end up taking control of the train, radio, and thinking out the moves because many of us newbies are marked up without knowing our head from our feet. Thankfully most engineers will help you and are patient as long as you listen to what they have to say and for god sakes don't sleep on them!!!!! In my experience most engineers like to use the radio to call signals and get through work authorities themselves. Each engineer is different. I have worked with some that simply want to run and that's it. I talk on the radio, etc. I'm easy come easy go, so it's really up to the engineer when it comes to the radio.
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Posted by Nora on Monday, November 29, 2004 9:35 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by ajmiller


But aren't today's conductors paid less and have less experience than the engineers? It seems a little backwards to call the conductor the boss. I always thought that in the old days, engineers were promoted to become conductors, but today conductors are promoted to become engineers. Maybe the term conductor is a misnomer for the modern position. Do today's conductors do paperwork for managing their trains?


It was explained to me one time that when there used to be larger crews, brakemen were promoted to conductor and firemen were promoted to engineer, and those were two separate things. That's how I understood it, anyway. As far as I know, ever since there have been only conductors and engineers on most trains, new employees start off as conductors and then get promoted to engineer. But don't quote me on that...I'm sure someone will come along and correct me if I am wrong. :)
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Posted by TH&B on Monday, November 29, 2004 9:52 PM
Single man crews can be done, but will it save? First you should have CTC or some other train control that the engineer can keep his eyes on the road, we have CTC in many places but not everywhere yet.

Then you need to address breakdowns such as broken hoses, bad orders, knuckes including some of the false alarms. This can be done by running shorter trains and/or having mobile brakeman in pickup trucks roaming the roads around the subdivision.

Then you have work on route, swichting at lineside industries and yards. This again can use the mobile brakeman or increased staff at yards.

Some technoligies could help.

Then you have to deal with bad weather.

Trains would get over the road slower, block swapping less of an option (or run short trains again). But like I said, it can be done, but would it save money?




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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 9:52 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by Nora

QUOTE: Originally posted by ajmiller


But aren't today's conductors paid less and have less experience than the engineers? It seems a little backwards to call the conductor the boss. I always thought that in the old days, engineers were promoted to become conductors, but today conductors are promoted to become engineers. Maybe the term conductor is a misnomer for the modern position. Do today's conductors do paperwork for managing their trains?


It was explained to me one time that when there used to be larger crews, brakemen were promoted to conductor and firemen were promoted to engineer, and those were two separate things. That's how I understood it, anyway. As far as I know, ever since there have been only conductors and engineers on most trains, new employees start off as conductors and then get promoted to engineer. But don't quote me on that...I'm sure someone will come along and correct me if I am wrong. :)


That's correct Nora.

There used to be "Train Service" (Brakemen and Conductors)
and "Engine Service" (Firemen and Engineers).

As you stated, Brakemen would become Conductors and Firemen would become Engineers. Depending on seniority in their area, some brakemen would transfer from Train service to Engine service because their seniority could hold better jobs on the other board, and visa versa, a fireman my transfer from engine service to train service so he could hold a better job.

Generally you didn't go back and forth, you were usually one or the other and that would be your career path (Train or Engine Service).

That's also why you have engineers out there that have never been conductors, and conductors out there that never took engineer training, those guys are the last of the breed, as now all new hires start in train service then are trained too become engineers when seniority permits.

Now, with the article above, it sounds like the RRs want to get rid of the titles of "Conductors and Engineers" and just have a single employee that is qualified to run a train. A "Train Service Employee."

Now how that would work with new hires is beyond me, I would have to think new hires would have to be paired up with someone for a substancial amount of time before they would be "let loose" to run an entire train all on their own.

It's the evolution of the running trades - so to speak.
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 10:00 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by 440cuin

Single man crews can be done, but will it save? First you should have CTC or some other train control that the engineer can keep his eyes on the road, we have CTC in many places but not everywhere yet.

Then you need to address breakdowns such as broken hoses, bad orders, knuckes including some of the false alarms. This can be done by running shorter trains and/or having mobile brakeman in pickup trucks roaming the roads around the subdivision.

Then you have work on route, swichting at lineside industries and yards. This again can use the mobile brakeman or increased staff at yards.

Some technoligies could help.

Then you have to deal with bad weather.

Trains would get over the road slower, block swapping less of an option (or run short trains again). But like I said, it can be done, but would it save money?





Those are definately some of the issues that come to mind. And I'm sure if it weren't for those reasons, we would already be seeing wide-spread one man operations.

As I mentioned, the Cartier railway in Quebec runs engineer only..... but they run nothing but solid unit trains of Iron Ore, never any work on-line.

If the train brakes a knuckle or has a problem, then Cartier simply flies a guy out in a helicopter, they fix the problem and away the train goes.

The thoughts of "Road Brakemen" sound interesting, as it probably would be cheaper to have a certain number of brakemen or conductors (call them what you want) on the roads ready to go when something goes wrong, they can be in 3 shifts of 8 hours, and chances are you would rarely have to worry about overtime.

The one major problem that comes to mind is that there are still many parts of the railways out there that aren't easily accessable by truck, and that would certainly create problems.
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 29, 2004 11:01 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by macguy

QUOTE: Originally posted by Nora

QUOTE: Originally posted by ajmiller


But aren't today's conductors paid less and have less experience than the engineers? It seems a little backwards to call the conductor the boss. I always thought that in the old days, engineers were promoted to become conductors, but today conductors are promoted to become engineers. Maybe the term conductor is a misnomer for the modern position. Do today's conductors do paperwork for managing their trains?


It was explained to me one time that when there used to be larger crews, brakemen were promoted to conductor and firemen were promoted to engineer, and those were two separate things. That's how I understood it, anyway. As far as I know, ever since there have been only conductors and engineers on most trains, new employees start off as conductors and then get promoted to engineer. But don't quote me on that...I'm sure someone will come along and correct me if I am wrong. :)


That's correct Nora.

There used to be "Train Service" (Brakemen and Conductors)
and "Engine Service" (Firemen and Engineers).

As you stated, Brakemen would become Conductors and Firemen would become Engineers. Depending on seniority in their area, some brakemen would transfer from Train service to Engine service because their seniority could hold better jobs on the other board, and visa versa, a fireman my transfer from engine service to train service so he could hold a better job.

Generally you didn't go back and forth, you were usually one or the other and that would be your career path (Train or Engine Service).

That's also why you have engineers out there that have never been conductors, and conductors out there that never took engineer training, those guys are the last of the breed, as now all new hires start in train service then are trained too become engineers when seniority permits.

Now, with the article above, it sounds like the RRs want to get rid of the titles of "Conductors and Engineers" and just have a single employee that is qualified to run a train. A "Train Service Employee."

Now how that would work with new hires is beyond me, I would have to think new hires would have to be paired up with someone for a substancial amount of time before they would be "let loose" to run an entire train all on their own.

It's the evolution of the running trades - so to speak.


Well, before I hired out they were already calling us APEs. That acronym stood for "All Purpose Employee". It basically will work the same way it does now. New hires will be hired and trained in conductor/trainman training over a few weeks. Next they will be sent to a yard where they will be trained including remote control operations. They will work in two man crews under supervision. They will also work over the road as road utility men covering a territory with a pickup equipped with basic tools and parts to assist trains over the road or assist with local switching. After a reasonable time, they will be sent to locomotive engineer school and trained as engineers. They will then break in on locals and through trains with a senior engineer as locomotive engineer trainees. Later they will be assigned to jobs or extra lists as their seniority allows. There will be a single roster and lists will be established for the different categories of work.

Thats the view I have in general. How soon? I'd say within 5 years it will begin moving significantly in that direction. It already has been for at least 10 years...

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Posted by TH&B on Monday, November 29, 2004 11:29 PM
Does the Cartier run with signaled track, CTC or other? Otherwise if it is dark territory how can a single engineer be safe?

Single man crews sound expensive to me. Fly in an APE !? That sounds like a cheap solution, and if you run short trains you might not ever have so many broken knuckles. But then you need an engineer for each short train. How can you save?
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Posted by jeaton on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 12:01 AM
I would guess the railroads have shoved some numbers around and concluded that even with the cost of personel traveling to deal with problems on the road, reducing train crews by one man has the potential for generating a big chunk of cash.

I think the unions will go to the wall on this one, and they may be successful in holding the line at least for this round. Until they can demonstrate methods for dealing with a lone engine operator becoming disabled, the railroads are going be in a big fight on the safety issue.

Jay

"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo Possum "We have met the anemone... and he is Russ." Bucky Katt "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future." Niels Bohr, Nobel laureate in physics

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Posted by dharmon on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 10:35 AM
Drawing a parallel to aviation, the single operator concept is flawed, even with technology assisting. From a safety point of view single piloted aircraft have a significantly higher mishap rate than multi-piloted aircraft, which is why airliners still have two pilots, whether or not they are both needed all the time. Task saturation, target/objective fixation and distraction cause single piloted aircraft to plow into the ground all the time. Even with whiz bang technology, the Navy is reverting back to two seat strike aircraft, to minimize crew task loading and operational effectiveness.

You may not need two guys in the cab all the time, but I'm sure that when you do, two isn't enough. If you go to one, might as well go to none.
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Posted by greyhounds on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 11:31 AM
The Inidana Rail Road runs one man crews and doesn't seem to have significant problems doing so.

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.
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Posted by rrnut282 on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 11:43 AM
I think that several safety issues would have to be solved before one-man crews become the 'norm'. First, I see it as practical or cost-saving in only two situations: a mainline, through train with no switching in Automatic Train Stop Territory or a single train a day line. How will the railroads deal with the possibility of a fatigued and/or diabled operator in other situations? Relying solely on technology won't help. Technology that is "foolproof" also has more ways to fail or go into fail-safe mode (nothing moves). What about equipment problems en-route? Are the railroads going to position 'helpers' ready to assist in the changeout of a broken knuckle or air hose? You lose a good chunk of your savings paying someone to standby waiting to be called. (If I'm standing by waiting for a call, I'm not doing as I please, and I would want compensated somehow, but this is up to the unions and employees.) Then, as someone earlier posted, some locations are just not accessible. Some might argue using remotes on all trains is the answer. I don't think there are enough radio freqeuncies available (bandwidth) to eliminate interference in crowded areas like terminals from all the remotes transmitting nearly simultaneously. Having the remotes "check for a clear channel" before broadcasting may mean a fatal delay in train response to operator input. Will the cost of installing all those remotes and maintaining them result in savings? I think it will take years for that investment in equipment to pay off in reduced crew costs. How willing will everyone from the FRA on down to the operating employees be willing to compromise safety to save a buck or two? I hope the answer is not dollars.
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Posted by jeaton on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 11:46 AM
True about Indiana Rail Road, but they also operate shorter trains. As I recall from the Trains article, hey have also invested in some technology to assist the one man operation. For example, the engineer is equiped with a pack that will automaticly send a message to an operations center if the engineers falls down.

I am not suggesting that one man trains can't be done, but I would be skeptical about safety and cost effectiveness. However, it is not my call, so it will be interesting to see how the railroads and unions play this out.

Jay

"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo Possum "We have met the anemone... and he is Russ." Bucky Katt "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future." Niels Bohr, Nobel laureate in physics

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  • From: MP CF161.6 NS's New Castle District in NE Indiana
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Posted by rrnut282 on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 11:59 AM
IIRC the Indiana RR also has remote controlled power switches so that the engineer can also 'key up" a switch when needed on the radio. (Like keying up the dispatcher only it bends the iron instead of attracting the dispatcher's attention.)
Mike (2-8-2)
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Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 6:30 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by rrnut282

IIRC the Indiana RR also has remote controlled power switches so that the engineer can also 'key up" a switch when needed on the radio. (Like keying up the dispatcher only it bends the iron instead of attracting the dispatcher's attention.)


Correct. A number of railroads including BNSF and KCS use train crew controlled remote switches. KCS crews refer to the control as a "Garage Door Opener". On KCS the switches are installed on much of the "Meridian Speedway"

LC
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Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 6:31 PM
RRN-

Indiana RR is already using a U-man to follow trains and assist one man crews. Other RRs (Railnet?) also use what they refer to as a 2 man crew, but the conductor drives along in a company pickup.

LC
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Posted by arbfbe on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 6:35 PM
All of those BNSF Dash 9 units can be operated as remote units. The lead unit can either be another locomotive or a belt pack type of control. The belt packs are not currently available on the units but I imagine they could be in rather short order.

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