Crowsnest Pass

[VerMontanan]

I recently asked for some information about CP operations in the Crowsnest Pass area of Alberta and British Columbia on the CPR Yahoo group, and didn't get much in response, so will try here.

Last week I had occasion to make a short visit Crowsnest Pass.

Questions for the group:

 

1.     What is the grade westbound and eastbound approaching the pass?  I have asked this question here before.  One person responded a grade of 2 percent westbound, but just from observation, it appears that the grade is minimal, maybe even just one percent westbound.  Eastbound is short but very steep with several very sharp curves, especially in the 7 miles from Fabro to the top of Crowsnest Pass.

 

2.     Where is the actual crew change point between Lethbridge and Fort Steele? 

 

3.     Is there any revenue business in the Municipality of Crowsnest Pass?  Didn’t look like it.

 

4.     I saw a coal empties operating through the Frank Slide area.  Is this a permanent (looks like 10 MPH) slow order?

 

5.     Where are the crews based for loading the coal trains in the Sparwood area?

 

6.     The coal empties I observed at Frank (westbound) had 2 units on the head end and one cut into the train.  It also appears the junction to the branch to the Fording River mine(s) only opens west.  If this train loads there, is the head end power run around the train at Sparwood?

 

7.     If said coal train (loaded) goes back east would the three AC units be sufficient to handle the 100-some cars that were on this train up the grade from Sparwood to Crowsnest Pass?  (If so, this would suggest that the grade was less than it looks).

 

8.     Other than the entrance to the Fording River mine, is there any CTC in place anywhere on the Lethridge-Sparwood-Fort Steele-Kingsgate/Golden route?

 

9.     Is the mine on the Byron Creek subdivision still shipping.  All told, about how many coal trains daily are generated by the (5?) mines in the Sparwood area?

 

Any information should be appreciated.

 

--Mark Meyer

 

 

[K. P. Harrier]

VerMontanan (10-16):

Sounds like a nice place to visit, with clean air to breather, unlike here in Southern California, where double-stack containers I swear must bring in to Los Angeles area ports smog from China.

I would imagine railfans are almost non-existent in that area you inquired about, thus it is not surprising this thread hasn’t seen any replies except for this one to date.  Am I correct to perceiving Crowsnest Pass is on an east-west Canadian transcontinental route, or is it somewhere off the beaten path with little train traffic?

Best,

K.P.

[Dayliner]

Mark,

I can't answer all your questions, but I'll have a crack at some of them.  My principal sources are Roger G. Burrows, Railway Mileposts: British Columbia, vol. 2, and the 2012 edition of Canadian Trackside Guide.

1.  The grade eastbound is 1.2% from Michel to Crowsnest.  Don't know about westbound, but typically grades will be easier on the eastern slope of the Rockies.

2.  Crowsnest is the crew change point, unless trains run through.

3.  Don't know, but I doubt it.

4.  Don't know.

5.  As most loaded coal moves west and empties come from the west, I assume that crews for the Sparwood trains are based in Cranbrook.  It is the CP's base of operations in the East Kootenays.

6.  Originally, eastbound coal for Ontario came out of Byron Creek, and the Fording River mines shipped coal west to Vancouver.  Coal trains to and from the east would not have had to negotiate the Sparwood junction, which is set up for westward traffic.  I don't know if there are ever exceptions to this pattern, but certainly it used to be that if you saw a coal train east of the Crowsnest Pass, it was likely heading to or from Byron Creek.

7.  Don't know, but trains from Byron Creek via Fabro will avoid the steepest section of the eastbound grade to Crowsnest, which lessens as you approach the pass.

8.  According the Canadian Trackside Guide, everything in southern BC and Alberta is OCS (Occupancy Control System).  No CTC is shown, but ABS is in effect on portions of the Fording River sub.

9.  The Coal Mountain mine on the Byron Creek sub is now owned by Teck and seems to be shipping mainly to Japan these days, although some coal does still go east to Ontario.  Don't know how many trains a day come out of the region, though.

 

 

[AgentKid]

I was hoping NDG would jump in here, but I will make a couple of quick comments until then.

The Frank Slide totaly messed up the plans in the texts quoted above. The 2% number by the slide that was quoted soounds about right. There are some natural disasters you can't recover from, no matter how modern your technology is.

Also, it was noted on the Yahoo B.C. Interior Group that CP is in the process of reorganizing their operations down there. One item I can recall right now is the amagamation of the Boundary and Rossland Subs. from Warfield to Nelson.

Today is Federal Election Day here in Canada, and I will be volunteering with that, so I won't have time to check my sources until tomorrow or Wednesday. Hopefully I will have more answers then.

Bruce

 

[Bruce Kelly]

Go here:

http://multimodalways.org/docs/railroads/companies/CP/CP%20ETTs/CP%20Alberta%20SA%20%2342%20ETT%2011-22-2006.pdf

Under the Cranbrook and Crowsnest Subs, descending grades are listed.

[NDG]

Thank You!

[dizzybc]

8. Only a few small "islands" of CTC in this area. The entrance to the Fording mine and the siding at Keevil, and the junction between the Cranbrook and Fording River subs at Sparwood are CTC controlled. The junction between the Cranbrook and Windermere subs at Fort Steele is not CTC, but a remotely-controlled interlocking.