MP173 Rochelle, Il is quite the logistics community. The community owned railroad is a stroke of genious. Effingham, Il has a shortline which Fred Frailey reviewed in Trains within the last year. It has connections to both CN (IC) and CSX. I believe the same company has a similar operation in Vandalia/Smithfield, Il with connections to CSX and BNSF. Ed
Rochelle, Il is quite the logistics community. The community owned railroad is a stroke of genious.
Effingham, Il has a shortline which Fred Frailey reviewed in Trains within the last year. It has connections to both CN (IC) and CSX. I believe the same company has a similar operation in Vandalia/Smithfield, Il with connections to CSX and BNSF.
Ed
If locating in an urban area is acceptable based on other parameters, locating on a terminal road such as Conrail Shared Assets, BRC, IHB, etc. would give you access to a multitude of carriers.
If we'd like to get specific, how about Rochelle? There is a city-owned railroad that seems to be in a perpetual state of expansion, and connects with both UP and BNSF. They seem to be aggressive enough.
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
Most of the above comments are quite valid - esp. those addressing the inbound move of pellets, which correspond well with my experience and observations of many such operations.
I'd vote for a regional with:
On this and related topics, I highly recommend Trains author/ columnist Roy Blanchard's website and writings - see:
http://www.rblanchard.com/resources/index.html
- Paul North.
caldreamer The Orchard Drive Industrial park in Chambersburg, Pa is served by both CSX and NS. CSX on their former WM line and NS on the former Prr line, Both served out of their respective yards in Hagerstwon, Md, So as stated above location in an industrial park served by a Class 1 would be a good option since othe rindustries are also served by rail.
The Orchard Drive Industrial park in Chambersburg, Pa is served by both CSX and NS. CSX on their former WM line and NS on the former Prr line, Both served out of their respective yards in Hagerstwon, Md, So as stated above location in an industrial park served by a Class 1 would be a good option since othe rindustries are also served by rail.
Still have had clients that think all the receiving end has to have is a team track and the internet says there's a team track in every town, even if the receiving end doesn't have a track to its facility
It would seem to make sense to build on a shortline or regional...which has outlets to more than one railroad. In the east, that would mean access to CSX and NS while in the west UP and BNSF.
Definitely an exercise more shippers need to avail themselves of. A big part of my work involves improving shippers' supply chains, and I'm sometimes amazed that even in this techno whizbang age there's still alot of low hanging fruit to pick. In part this is because well paid traffic managers have been replaced by lower paid and less educated clerks, or in some cases, just removed and not replaced at all. The result is that shippers simply beat on their carrers for the lowest possible price without any consideration given to "the big picture" where the real cost savings are to be had.
Most Class 1's have information on their websites about requirements for siting industries. On some routes they won't let an industry build a connection onto the main unless they recieve train load quantities, "guides" industries into industrial parks.
In any case you will be dealing with a class 1 because your material supply will come from a location on a class 1 and if you ship outbound by rail (boxcar or container) the cars will be moving on a class 1.
Many moons ago a shipper was looking at locating to an existing property on a class 1 and was going to ship by rail to Mexico. He was all concerned about the schedule of the local and the boxcar supply and that stuff. I tried to warn him that all that was small potatoes, the real problem he had to work through was that last 100 yards to actually get it from the class 1 into Mexico. Indeed it turned out the problems getting the cars and commodities cleared to cross the border killed the project before it started.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
I will confess this is all hypothetical, just to get the discussion started. And I did find the replies interesting, to the point, and with ideas I had not thought of. I hope you found the mental exercies interesting as well.
+1 ....siting the place where a class 1 will actually switch it is important. (have seen more than one industry park claim to be rail switched, just to have a Cls 1 (and in one case, a regional) say "they ain't going there", for multiple reasons.)
Watched one regional in Carl's home state switch an industry out of pure ignorance in the last month that they should have just walked away from because of some stupidly extreme liabilities created by the shipper that claims to be a transportation expert (they really are rubber tired frauds, may yet find themselves in an unwanted news article)
The jist here is that the shipper needs to be dialed in on their responsibilities if they are going it alone w/o a reputable freight forwarder or consultant. (I deal often with those that should have known better, but were either blinded by the balance sheet (managerial failure) or in over their head(s). A lot of the complaints from shippers about railroads are not the railroads' issue at all.
Edit: responding to CShaverR's post
I'll vote for the shortline, too. You have the potential for buying the pellets in "bulk" (ie, multiple carloads - maybe a month's worth or more at a time) and having the shortline store them for you (as chutton suggests), if the details can be worked out.
As has also been suggested, shipping the finished product out by rail is less of an option unless you are shipping all of your product (or at least carload quantities) to a single vendor. A contract with a major wholesaler or retailer who can take loads by rail might make this possible.
Containers were mentioned. If you're close enough to a container facility, and would ship in container-sized quantities, this might be an option. This would involve some trucks - between your facility and the container yard and then to the end receiver.
The shortline I'm familiar with serves as sort of an aggregator (as do many). The Class 1 makes drops and pickups on a fairly regular basis, and those transactions generally involve 6-20 cars.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
I think your best location would be in an industrial park, or appropriately adjacent to a terminal on a Class 1 railroad. It's bound to be switched daily, though you may have to assign someone to stick around for a late-evening spot/pull.I'd also forget about rail for shipping out your finished product, unless you can assure yourself of consignees who will be willing to receive them in carload quantities. Containerization? To me that says "trucks" at both ends of the trail.But covered hoppers for plastics, even at one per week, is doable in an area where other industries are being switched as well. And in that case, the size of the railroad doesn't matter. Keep in mind that I'm speaking from an operational standpoint, and know that such places exist. The paper trail, or whatever it's called nowadays, may exert influences on you that I haven't even thought of.
I'm going to partially agree Ulrich in terms of your plant shipping product out by rail not really that viable due to the nature of the product and market.It's likely the furniture would go by truck as the volume you described seems to be low. Possibly by container for longer distance, if the ecomonics work out that could be sent from an intermodal yard.OTOH, receiving plastic pellets via rail is pretty common, particularly if your plant gets two or more cars at a time. Also the company might be able to use hoppers as temporary storage, if they can work out a deal to avoid demurrage charges with the cars' owner (assuming not a railroad owned car, but a private-owner car).BTW, the presumption is this is modern era (1980s and later). If you are talking about the 1960s (the golden era of unabashed plastic furniture), it's possible that the furniture would be shipped via boxcar.
The economies of rail would be severely offset by your lack of volume and the added expense of a siding and switching charges. In your scenario you'd be best off to forget about rail altogether and hire a good freight broker. Most likely shipments would go by truck.. depending on where shipments go and where your plant is located, rates would not necessarily be higher than rail. Moreover, I would assume you have competitors.. you'd want to get your product out to your customers in one to three days (like your competitors do)... not two to three weeks.
Class I's tend to prefer large volume customers such as intermodal terminals, large scale coal mines, etc over smaller customers. Short-lines/regionals, due to their respective sizes, usually do not have those kinds of customers and must focus on the customers they do have including the customers who generate small volumes. Bottom line operating unit trains require a lot less resources (labor, etc.) and generates a larger profit margin than switching locals and mixed consists.
You would probably get better service in terms of switching and car spotting with a shortline/regional becuase that kind of business is their bread and butter. In addition, the management will be located a lot closer and have a better understanding of the local business environment than a Class I.
However, keep in mind, once the carload reaches the Class I, your depending them to handle the car and not the shortline/regional.
Assume I am a new plastic furniture manufacturer. I will be receiving pellets of plastic in covered hopper cars and shipping completed chairs and tables. etc., n box cars or containers. I don't want the hassle of hiring my own truck drivers and leasing my own trucks, and prefer the economies of rail transportation.
Initially, I expect to unload one covered hopper car a week and ship to box-car loads a week. But the plant will be built with the capacity to ramp up to six hopper cars a week, with shipping twelve bocx-car loads a week.
I will pay for the installation of a siding.
I will be shipping to wearhouses all over North America.
Am I better off locataing on a short-line or regional possibly one with connection to more than one Class Is, or locating on a Class I.
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