K. P. Harrier From your figures, that San Diego MTS operating loss is astounding! I would venture to say the books are balanced and there is no shortfall. Federal grants and operating subsidies often make up the difference.
From your figures, that San Diego MTS operating loss is astounding!
I would venture to say the books are balanced and there is no shortfall. Federal grants and operating subsidies often make up the difference.
The figures for MTS and SD&AE show the relative importance of SD&AE for its owner. MTS bought the SD&AE in 1979.
The MTS books are balanced by inflows from the federal, state and local governments.
The MTS has a relatively high fare box recovery rate. In FY14 the system recovered 41.1 per cent of its operating costs from the fares. The SD Trolley recovered 56.5 per cent of its operating costs in FY14.
Several years ago I did a comparison of the light rail farebox recovery rate for the Dallas, Charlotte, and Portland light rail systems. If I remember correctly San Diego had the highest farebox recover rate of the bunch.
He may have been thinking of Ensenada, which does have a reasonable port and is close enough to the border that the connecting rail line would be feasible.
CMStPnP Build down Baja California to Cabo San Lucas (Pacific Port)
Build down Baja California to Cabo San Lucas (Pacific Port)
Cabo San Lucas is a terrible location to build a port. It's at the tip of the Baja California Peninsula and is separated from the rest of Mexico by the Sea of Cortez. As far as Mexico is concerned, it might as well be on an island. It's also almost 800 miles to the US/Mexico border.
CMStPnP Rebuild from El Centro to Yuma...
Rebuild from El Centro to Yuma...
The line was never built between El Centro and Yuma, so it would not be a case of "rebuilding" it. El Centro was the furthest east the line ever reached, even though Yuma was their original destination and is why Arizona is part of the line's title.
Sam1 LNER4472 Correction:It's San Diego AND Arizona Eastern, not "San Diego, Arizona, & Eastern": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego_and_Arizona_Eastern_Railway The railway is owned by San Diego Metropolitan Transit System (MTS). In the Table of Contents and Supplementary Information Schedule of the 2014 MTS Annual Report, it is the San Diego & Arizona Eastern Railway. Throughout most of the report, however, it is the San Diego and Arizona Eastern Railway Company (SD&AE). The Schedule of Revenues, Expenses and Changes in Net Position for the Railway is titled San Diego and Arizona Eastern Railway. For the year ended June 30, 2014, the railway had operating revenues of $1,249,855 and operating expenses of $201,593, resulting in an operating profit for MTS of $1,048,262. MTS had operating revenues of $104,425,481 and operating expenses of $343,566,429, resulting in an operating loss of $239,140,148.
LNER4472 Correction:It's San Diego AND Arizona Eastern, not "San Diego, Arizona, & Eastern": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego_and_Arizona_Eastern_Railway
Correction:It's San Diego AND Arizona Eastern, not "San Diego, Arizona, & Eastern":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego_and_Arizona_Eastern_Railway
The railway is owned by San Diego Metropolitan Transit System (MTS).
In the Table of Contents and Supplementary Information Schedule of the 2014 MTS Annual Report, it is the San Diego & Arizona Eastern Railway. Throughout most of the report, however, it is the San Diego and Arizona Eastern Railway Company (SD&AE).
The Schedule of Revenues, Expenses and Changes in Net Position for the Railway is titled San Diego and Arizona Eastern Railway.
For the year ended June 30, 2014, the railway had operating revenues of $1,249,855 and operating expenses of $201,593, resulting in an operating profit for MTS of $1,048,262.
MTS had operating revenues of $104,425,481 and operating expenses of $343,566,429, resulting in an operating loss of $239,140,148.
Sam1 (3-13):
Take care,
K.P.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- K.P.’s absolute “theorem” from early, early childhood that he has seen over and over and over again: Those that CAUSE a problem in the first place will act the most violently if questioned or exposed.
blue streak 1 And the beat goes on and the beat goes on. http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2015/mar/11/ticker-donald-stoecklein-trouble-sec/
And the beat goes on and the beat goes on.
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2015/mar/11/ticker-donald-stoecklein-trouble-sec/
You would think someone would be able to break the cycle of corruption that plagues this line.
You know what I think would be really cool but I realize it is dreamland with the capital costs involved plus you would need an agreement with Mexico probably. Rebuild from El Centro to Yuma. Obtain Trackage rights from El Centro to Mexicali, MX and Puerto Pensco, Hermosillo and Guaymas (Pacific Port). Fix the El Centro to San Diego line including clearance and straightening curves, trackage rights or line build San Diego to LA. Build down Baja California to Cabo San Lucas (Pacific Port) Put all those lines under one railroad operation.
According to 'multiple sources', the FBI and IRS have started to investigate the PIR investors: http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2015/feb/07/rail-partners-face-federal-inquiry/
Hopefully they will audit the MTS books AND the bank accounts of the MTS executives involved with this lease. Follow the money .....
Links to my Google Maps ---> Sunset Route overview, SoCal metro, Yuma sub, Gila sub, SR east of Tucson, BNSF Northern Transcon and Southern Transcon *** Why you should support Ukraine! ***
blue streak 1 Mystery investor takes over. A scrap dealer? Mexican law may allow shady items not available in the USA. http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2015/jan/28/mystery-investors-take-over-desert-line/ More requests from councilman http://www.utsandiego.com/documents/2015/jan/28/alvarez-letter-demanding-pir-audit/
Mystery investor takes over. A scrap dealer? Mexican law may allow shady items not available in the USA.
http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2015/jan/28/mystery-investors-take-over-desert-line/
More requests from councilman
http://www.utsandiego.com/documents/2015/jan/28/alvarez-letter-demanding-pir-audit/
From just reading the events laid out in this Forum referencing some of the 'shenanigans' that have swirled around this railroad (SD&AE); one on the outside, could only predict that there will be more as this deal progresses(?)
You only have to recall the 'events and deals' from about 2002/2003 and the ups and downs of the arrangement between the Mexican Government and other Mexican railroads as the management of the KCSRR attempted to put together the acquisition of operations of the Mexican railroad TFM. somewhat revealed in this linked story from that time period: @ http://www.thefreelibrary.com/MEXICAN+TRANSPORTATION+COMPANY+RESCINDS+SALE+OF+RAILROAD+UNIT+TO...-a0106954518
After all, one of our posters here once commented (paraphrased(?): " Successful railroads are political... (first),and operational (second)..? " THe PIR seems bound up in its own politics and then finances, and its operations could go any way ( Operated or scrapped ); it will be an interesting story to follow, as the SD&AE seems to balance on that 'razor blade' between success and failure.
blue streak 1Mystery investor takes over. A scrap dealer? Mexican law may allow shady items not available in the USA.
No, no, no! It's all good!
It's a front for the same Chinese company that is building the new high-speed train from Beijing to Moscow. They plan to extend that line around the world and this is just part of that plan. Warrent Buffet (big on railroads) and Jack Ma (of Alibaba) are two of the five investors and Carl Di Maio is likely to be their front man when the news breaks on Voice of San Diego next week.
efftenxrfe LNER4472, Your correction? "not San Diego, Arizona and Eastern" Absolutely correct; who are you correcting? I am the last operating department officer of the SD&AE, at best under SPT auspices. You're not correcting me, are you?
LNER4472, Your correction?
"not San Diego, Arizona and Eastern" Absolutely correct; who are you correcting?
I am the last operating department officer of the SD&AE, at best under SPT auspices. You're not correcting me, are you?
Probably correcting the OP's subject line. You probably remember the Union Ice company, then, and the icing tracks on the east side of the yard. I don't remember if they were still icing reefers in the 1960 time frame, but the tracks and structures were still there then, if I remember correctly.
Or where-ever the UP's junction (paraphrased) was.
Plaster City is now correct.
Some heritage for you and us: at completion, around 1920 the railroad terminated at El Centro. Traditionally that never changed; connections with the rest of the world, could be from there, north to Niland, southeast or northwest on the SP Mainline, or...
It could be south to Mexicali, next, to Calexico in Baja, from there to the Inter-California RR, straddling the border to Yuma.
The Inter-Cal diverged from the Sonora-Baja California which drew a bead on Benjamin Hill on the FCP, south of Nogales.
When I got there, 1958, the connection was called the "Sidewinder," a train from and to Yuma northeast to Niland then south to El Centro, where the SD&A took most of it to San Diego.
Yes, not SD&E. San Diego and Arizona. Became the San Diego and Arizona Eastern, but later.
Side-winder.....if you're walking on desert sand on the Baja Border and what looks like a sand 10-inch doughnut....There's a lethal fast moving sidewinder-rattle snake in there.
Side-winders, they move sort of sideways in a looping W-shaped path.
They're fast. They're lethal.
I agree with you. But it would be a big undertaking because at least one tunnel on the line has collapsed and has to be rebuilt. The railroad museum in Campo used to offer train rides to Tecate along with tours of the local brewery. However, this ended after the tunnel was taken out of action.
CMStPnP whereever their connection is to Union Pacific.
That would be Plaster City at this point.
Well I came upon a decent youtube video of a SD&E F7 running backwards through Carizzo Gorge....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYt91UpxH6U
Sad to read about all the other political machinations and corrupt schemes about the railroad that you can Google yourselves of late. Hopefully someday the rail line will be restored back to decent speeds and as one operating entity between San Diego, CA and Yuma, Az or whereever their connection is to Union Pacific.
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.